........indeed.......
Before producing music an amp need to be build, and for that you need to manage a factory process with components sourcing. You don't have the same sourcing all the time depending of availability and price of components. Introduction of new technical features change the products too. And Engineers like to improve their products in time (for the best and the worst). Changes are not only focused on "sound quality", and can be to have better specs, better protection systems, a better reliability, correct minor problems, reduce production cost, to be in phase with new norms, etc. Plenty of reason.
This is a normal product life.
ps: I want my module back.
stef1777 said:
Before producing music an amp need to be build, and for that you need to manage a factory process with components sourcing. You don't have the same sourcing all the time depending of availability and price of components. Introduction of new technical features change the products too. And Engineers like to improve their products in time (for the best and the worst). Changes are not only focused on "sound quality", and can be to have better specs, better protection systems, a better reliability, correct minor problems, reduce production cost, to be in phase with new norms, etc. Plenty of reason.
This is a normal product life.
ps: I want my module back.
Ok, fine and good response, would be acceptible, but JP didnt say anything close to that!
Quite off-topic for a DIY post but...
I've impressed some people with UcD power, but they don't like the idea of building it.
Is there someone in the Benelux area building/reselling Hypex UcD based amps for a living? Strictly official I mean, no black market stuff
Germany and UK are OK also, as long as the transport costs aren't too high.
Answer using PM please, thanks.
I've impressed some people with UcD power, but they don't like the idea of building it.
Is there someone in the Benelux area building/reselling Hypex UcD based amps for a living? Strictly official I mean, no black market stuff
Germany and UK are OK also, as long as the transport costs aren't too high.
Answer using PM please, thanks.
Yves Smolders said:Quite off-topic for a DIY post but...
I've impressed some people with UcD power, but they don't like the idea of building it.
Is there someone in the Benelux area building/reselling Hypex UcD based amps for a living? Strictly official I mean, no black market stuff
Germany and UK are OK also, as long as the transport costs aren't too high.
Answer using PM please, thanks.
I've imppressed people recently as well with only 35 watts of class d power into a speaker that has an efficiency of 102db.
That's any class d though, where ucd impresses most is with the quality factor that seems to be a hard miss with it.
I wonder if there'd be a demand for building these as you speak of in North America.
Regards,
Chris
Has anyone been doing RMS power output measurements on the UcD's?
For my friends I was looking at preassembled UcD bases amps, and found them on diycable.com (adire audio) - they do custom jobs.
A more "dark" approach is taken by Hawk in the Netherlands. They also resell the UcD180 and UcD400 ST's but they quote 40/80W (8/4 ohms) for the 180 and 80/160 (8/4 ohms) for the 400.
Seems awful low power output compared to what they shoud be able to do. They must run them with low voltage on the rails.
I'd love to see real world rail voltage/power measurements if anyone did them! Thanks!
For my friends I was looking at preassembled UcD bases amps, and found them on diycable.com (adire audio) - they do custom jobs.
A more "dark" approach is taken by Hawk in the Netherlands. They also resell the UcD180 and UcD400 ST's but they quote 40/80W (8/4 ohms) for the 180 and 80/160 (8/4 ohms) for the 400.
Seems awful low power output compared to what they shoud be able to do. They must run them with low voltage on the rails.
I'd love to see real world rail voltage/power measurements if anyone did them! Thanks!
Hi Yves,
I built my amps based on the UCD180 with the following results:
Input AC voltage to the rectifier: 31 Volts*2, output of rectifier with 2*2 10,000 uF: 48Volts per rail
Mains Transformer: ILP, 2*32 Volts @3Amp
Output power into 8 Ohms: 110 Watts@ 1% THD
THD @ 10 Watts: 0.008% measured on a Nakamichi TS100 audio analyzer.
On a pair of Klipsch la Scala's (104db/1m/1W) they sound better than anything I've seen before, including Krell's
Cheers, Arthur.
I built my amps based on the UCD180 with the following results:
Input AC voltage to the rectifier: 31 Volts*2, output of rectifier with 2*2 10,000 uF: 48Volts per rail
Mains Transformer: ILP, 2*32 Volts @3Amp
Output power into 8 Ohms: 110 Watts@ 1% THD
THD @ 10 Watts: 0.008% measured on a Nakamichi TS100 audio analyzer.
On a pair of Klipsch la Scala's (104db/1m/1W) they sound better than anything I've seen before, including Krell's
Cheers, Arthur.
We, Hawk, are located in Belgium! We offer UcD modules as is. We also deliver amps complete including the power supply, the cabinet etc.
We have to do with several aspects:
- supply voltage has consequencies for the capacitors and the heat sinking. This all has a price.
- up to 23 VAC the electrolytics can be 35 Volt ones and cooling is not a problem with an aluminum back plate where the modules are mounted.
