http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....em=&sspagename=STRK:MEWAX:IT&salenotsupported
Looks intreresting, good value and, just what a few of us are after.
Thoughts?
Looks intreresting, good value and, just what a few of us are after.
Thoughts?
I am concidering almost exactly same thing. Not necessarily this exact tube buffer/preamp but some of this cheap boards.
What i am wondering is that does tripath amps benefit from tube buffers /preamps at all or do they actually give drawback in soundquality? I have not found clear answer to simple question. Is there one or is it about opinions again?
Could someone more cultivated audiophile enlighten me about this?
What i am wondering is that does tripath amps benefit from tube buffers /preamps at all or do they actually give drawback in soundquality? I have not found clear answer to simple question. Is there one or is it about opinions again?
Could someone more cultivated audiophile enlighten me about this?
Maybe this will help; it is a video of my Topping TP21 T-Amp with a YiXin MDS-623 tube buffer on the front end. The sound is stunning. The tube buffer really adds a thick, lush analog layer that compliments the T-Amp highs and mids. The MDS-623 utilizes (2) 6N3 tubes which are Chinese equivalent of 2C51/5670.
Topping TP21 T-Amp Stereo System - YouTube
Topping TP21 T-Amp Stereo System - YouTube
Yes, with good tube buffer
I have tried various tube buffers with Tripath based amps. The best so far was with the Decware z-stage which manages to be very transparent and extremely musical. The other buffers sounded like they were adding a veil to the sound.
But with the z-stage it was magical.
I have tried various tube buffers with Tripath based amps. The best so far was with the Decware z-stage which manages to be very transparent and extremely musical. The other buffers sounded like they were adding a veil to the sound.
But with the z-stage it was magical.
Hihttp://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....em=&sspagename=STRK:MEWAX:IT&salenotsupported
Looks intreresting, good value and, just what a few of us are after.
Thoughts?
Where is the schematic?
thank you!
I have been using a Yaqin CD-2 tube buffer in front of a Tripath 2050 amp. It really wakes up the amp.
Here's the thing...The buffer works best AFTER the volume pot. If you are using a tripath amp with an onboard pot this may not be possible. I used a 25K stepped attenuator in front of the buffer then into the amp.
Honestly, if you are going to DIY something I'd look at the Nelson Pass B1. My experience with the tube buffer was positive but you do lose some detail.
The tripath amps will always have buffering/impedence issues when used without a preamp, most have just a passive pot in front of the amp. Adding the buffer really drives the amp better.
Other amps like the Pass F5 are more immune to input impedence...but my tripath needed the buffer. And good tubes in the buffer but that's a different story...
Here's the thing...The buffer works best AFTER the volume pot. If you are using a tripath amp with an onboard pot this may not be possible. I used a 25K stepped attenuator in front of the buffer then into the amp.
Honestly, if you are going to DIY something I'd look at the Nelson Pass B1. My experience with the tube buffer was positive but you do lose some detail.
The tripath amps will always have buffering/impedence issues when used without a preamp, most have just a passive pot in front of the amp. Adding the buffer really drives the amp better.
Other amps like the Pass F5 are more immune to input impedence...but my tripath needed the buffer. And good tubes in the buffer but that's a different story...
I have been using a B1 Pass buffer (DC coupled with symmetrical supply and a 10K pot in front of it) with my TA2022 amp for some time now and I believe it is a killer combination as it has beautiful lush sound with amazing detail at the same time. One of the best sounding combos regardless of cost. Many listeners thought that they were in front of a top class tube pre/power amp combo and its all solid state. Highly recommended.
Hi, I'm using an HRT Music Streamer II DAC into my connex ta3020vc3 amp, with nothing in between, not even a volume pot (I control volume digitally on computer, in 24 bit mode for no loss of quality). Is this not ideal? It SEEMS to sound great, and has been realiable, i.e. I've run it this way for 5 years with no issues. Is there an impedance mismatch or buffering issue that is degrading the sound quality? What is meant by buffering in this sense anyways, I don't understand that...
If you have any suggestions for a preamp or buffer stage/gain stage between my dac and amp, for say, 50-100 bucks, I'd appreciate it. tube or no tube, either way, whatever is best, I want to retain the high level of detail these amps produce, and perhaps a cheap tube amp would color and blur the sound too much. heard of the little bear?
I use a cmoy headphone amp with bass boost battery powered in front of two bi amped 2020 amptastics with the internal volumes disabled and a passive level pilot as a volume from the source - the results are shockingly good all within a budget to.
The 6x gain can be reduced by replacing a couple of resisters if you want but more importantly get a good volume stepped 42 or beyond its amazing solution for a small outlay before you remove any resistors try with a decent volume control first.
I think the advice above re the B1 is good. I have a Mezmerize PCB waiting to build which was based on the B1 which would be my overall preference with an LDR Volume control either or are good.
The 6x gain can be reduced by replacing a couple of resisters if you want but more importantly get a good volume stepped 42 or beyond its amazing solution for a small outlay before you remove any resistors try with a decent volume control first.
I think the advice above re the B1 is good. I have a Mezmerize PCB waiting to build which was based on the B1 which would be my overall preference with an LDR Volume control either or are good.
