Another T-Amp Kit

[Tricky Micky]

...looks good value...think I'll be ordering one of these in the next few weeks...

www.diyparadise.com/charlize.html

Includes Elna Cerafine input caps and Rubycon "Super Low ESR" power supply caps...all for $80...built...!!!

 

[Nuuk]

Interesting! They're springing up llke daisies all ove rthe place!

 

[JWFokker]

Nice. The use of Cerafine caps and low ESR power caps looks good. I think I might pick one up, considering I was just going to load the Amp6 up with Cerafines once it became available.

 

[kanaddict]

Interesting! They're springing up llke daisies all ove rthe place!

Yes,

It's a good thing, but at the same time it just give me some hard time. I was already strugling with myself when trying to make a decision between 41hz kit and autoconstruire kit, now there is a tird possibility ........

 

[sx881663]

new kit

Daniel,
This new kit looks good except for the output inductor. I am still suspicious of kits using through hole parts. The added inductance can be a real problem. I have a good friend doing one of the 41Hz kits with this chip. I did most all the surface mount stuff for him as he did not have the proper soldering equipment. Watching me then using my tools he had no trouble doing a few of them himself. If he can do it most anyone could as well. The main trick is to only anchor one end of the component till you have it aligned to the pads.
Don’t let the surface mount stuff scare you off from a very good kit.
Roger

 

[kanaddict]

Re: new kit

Daniel,
This new kit looks good except for the output inductor. I am still suspicious of kits using through hole parts. The added inductance can be a real problem. I have a good friend doing one of the 41Hz kits with this chip. I did most all the surface mount stuff for him as he did not have the proper soldering equipment. Watching me then using my tools he had no trouble doing a few of them himself. If he can do it most anyone could as well. The main trick is to only anchor one end of the component till you have it aligned to the pads.
Don’t let the surface mount stuff scare you off from a very good kit.
Roger

Roger,

thanks for sharing your experience. Your comment about the new kit inductors is very interesting. This is the kind of thing I'm not able to see by myself.

Yes, surface mount is part of the problem, but it's not only because I'm scared by how little are the parts. It's also because I don't have a proper soldering Iron (25W).

Your not the first to mention that it's better to use surfacemount parts. But, we got a few positive review of the autoconstruire kit and 41Hz will soon offer a kit using through hole parts. I would love that someone make a comparative listening of all these kit !

You have a good knowledge of this kind of amp, I would like to know if there is possible problem related to the use of a quality switched power supply ? Any possible dommage to the amp ?
I don't know much about this kind of Power supply and I bought one on ebay yesterday.

Thanks !

 

[Nuuk]

Daniel,

I am about a quarter of the the way through building an AMP-3 kit and I have to say it is not something that I ever want to repeat. It's just too fiddly and time consuming!

OK, I accept that shortest signal paths mean SMD but there is SMD and SMD and if something is sold as a kit to be soldered up at home, it is a bit daft using the very smallest SMD components. I guess 41Hz have realised this and that's why they are now offering the non-SMD versions.

I hope it is worth all the effort because the Autostriure amp is VERY good, despite not using SMD parts.

I have also used an SMPS with both the Autostriure amp and SI T-AMP without any ill-effects. In fact, I think it is the best PSU that I have used with both the class D amps and the Gainclones.

 

[sx881663]

amp questions

Daniel,
I will try to address all your questions. Comparing amps won’t mean much if they don’t have basically the same parts. I feel the air core inductors and better output filter caps give the autoconstruire an unfair advantage. If the 41Hz had the same parts I think it would show its advantages of surface mount parts and short signal paths very well.
If you are into the DIY thing and plan on doing much building you need to buy a decent soldering station. A used Metcal station from eBay would be less than the new price of others and would be better. The tip is much closer to the handle and gives you better control. Also the lower heat is less likely to damage anything. This is possible because the heating element is right on the tip and don’t waste much power back into the handle. Also the temperature is very closely controlled and more power is supplied as needed to maintain the temperature. Once you have used one you won’t go back!
Ah, switch mode supplies, a favorite subject of mine. Most of the ones I have checked out are adjustable or can made so easily. I feel they are considerably superior to all but the best linear supplies. The reasons are many but the main one is lack of noise in the audio band. This means deeper sound stages and things within it are more in focus. The excellent regulation most have means solid and tuneful bass. The only thing about then is that they don’t have much energy storage at the output. What I do and recommend is a large buffer cap on the output between it and the amp. I have used 10,000-33,000uf @ 16v to good effect. I don’t know how much is needed for good bass as I use a sub in my system.
Roger

 

[Nuuk]

The reasons are many but the main one is lack of noise in the audio band. This means deeper sound stages and things within it are more in focus. The excellent regulation most have means solid and tuneful bass. The only thing about then is that they don’t have much energy storage at the output. What I do and recommend is a large buffer cap on the output between it and the amp. I have used 10,000-33,000uf @ 16v to good effect.

I'll second all that Roger. I'm using the Class D amps in my second system sans subwoofer and I can tell you that with a 10K cap on the output of the SMPS, there is plenty of bass!

 

[jkeny]

Would a cold heat soldering iron (JML as seen on TV) work well with smd parts using a fine tip?

John

http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=95439&catid=9830&aid=336064&aparam=xsp205392

 

[jkeny]

I have acouple of ERO caps 10,000uF I pulled out of a facit electronic typewriter. Only probelem (and advantage) is they are four ole ould body help describing how one could be connected at output of SMPS feeding t-amp?