- from 25 up to 32 Volt the electrolytics should be specified at 50 Volts and a small heat sink does the job.
- at higher voltages the consumer price almost doubles.
So we choose a way by which we are certain the modules are run in a safe mode and expected life time is quite long at a "reasonable" price.
Our specifications (all of them) are "worst case" specs. In practice the measured output power is some 20% higher.
Have a look at http://www.hawkaudio.nl/classD.htm
@Johnrtd,
First, Thanks for your views on your commercial UcD amps!
Nice to hear you are located in Belgium! (Didn't realise that due to the .NL domain name)
Very interesting to see a commercial and "long-life" view to the creation of UcD amps. DIYers don't consider this, but of course you do.
So if price were not an issue you could go for 40V or 42V VAC and use 63V caps. I agree on large(r) heatsinks in that case, and those are indeed pricey.
Regardless of price, would you consider 42v supplies and 63v caps, using large heatsinks, as too close to the limit for comfort? Thanks for your opinion!
First, Thanks for your views on your commercial UcD amps!
Nice to hear you are located in Belgium! (Didn't realise that due to the .NL domain name)
Very interesting to see a commercial and "long-life" view to the creation of UcD amps. DIYers don't consider this, but of course you do.
So if price were not an issue you could go for 40V or 42V VAC and use 63V caps. I agree on large(r) heatsinks in that case, and those are indeed pricey.
Regardless of price, would you consider 42v supplies and 63v caps, using large heatsinks, as too close to the limit for comfort? Thanks for your opinion!
Depends on the country where you use them. I use 40V torroids in the UK, but this rectifies to north of 60v in practice...
I think in the uk we have 240-250v mains, which complies with the euro regs that it should be 230v due to the fact that the spec allows significant deviation from the spec...
Ed W
I think in the uk we have 240-250v mains, which complies with the euro regs that it should be 230v due to the fact that the spec allows significant deviation from the spec...
Ed W
HI All,
Power supply:
Very simple bridge rectifier with input of an ILP toroid transformer: input 230 Volts, output 2 * 30 Volts @3 Amp. It is important to go NO higher than that, as the DC voltage wil be close to the maximum rating of the rail voltage of the UCD.
Capacitors: 20,000 uF/63 Volts/rail, I used in total 4 * 10,000 uF on a small pCB, it looks very much like the design of the Hypex Power supply, but I built mine first....
The trick with power supplies is to overdimension them, as I did. Even with an efficiency of over 80% for the UCD there is a lot to be gained by the power supply being able to deliver 200VA/UCD.
The result is a very open and "loose" soundstage.
The other question: I have the "normal" UCD's not the ones with the AD8620, I haven't been able to hear the difference, because when I built mine, the AD8620 version was not available, and I'm happy with mine.
The next project will probably be a UCD400, but the Klipsch is going to be maybe TDL then...
Power supply:
Very simple bridge rectifier with input of an ILP toroid transformer: input 230 Volts, output 2 * 30 Volts @3 Amp. It is important to go NO higher than that, as the DC voltage wil be close to the maximum rating of the rail voltage of the UCD.
Capacitors: 20,000 uF/63 Volts/rail, I used in total 4 * 10,000 uF on a small pCB, it looks very much like the design of the Hypex Power supply, but I built mine first....
The trick with power supplies is to overdimension them, as I did. Even with an efficiency of over 80% for the UCD there is a lot to be gained by the power supply being able to deliver 200VA/UCD.
The result is a very open and "loose" soundstage.
The other question: I have the "normal" UCD's not the ones with the AD8620, I haven't been able to hear the difference, because when I built mine, the AD8620 version was not available, and I'm happy with mine.
The next project will probably be a UCD400, but the Klipsch is going to be maybe TDL then...
Hi Arty123,
I'm going a little more high end myself.
31Vac secondaries from plitron, 500VA for the tighter load regulation, IXYS FRED 60A X2 600Vdc rectifiers coupled directly to Jensen four pole electrolytics, I only haven't yet decided weither or not to go for 10 000uF @80V (so they can be used with a 400 too) or the obviously better 15 000uF @ 63Vdc. They don't cost much more than elna cerafines and less than half of a black gate.
I'm aiming for a very tight, clean and dynamic soundstage and I think the above is a good start.
Cheers,
Chris
I'm going a little more high end myself.
31Vac secondaries from plitron, 500VA for the tighter load regulation, IXYS FRED 60A X2 600Vdc rectifiers coupled directly to Jensen four pole electrolytics, I only haven't yet decided weither or not to go for 10 000uF @80V (so they can be used with a 400 too) or the obviously better 15 000uF @ 63Vdc. They don't cost much more than elna cerafines and less than half of a black gate.
I'm aiming for a very tight, clean and dynamic soundstage and I think the above is a good start.
Cheers,
Chris
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