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Class D Switching Power Amplifiers and Power D/A conversion

help me choose, SMSL Q5 Pro or SMSL SA-50 plus
help me choose, SMSL Q5 Pro or SMSL SA-50 plus
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Old 24th June 2017, 05:46 AM   #31
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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help me choose, SMSL Q5 Pro or SMSL SA-50 plus
Okay, I see now you meant a Class D or Class T setup.
The T/D setup thing threw me off.
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Old 25th June 2017, 12:20 AM   #32
vinyl tap is offline vinyl tap  United States
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Originally Posted by Konzentr8 View Post
I have lots
Me too Thanks for talking about your equipment setups. I like to tinker too & this gives me lots of places to research. That Fatman SS seems like something I would've liked. I think your hunch is right, those specs look class D. It has better build (air vents hopefully help?) & better tone controls. Honestly having been thru these amps I don't mind the Lepai's cheap build now. I never heard of simple transmission lines & the resistor for tweeter in lieu of crossover either. Got more learning ahead.

Besides my Veritas 1.8 towers, I'm using clearance Insignia speakers for a computer. < $80? Check. Woven graphite woofers? check. A tweeter where dust cap is for phase alignment? check.

Irribeo going thru that many tubes in 5 months doesnt seem right. I have guitars tube amps that are overdriven-overdriven for distortion and they don't fail at all. that's pretty poor design especially if they charged premium.

I'd say skip the 2020TI unless you really need more volume. It has better bass & sounds similar to the A+. You can almost hear the richness but it doesn't arrive. I'd rather pay more for a used A+ which are going for $40 used (almost double, gasp!) on FeeBay. LOL, the Lepai rare commodity. Funny story I exchanged the TI for an A+ with my brother.

btw, no need to answer if the Q5 pro sounds good cos I forgot the Lepai & tubepre system hasn't been reconnected. FeeBay has 'em for $65.99 to US (with 2 more at this price) so I just had to get one. It has 7 modes & I'm hoping one will sound close to the tripath. The breeze & possibly my tda7498 are going to friends. This is slow boat but I will report back.
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Old 25th June 2017, 10:00 AM   #33
irribeo is offline irribeo  Netherlands
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I don't know, I seem to read English differently and write differently too.
All Fatman's lasted a couple of days (not 5 months). 5 broke down within same month (total stock was 5 units). They couldn't directly be replaced after that, none were sold during that month. Units on display can be used by visitors, switched on/off, listened to.
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Old 25th June 2017, 10:28 AM   #34
Konzentr8 is offline Konzentr8  United Kingdom
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This is why i never buy ex - display/demo stock
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Old 25th June 2017, 12:14 PM   #35
Konzentr8 is offline Konzentr8  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinyl tap View Post
Me too Thanks for talking about your equipment setups. I like to tinker too & this gives me lots of places to research. That Fatman SS seems like something I would've liked. I think your hunch is right, those specs look class D. It has better build (air vents hopefully help?) & better tone controls. Honestly having been thru these amps I don't mind the Lepai's cheap build now. I never heard of simple transmission lines & the resistor for tweeter in lieu of crossover either. Got more learning ahead.

Besides my Veritas 1.8 towers, I'm using clearance Insignia speakers for a computer. < $80? Check. Woven graphite woofers? check. A tweeter where dust cap is for phase alignment? check.
The main failing of the Fatman is the use of rotary encoders for the volume and tone controls, i've had a few issues where the volume was increasing or decreasing inconsistently.
I posted a few questions about it on the forum and it's a common issue for this type of encoder and i have to make sure i turn the volume at a steady speed to prevent it.
To be honest had i known it used this type of control in advance i would never have bought it but once i'd got it the actual sound it produced prevented me sending it back and to be fair the seller offered a replacement unit if needed .
They're still on Amazon uk so might be worth a look on Amazon com if you fancy one.
Worldwide voltage compatible too , switchable on the back .

Those speakers of yours are co-ax , like car speakers , the idea being to get the sound originating from a single point source .
The theorys good but it's a very difficult design to implement for critical hi-fi use as by nature it introduces it's own issues such as the sounds from the drivers reaching your ears at different times.
Theres a company over there , CEentrance that sell a small model called the Masterclass 2504 that i 'd love to try with an Amptastic Mini 1 but impossible to source a pair here .

Transmission Line or TL designs use a series of channels or slots inside the cabinet which guides and tunes the airflow allowing the speaker to produce more bass than a normal box of the same size .

The lack of a X over in multi driver speakers generally means the type of design you get with mass market all in one type hi fi systems , the signal goes direct to the woofer then the other drivers are linked in series with resistors providing the cut off frequencys .

The Scythes i have use a full range driver fed directly from the terminals then the tweeter is linked as above .
There is then the issue of overlap , both drivers producing the same frequencies at certain points as the ' woofer ' being ' full range ' produces treble and not just bass .
Theres no markings on the resistor in the Scythes but from it seems to be set quite high up the range almost all the sound comes from the main driver , the HF unit only chiming in occasionally.
On paper this sounds terrible but like the Lapai amps it's one of those rare products that exceeds expectations and performs well above it's pay grade .

