"So if you're saying the real world RMS rating of that driver is around 500w, it sounds like a good match......?"
Difficult to say, about 60Vrms continuous per speaker was as far as I went up with my XTI6002, my gut feeling says it could maybe eat a little more power, but then - I like to be on the safe side. So, I guess, ~600W continuous RMS is what it can take - not much more.
For the XTI6002, this a cakewalk - it can sustain ~96Vrms per channel even into 4 Ohms (!) This amp is awesome.
Difficult to say, about 60Vrms continuous per speaker was as far as I went up with my XTI6002, my gut feeling says it could maybe eat a little more power, but then - I like to be on the safe side. So, I guess, ~600W continuous RMS is what it can take - not much more.
For the XTI6002, this a cakewalk - it can sustain ~96Vrms per channel even into 4 Ohms (!) This amp is awesome.
I'm your wicked Uncle Ernie ...
I did some more "testing" tonight, playing The Who's "Tommy" at loud to really loud volumes. I don't have SPL readings, but if I am reading my no-fan NU6000 peak meters correctly, they are (low to high) 12, 190, 750, 3000 w/ch (4 ohm). My ancient, coal-burning Bose 901 II each is rated (per spec) at 270 wRMS/8 ohm and peak (<5 sec) of 400 w/8 ohm. I don't think it even got to "750" at all during my listening. Definitely, the NU6000 puts out more than enough for my little system
Now to find an attenuator besides the NU6000 knobs. Still untried is seeing if the NU6000 will "thermal" after extended period. So far, no problems with it standing on end on floor, looking at first glance like a skinny tower PC.
I did some more "testing" tonight, playing The Who's "Tommy" at loud to really loud volumes. I don't have SPL readings, but if I am reading my no-fan NU6000 peak meters correctly, they are (low to high) 12, 190, 750, 3000 w/ch (4 ohm). My ancient, coal-burning Bose 901 II each is rated (per spec) at 270 wRMS/8 ohm and peak (<5 sec) of 400 w/8 ohm. I don't think it even got to "750" at all during my listening. Definitely, the NU6000 puts out more than enough for my little system
Now to find an attenuator besides the NU6000 knobs. Still untried is seeing if the NU6000 will "thermal" after extended period. So far, no problems with it standing on end on floor, looking at first glance like a skinny tower PC.
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Behringer now shows the iNuke12000 (non-DSP) version on the product list, and added both the 12000DSP and non DSP to the brochure.
Like the other Non-DSP models, This has a crossover switch fixed at 100 Hz on the back, which can be very helpful still. (seen in the Picture below)
Other than that, we find out the real weight of it:
"NU12000DSP
Ultra-Lightweight, High-Density
12000-Watt Power Amplifier with
DSP Control and USB Interface
Delivers 2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms,
2 x 3000 Watts into 8 Ohms and
weighs less than 18 lbs / 8.2 kg"
The part where it says "2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms, and 2 x 3000 Watts into 8 Ohms" conflicts with the power ratings on the back of the unit [in the 3D render] Seen below:
Here's a link to the brochure:
http://www.behringer.com/assets/NU1000_NU3000_NU6000_NU12000_NU1000DSP_NU3000DSP_NU6000DSP_NU12000DSP_WebBrochure.pdf
iNuke12000:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU12000.aspx
iNuke12000DSP:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU12000DSP.aspx
Like the other Non-DSP models, This has a crossover switch fixed at 100 Hz on the back, which can be very helpful still. (seen in the Picture below)
Other than that, we find out the real weight of it:
"NU12000DSP
Ultra-Lightweight, High-Density
12000-Watt Power Amplifier with
DSP Control and USB Interface
Delivers 2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms,
2 x 3000 Watts into 8 Ohms and
weighs less than 18 lbs / 8.2 kg"
The part where it says "2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms, and 2 x 3000 Watts into 8 Ohms" conflicts with the power ratings on the back of the unit [in the 3D render] Seen below:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Here's a link to the brochure:
http://www.behringer.com/assets/NU1000_NU3000_NU6000_NU12000_NU1000DSP_NU3000DSP_NU6000DSP_NU12000DSP_WebBrochure.pdf
iNuke12000:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU12000.aspx
iNuke12000DSP:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU12000DSP.aspx
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"My music listening is usually about 1m in front of the speakers between 100dB and 130dB for disco evening (would like to have more but is too expensive). Also, the fans would produce most noise in behind the rack, while I am usually in front. "
That was my usual listening habit up to about 2 weeks ago. For the months coming, that will not happen anymore soon ;-(. Since I had an accident with a cotton stick while cleaning my ears as usual (like you should never do!!), my tympanic memmbrane is torn as well as my middle ear inflammated (on one side). It hurted like hell so I wanted to cut off my head like of but finally decided to not do so.