John

 

[sx881663]

I have acouple of ERO caps 10,000uF I pulled out of a facit electronic typewriter. Only probelem (and advantage) is they are four ole ould body help describing how one could be connected at output of SMPS feeding t-amp?

John

John,
See attached drawing.
Roger

 

[sx881663]

Would a cold heat soldering iron (JML as seen on TV) work well with smd parts using a fine tip?

John

http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=95439&catid=9830&aid=336064&aparam=xsp205392

John,
I have seen those ads too. It would be a cheap way out if they have enough power. Try it and let us know.
Roger

 

[kanaddict]

Re: amp questions

Daniel,
I will try to address all your questions. Comparing amps won’t mean much if they don’t have basically the same parts. I feel the air core inductors and better output filter caps give the autoconstruire an unfair advantage. If the 41Hz had the same parts I think it would show its advantages of surface mount parts and short signal paths very well.

I understand your point. If someone want to upgrade the kit, then the 41Hz is the way to go (according to what youmentionned). If someone just want ot buy a kit and us it as it is, then the autoconstruire kit make sence.

If you are into the DIY thing and plan on doing much building you need to buy a decent soldering station.

Well, I'm into DIY thing but my passion is more speakers oriented. I like woodworking and building speakers is something I have fun to do. I have built a microphone pream (Walling) and BrianGT NIGC, but that's it. I have tryed to change the input cap of a SI T-amp, but I "fry" the chip (one channel). So, my electronic experiences are limited and I don't have a good record with SM parts

Ah, switch mode supplies, a favorite subject of mine. Most of the ones I have checked out are adjustable or can made so easily. I feel they are considerably superior to all but the best linear supplies. The reasons are many but the main one is lack of noise in the audio band. This means deeper sound stages and things within it are more in focus. The excellent regulation most have means solid and tuneful bass.

Great to read that ! I decided to buy a second one for a second amp to be build. I have bought 2 power supply but no kit yet

The only thing about then is that they don’t have much energy storage at the output. What I do and recommend is a large buffer cap on the output between it and the amp. I have used 10,000-33,000uf @ 16v to good effect. I don’t know how much is needed for good bass as I use a sub in my system.
Roger

I'll start to look for good 10,000 uf cap. If I find some but with more the 16v rating, is it ok to buy them ? I would think that this is not much of a problem as from my experience with x-over cap, a bigger v rating = better sound.

Thanks a lot, your comments are very helpfull !

 

[kanaddict]

Daniel,

I am about a quarter of the the way through building an AMP-3 kit and I have to say it is not something that I ever want to repeat. It's just too fiddly and time consuming!

You realy don't make me feel ready for this kit

OK, I accept that shortest signal paths mean SMD but there is SMD and SMD and if something is sold as a kit to be soldered up at home, it is a bit daft using the very smallest SMD components. I guess 41Hz have realised this and that's why they are now offering the non-SMD versions.

I hope it is worth all the effort because the Autostriure amp is VERY good, despite not using SMD parts.

I look forward, hopping that you'll make a big report of what you will hear. Do you upgrade the 41Hz kit or do you build it as it is ?

I have also used an SMPS with both the Autostriure amp and SI T-AMP without any ill-effects. In fact, I think it is the best PSU that I have used with both the class D amps and the Gainclones.

You just confirmed what Roger said. I'm anxioux to get the 2 power supply I ordered and see how well built they are. when the amp will be built, I'll compare these power supply to a $10 1.5 amp power supply I have. I want to hear the difference

Thanks !

 

[Nuuk]

I look forward, hopping that you'll make a big report of what you will hear. Do you upgrade the 41Hz kit or do you build it as it is ?

To begin with, I will be reviewing it as it comes.

I'll compare these power supply to a $10 1.5 amp power supply I have. I want to hear the difference

This is the only real way to find out about these issues! I have compared a cheapish plug-in supply, my LM338 regulated supply, a small SLA battery and the SMPS. That doesn't make me an expert but it does tell me which works best for me in my system.

 

[KT]

...I have also used an SMPS with both the Autostriure amp and SI T-AMP without any ill-effects. In fact, I think it is the best PSU that I have used with both the class D amps and the Gainclones.

Nuuk,

I'm very interested in your switching supply findings.

What switching mode supply are you using?

Have you found any major differences is SMPSs? What to look for when trying to choose one over the other, and what makes for good sonics in these?

Thanks,
KT

 

[DirkD]

Hi there

I really don't know what the fuss is about SMD components. It is not that hard to solder SMD components, and the 0805 parts supplied by 41HZ is more than big enough to solder well without any problems. Yes, you need a temp controlled soldering iron with fine tip, but if you are into DIY audio you should have one in any case. Try the Quick soldering stations if available in your country. It is an exact copy of the Hako for VERY little money. They are about $50 in South Africa. They have very fine tips and very efficient temp control.

Maybe I will do a Wiki on SMD soldering if there is enough interest.

Regards

Dirk

 

[Nuuk]

KT - I am no expert on SMPS and have only tried one, and that only because it was offered to me to try (I was a sceptic and wouldn't have bought one).

You can read about that one here .

 

[Nuuk]

I really don't know what the fuss is about SMD components.

Each to his own opinion and we all have skills that others may not have. Personally, spending five minutes just to get a single component out of its packaging is enough to put me off even before the damn thing decides to go any place except over those tiny pads!

All I am saying is that for a majority of diyers, ie those who don't work in electronics, I would not recommend that they try making something so intricate. As I said before, I think Jan at 41Hz has come to the same conclusion, hence his new kits!