Finally if you enjoy the Tripath sound, one linked to a decent set of single driver full range 6 ohm speakers is the ideal match according to many enthusiasts ...i' m working on it
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Last edited by Konzentr8; 25th June 2017 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 27th June 2017, 03:30 AM   #36
vinyl tap is offline vinyl tap  United States
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oh gosh, I got 4 sets of speakers in the house I prob shouldn't add anymore :P But thanks for the tip. It's been fun matching amps to speakers. I didn't know about 6ohm speakers, just the 4 ohm car, 8 ohm home, and my 16 ohm Celestion Vintage 30's for guitar (parallel wired for an 8 ohm load) . My QLN model One's from high school days sound very neutral so I have the DEAFidelity AV380 on that. I can't say enough good things about that amp. I think the Nobsound MS-10 mk(x) is similar but bizarrely incorporates power tubes even tho it's transistor output. The AV380 uses tube rectification, preamp tubes, and transistor output, quite bizarre too and I think the rectifiers are more for show. Sorry I sound like they're paying me but I guarantee I have nothing to do with them.

I've had the Lepais (or is Lepai already plural like Elvii?) on various speakers and can confirm what I've read: ironically the cheap Lepai matches best with expensive & sensitive tower speakers. In this case, my 1.8s have good bass & treble response. My thinking process was trying to get a better TA2020 chipped amp just to visually match it. It makes sense to eventually get something nicer like a tube pre & an amptastic or for easier logistics a SMSL Amp-03 or Muse Ex2...something with better "guts", although I can't hear the dirt cheap components in the Lepai :0. I guess I need to read up on audiophile grade capacitors, resistors (they resist current at higher quality lol?), inductors, etc. In the end I'm not inclined or interested in all the technical aspects. There's some seriously smart people on this site building & modifying amps.

Irribeo, your English is clear I just jumbled the info my head. I forgot all my high school French so could only bet Cent (100 euros) at the Aviation Club

Copy that on co-axial. Had brain cramp & forgot terminology. In live music we use a BBE sound processor that I think delays the treble frequencies for phase alignment with the bass. It makes sound much more intelligible. At low volume the effect is unnatural so you're right, I supposed it's harder to implement correctly.

Copy that on TL, I'm very familiar with the concept, just didn't know the term as well.

Oh a tid bit about Mike Elliot of Counterpoint. When he saw me with the busted amp, instead of apologizing or inquiring about it, he said a random quip and went away. I guess he was defensive about his pride & joy but suffice he's not the most genial guy.
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Old 27th June 2017, 09:37 AM   #37
Konzentr8 is offline Konzentr8  United Kingdom
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Don't get a Nobsound it's a generic hybrid amp mass produced in some obscure Chinese factory sold by the container load to various companies who then stick their own ' brand ' name on it , Koda, Madisound, Nobsound and Intimidation are just a few there are many more.
It's badly built , the valves are little more than light bulbs , the transformer housing is empty ( it's got a small psu inside ) and is just a basic transistor design that cashs in on the trend for retro / nostalgic gear favoured by hipsters and ' enthusiasts ' of the sort that think that speaker ratings equal power output.
Theres loads of videos on You Tube including stripdowns and many tube ' rolling ' ones where people are replacing the stock valves with ones that cost more than the amp and raving about the increased transparency etc. , if only they took a look inside, avoid .

With regard to 6 ohm / Tripath , in general with many Tripath amps as the speaker impedence rises so does the high frequency output resulting in either to much (8 ohm) or not enough (4 ohm) , a nominal 6 ohm load is often considered to give the best balance .
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Old 18th July 2017, 12:13 AM   #38
vinyl tap is offline vinyl tap  United States
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Default got the SMSL Q5-Pro

Hi everyone, just wanted to update those still interested in this thread. I got the SMSL-Q5 Pro 4 days ago, and my impression is 1) It's got the "spacious" sound - although it doesnt sound as immersive as the Lepai. It sounds like a 1 or 2mm second delay b/w left & right channels vs a"3D ambience" (yes that's a technical term ) of the Lepai. 2) the bass is way stronger 3) As another poster said, it is very revealing. Jazz, blues or acoustic will sound fantastic & open. But anything modern like dance, especially if mastered w exaggerated treble and treble for dogs is not pleasant. For the computer, I've downloaded a VST wrapper & a free tube/tape simulator plug in for winamp which can help in these instances. For my Sony CD player, the optical connection sounds less sibilant than the analog. I can imagine this type of sound being perfect in a 5.1 or 7.1 setup.
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Old 19th July 2017, 08:52 AM   #39
Konzentr8 is offline Konzentr8  United Kingdom
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So the question is then James .... is it a ' keeper ' or do i detect more ' toys ' on the horizon?
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Old 19th July 2017, 09:00 PM   #40
vinyl tap is offline vinyl tap  United States
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It's a keeper! Got it hooked up to a Sony 300 disc cd player & tv. Just rewatched Titanic last night & never knew it sounded so good! Super spacious & dynamic sound. Super clear dialog. Has a nice remote & was able to fiddle volume, bass & treble on the fly, can't do that w the Lepai. I highly recommended this sir.
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