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Old 23rd May 2010, 09:16 AM   #141
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Default AMT2050 V1.0 board , it's obsolete and just for show.

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Old 23rd May 2010, 10:32 AM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimediy View Post
Hi, jean-paul. thank for your suggestions.
This is a DC supply board and i have to prevent polarity reverse, that's why i don't put elec-caps before the relay. May be it's better to add a PSU board for best use.
About CN2 and K3, they seem very logical for layout now and i will show the layout behind. so it's ok i think.
For LEDs, i place a protection LED near the right uper coner to prevent long distance route. I think it's better to use wire to mount it on the front panel if necessary.
And for J1, same reason for place it near the pot, the track will be shortest. it's also keep same as V2.0 does.
I have to explain how V1.1B comes.For this version, it's not paralleled, so it will be V1.x, and i already have V1.0 before. V2.x means paralleled power stage boards(there is just V2.0 now).
I will consider all of your advice and do changes when it's needed, and I also may take some of them for my other products. thanks again.
Hi, I am happy that you accept comments on your designs. If you like i can advise you since I had my last working day for this company yesterday. I have joined the army of the unemployed after years of hard work and having no time for myself. So I have some spare time for now. I will need to find a job ASAP though.

I don't get the remark that you have to protect for reverse polarity !? You could use a sturdy diode in anti-parallel to prevent for the dumbest of all possible user errors Please consider the fact that everything that's added in the power line is a failure possibility and it will have an influence on the resistance/impedance of the power lines too. I could understand if you would incorporate a AC 90- 250V SMPS on the PCB. Everything in one hand by the same designer. I opened quite a few SMPS adapters that power my class t amps and they have the worse of component choices. What is the use of good parts on the amp PCB then ? Besides that they often fail prematurely as they have a totally closed case that offers no convection/airflow. They are always on and draw some power and when they fail they do so when you are not at home. I don't like the thought of that. The switches that switch the amps on don't like to switch large DC inrush currents as they have soft gold clad contacts that will burn in because of DC. I like to switch AC power as it does not stress parts as much and it is more "green" ( and safe ) as the device won't draw power when it is off.
Better is an open chassis SMPS and the best solution is to make it all on one PCB of course with all the safety guide lines and enough space between AC 90 - 250V carrying parts and the amp area. Please check the B&O IcePower modules, they are a good example of that. They are opposite the much more common approach of modular design. I don't know who invented it but the flexibility that is offered is seldom used in practice and one tends to forget the harness/time loss costs that come with modular design. Let's not discuss the sonical character of the IcePower modules though.

I hope you the advantages now of a simple reliable power transformer with a plain jane power switch

Don't worry about the reverse polarity too much. If the PCB has the right marking it is clear how to connect it. The extra relay will only add to the costs, the PCB mounted switch would also make it more difficult for the unexperienced to drill a hole on the right spot in a case etc. Or will you be offering this amp in a case or even under a certain brand name ? Larger tank caps will make the amp sound better and a more worthwhile investment. Since you used output relays there won't be any plop while power on so please explain the power relay. I still advise on larger caps than 1800 uF, you were on the right track with the current version 2.0.
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Last edited by jean-paul; 23rd May 2010 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 23rd May 2010, 01:57 PM   #143
sendler is offline sendler  United States
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Originally Posted by hifimediy View Post
it's not paralleled, so it will be V1.x, and i already have V1.0 before. V2.x means paralleled power stage boards(there is just V2.0 now).
Why bother with the not paralleled power stage at this point when you have the V2 done? Smaller size? Saves one chip? The single chip version can not drive 4 ohm speakers correct?
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Old 23rd May 2010, 02:36 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jean-paul View Post
Hi, I am happy that you accept comments on your designs. If you like i can advise you since I had my last working day for this company yesterday. I have joined the army of the unemployed after years of hard work and having no time for myself. So I have some spare time for now. I will need to find a job ASAP though.