Hope that I can enjoy listening to music at >100dB in stereo again some 4 - 8 months from now. Not sure if that is possible. Pray for me!
That was my usual listening habit up to about 2 weeks ago. For the months coming, that will not happen anymore soon ;-(. Since I had an accident with a cotton stick while cleaning my ears as usual (like you should never do!!), my tympanic memmbrane is torn as well as my middle ear inflammated (on one side). It hurted like hell so I wanted to cut off my head like of but finally decided to not do so.
Hope that I can enjoy listening to music at >100dB in stereo again some 4 - 8 months from now. Not sure if that is possible. Pray for me!
<sigh> As has been pointed out many *many* times, the "power rating" on the back is the mains power consumption required to be put there by the US regulators, and is measured -- as they specify -- at a fraction of full power, 1/8 IIRC. It's nothing to do with the "rms" or "peak" power output of an amplifier.
My mistake, I thought you were referring to the power rating on the mains input -- which is on all the lower power amps, but not this one...
A message from Behringer on this issue:
Dear All,
Thanks for your interest in the iNuke amplifier series. I have to apologize for a typo on the marketing feature list of NU12000DSP.
NU12000 technically is based around 4 amplifier modules, two pairs of which are internally working in a bridge mode configuration, already.
Hence, there is no further option for bridging channels and the minimal load impedance is 4 Ohms, each. We will immediately fix the web featurelist to correctly state:
2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms, 2 x 3,000 Watts into 8 Ohms
Sorry for the inconvenience, and I hope that makes sense to you.
Regards,
Jan Duwe
Assistant Manager Conceptual Engineering
MUSIC-GROUP Services EU
Going by the NU6000 specs (which have been confirmed on test) this will mean 2x4400Wrms into 4 ohms and 2x2200Wrms into 8 ohms.
Dear All,
Thanks for your interest in the iNuke amplifier series. I have to apologize for a typo on the marketing feature list of NU12000DSP.
NU12000 technically is based around 4 amplifier modules, two pairs of which are internally working in a bridge mode configuration, already.
Hence, there is no further option for bridging channels and the minimal load impedance is 4 Ohms, each. We will immediately fix the web featurelist to correctly state:
2 x 6000 Watts into 4 Ohms, 2 x 3,000 Watts into 8 Ohms
Sorry for the inconvenience, and I hope that makes sense to you.
Regards,
Jan Duwe
Assistant Manager Conceptual Engineering
MUSIC-GROUP Services EU
Going by the NU6000 specs (which have been confirmed on test) this will mean 2x4400Wrms into 4 ohms and 2x2200Wrms into 8 ohms.
The maximium ac power used/consumed is what the label refers to. Its how we know how many items can be put on the ac line without overloading it. For a power amp it is the ac power used at full rated output power. Note also that in USA, the VA or volts x amps is limited by wiring and circuit breaker to 120v x 15A (or 20A) = 1800W max from the wall before the circuit breaker trips... either on the equipment or the one feeding the equipment/amp from the home ac power entrance panel. 1800W continuous is the max that ANYthing can draw from the ac lines. So, obviously, 6000Watt (at 100% effeciency) isnt real Watts... its marketing Watts.
Thx-RNMarsh
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The power rating is for the reason you state (maximum number to be used on a circuit) but it's *not* at full rated amplifier power, it's at 1/8 power -- go and check ;-)
(which is why the NU3000 has a "mains power" rating of 350W, according to the back of the one sitting next to me)
The data sheet for the NU6000 says "2x3000W max, 2x 2200W rms". Tests have shown that it can keep this up for tens of seconds, by which time most speakers will have cooked -- and unless you're listening to sinewaves (why?) the power on music (even heavily compressed) won't even be this high.