I don't get the remark that you have to protect for reverse polarity !? You could use a sturdy diode in anti-parallel to prevent for the dumbest of all possible user errors Please consider the fact that everything that's added in the power line is a failure possibility and it will have an influence on the resistance/impedance of the power lines too. I could understand if you would incorporate a AC 90- 250V SMPS on the PCB. Everything in one hand by the same designer. I opened quite a few SMPS adapters that power my class t amps and they have the worse of component choices. What is the use of good parts on the amp PCB then ? Besides that they often fail prematurely as they have a totally closed case that offers no convection/airflow. They are always on and draw some power and when they fail they do so when you are not at home. I don't like the thought of that. The switches that switch the amps on don't like to switch large DC inrush currents as they have soft gold clad contacts that will burn in because of DC. I like to switch AC power as it does not stress parts as much and it is more "green" ( and safe ) as the device won't draw power when it is off.
Better is an open chassis SMPS and the best solution is to make it all on one PCB of course with all the safety guide lines and enough space between AC 90 - 250V carrying parts and the amp area. Please check the B&O IcePower modules, they are a good example of that. They are opposite the much more common approach of modular design. I don't know who invented it but the flexibility that is offered is seldom used in practice and one tends to forget the harness/time loss costs that come with modular design. Let's not discuss the sonical character of the IcePower modules though.

I hope you the advantages now of a simple reliable power transformer with a plain jane power switch

Don't worry about the reverse polarity too much. If the PCB has the right marking it is clear how to connect it. The extra relay will only add to the costs, the PCB mounted switch would also make it more difficult for the unexperienced to drill a hole on the right spot in a case etc. Or will you be offering this amp in a case or even under a certain brand name ? Larger tank caps will make the amp sound better and a more worthwhile investment. Since you used output relays there won't be any plop while power on so please explain the power relay. I still advise on larger caps than 1800 uF, you were on the right track with the current version 2.0.
Hi, intersting information, i will do more work later.
And about power relay, it's just in case of polarity reverse. That will be a big trouble when a mistake really happen, may be most of the chips on board will burn then. About the caps, i prepare a PSU too, then the total caps will be big enough
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Old 23rd May 2010, 02:45 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by sendler View Post
Why bother with the not paralleled power stage at this point when you have the V2 done? Smaller size? Saves one chip? The single chip version can not drive 4 ohm speakers correct?
Hi Sendler.
V2 is for 4ohm high power(100W) and V1 is for 6/8ohm lower power(50W). so both will meet their own demand i think. no?
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Old 23rd May 2010, 04:20 PM   #146
sendler is offline sendler  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimediy View Post
Hi Sendler.
V2 is for 4ohm high power(100W) and V1 is for 6/8ohm lower power(50W). so both will meet their own demand i think. no?
There will be a demand for the single chip amp only if it happens to sound better for some reason. I would have to assume that the difference in price will be negligible so why not buy the more powerful amp for a few dollars more.
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Old 24th May 2010, 05:43 AM   #147
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Sendler has a point: it will only sell if it sounds better otherwise there won't be a need for a low power version. There are plenty TA2020/21 designs around. If you use a somewhat lower voltage on the V2.0 it will be a low power version too

Optimising/enhancing the V2.0 with the above mentioned features would be a wiser choice.
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Last edited by jean-paul; 24th May 2010 at 05:46 AM.
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Old 25th May 2010, 06:53 AM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jean-paul View Post
Sendler has a point: it will only sell if it sounds better otherwise there won't be a need for a low power version. There are plenty TA2020/21 designs around. If you use a somewhat lower voltage on the V2.0 it will be a low power version too

Optimising/enhancing the V2.0 with the above mentioned features would be a wiser choice.
, I think there is difference sound between them, but very subjective. and if use higher power chip on V1, it will also ok for 4ohm and not bad i think.
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Old 25th May 2010, 07:09 AM   #149
v-bro is offline v-bro  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sendler View Post
The single chip version can not drive 4 ohm speakers correct?
It can with a beefier power stage chip, like STA517B or STA516, or some Apogee chips. A lot of them can deliver far more than the 3A rated Tripath power stage....
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Old 30th May 2010, 06:37 AM   #150
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V-bro's right. Here comes a new design
[IMG]Click the image to open in full size.V1.1B new[/IMG]
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