If you want an amp to power an industrial shaker table with sinewaves for 24 hours don't buy one. If you want to play music through speakers they work just fine and do what they say in the spec.
You are confusing the output power test methods with UL electrical test methods.
In order to size the fuse, circuit breaker and wire guage in a home, standards exist for them. UL also will test, if submitted, the max current draw of an amplifier for both safety - heat, voltage, material etc. Only the max amount of 60hz current drawn is needed to be known for sizing of loads/capacity of electrical circuits. However, with some amp topologies 1/3 power generates the most heat -- which is something UL wants to know about also and what happens at max heat generated as well.
Take a look at QSC Audio for a list of their models 60Hz ac current draw at various amplifier power levels..... full power is, of course, the output power that draws the most ac line current and thus something UL would be interested in knowing.
We are probably talking about the same thing.... but it just seemed confusing as I read it and I hope I have made it less confusing. (?)
PS _ have submitted my designs and products made by others to UL so I am pretty sure what they made me go thru.... and there are also standards on audio power ratings - see IEC - but few adhear to those. If everyone does not adhere to standards then you cant compare power ratings... its apples to oranges.
Thx-RNMarsh
In order to size the fuse, circuit breaker and wire guage in a home, standards exist for them. UL also will test, if submitted, the max current draw of an amplifier for both safety - heat, voltage, material etc. Only the max amount of 60hz current drawn is needed to be known for sizing of loads/capacity of electrical circuits. However, with some amp topologies 1/3 power generates the most heat -- which is something UL wants to know about also and what happens at max heat generated as well.
Take a look at QSC Audio for a list of their models 60Hz ac current draw at various amplifier power levels..... full power is, of course, the output power that draws the most ac line current and thus something UL would be interested in knowing.
We are probably talking about the same thing.... but it just seemed confusing as I read it and I hope I have made it less confusing. (?)
PS _ have submitted my designs and products made by others to UL so I am pretty sure what they made me go thru.... and there are also standards on audio power ratings - see IEC - but few adhear to those. If everyone does not adhere to standards then you cant compare power ratings... its apples to oranges.
Thx-RNMarsh
The nu6000 has a power consumption rating of 620w based on 1/8th it's peak power draw of around 5000w, it's fused at 25a. I was running one off a ~2000w generator this weekend along with an adcom GFA-555, and was able to get the inuke's 4th light on.
It's true only for continuous output, which is not important for audio use.
Program material that clips on 6000 W peak will have average power well below 1800 W, which can be exceeded for many sec before the breaker heats up enough to trip.
If the breaker is thermal it's probably got similar overcurrent capabilities to a UK mains fuse, which is typically >2x rated current for a minute or so -- you can quite happily draw 6kW out of a "3kW" mains socket here, pretty much forever if it's on a ring main which most are.
So it's very likely that the Behringer can dump over 2kW/4ohms continuously per channel into your speakers for this long; assuming your ears survive, it's unlikely your speakers will...
(there are some pro drivers which will cope, but few DIY audio people have them)
If "ring" refers to the wiring layout, I can so how that could take double the rated current, but don't see how that applies to the fuse/breaker.
Because all fuses/breakers are like that
They have to be guaranteed to carry the rated current without tripping forever at maximum ambient temperatures allowing for unit-to-unit variations and aging. This means that typically they can carry double the rated current for a minute or so before tripping or blowing.
Their job isn't to limit the current to the rated value, it's to trip or blow when the current greatly exceeds the rated value due to gross overload or a short-circuit and stop your house burning down.
If nu6000 consume 80A in heavy loads, maybe 1 or 2 - 4.17 KVAR 10.4 Amps single phase PFC capacitors can help ? Can put them before amplifier?
Single Phase PFC Capacitor 4 17KVAR 400V 50Hz KNK5015 | eBay
Single Phase PFC Capacitor 4 17KVAR 400V 50Hz KNK5015 | eBay
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