Laughingbuddha,
I have used with great results two versions of the tripath 2022 amp.
The first one was a 41Hz amp-5 kit (it still works, after at least 6-7 years of continous use and sounds great) and the second the TA2022 Audio Amplifier from Connexelectronic (also used for at least 5-6 years with no problems). In both of them I have substituted the coils in the original design with air coils at the output (from Autocostruire) and the caps at the input with fine pp capacitors from Jantzen (Silver-Z) and Mundorf (Superior). Both of them use ultra fast, ultra soft recovery rectifier bridges, very good quality smoothing caps (40 and 60 thousand uF) and very good quality toroids (300VA).
Lately I have also tried the switching power supply from Connexelectronic (SMPS300RE) as a combination with the Connexelectronic amp with amazing (for a switching PS) results (very smooth and extremely sweet overall sound, really tubey in character but with tight low frequencies). So you take your pick in character and you built what is appropriate (as far as sound is concerned) for you.
The Amp-5 is a little cleaner, extremely detailed, full of harmonics and airy (Silver-Z), the Connexelectronic (Superior) is more earthy, sweet and solid, but these differences are small and you notice them through direct comparison listening tests, side by side.
I use both amps now with either a Superbuffer 2 (from Borbely) or the Pass clone (MOSFET SE preamplifier plus volume control 128 steps highly reliable relays from Jims Audio, ebay). The former is one of the best preamps I have heard (clean, detailed, amazing soundstage and dynamics, no coloration at all) the latter is more "musical" (also clean, but not that clean, with richer more colorful harmonics and a little rounder on the top, also with great dynamics and sweeter overall sound). The B1 as a preamp is still great but the gain and higher power supply voltage of the Jims Audio pre gives it better dynamics and more control at the low end region plus more "pizazz" (B1 sounds more plain compared with both of them). Direct comparisons with the Pass Labs XP-10 showed confirmed these conclusions.
Both the amps are not bridged, the speakers I have designed and use have almost 90dB/w/m sensitivity and are pretty much a constant 8 Ohms load, and in my room (25 sq.m) the power from these little wonders is more than enough for me (I also don't listen at very high levels).
I have found that in order to get really better sound than these combinations (and believe me I have tried lots of commercial solutions) I had to spend a lot more than 6-8.000 euros. I could say that I value these combinations (soundwise) easily at around 5-7k, even more if the speakers compliment the character of the amplification.
I have used with great results two versions of the tripath 2022 amp.
The first one was a 41Hz amp-5 kit (it still works, after at least 6-7 years of continous use and sounds great) and the second the TA2022 Audio Amplifier from Connexelectronic (also used for at least 5-6 years with no problems). In both of them I have substituted the coils in the original design with air coils at the output (from Autocostruire) and the caps at the input with fine pp capacitors from Jantzen (Silver-Z) and Mundorf (Superior). Both of them use ultra fast, ultra soft recovery rectifier bridges, very good quality smoothing caps (40 and 60 thousand uF) and very good quality toroids (300VA).
Lately I have also tried the switching power supply from Connexelectronic (SMPS300RE) as a combination with the Connexelectronic amp with amazing (for a switching PS) results (very smooth and extremely sweet overall sound, really tubey in character but with tight low frequencies). So you take your pick in character and you built what is appropriate (as far as sound is concerned) for you.
The Amp-5 is a little cleaner, extremely detailed, full of harmonics and airy (Silver-Z), the Connexelectronic (Superior) is more earthy, sweet and solid, but these differences are small and you notice them through direct comparison listening tests, side by side.
I use both amps now with either a Superbuffer 2 (from Borbely) or the Pass clone (MOSFET SE preamplifier plus volume control 128 steps highly reliable relays from Jims Audio, ebay). The former is one of the best preamps I have heard (clean, detailed, amazing soundstage and dynamics, no coloration at all) the latter is more "musical" (also clean, but not that clean, with richer more colorful harmonics and a little rounder on the top, also with great dynamics and sweeter overall sound). The B1 as a preamp is still great but the gain and higher power supply voltage of the Jims Audio pre gives it better dynamics and more control at the low end region plus more "pizazz" (B1 sounds more plain compared with both of them). Direct comparisons with the Pass Labs XP-10 showed confirmed these conclusions.
Both the amps are not bridged, the speakers I have designed and use have almost 90dB/w/m sensitivity and are pretty much a constant 8 Ohms load, and in my room (25 sq.m) the power from these little wonders is more than enough for me (I also don't listen at very high levels).
I have found that in order to get really better sound than these combinations (and believe me I have tried lots of commercial solutions) I had to spend a lot more than 6-8.000 euros. I could say that I value these combinations (soundwise) easily at around 5-7k, even more if the speakers compliment the character of the amplification.
Very cool... so is there a short answer to my question re: putting something between my HRT-II DAC and connex ta3020? Should I be using a stepped attenuator or some other method for controlling volume instead of the 24-bit digital control in foobar?
My amp has a high amount of gain so I certainly don't need to boost output, I need to attenuate it. In foobar I'm usually attenuating at -18 to -36 db (-24 avg.) depending on desired level.
I could also lower the gain on the TA-3020 which would have the added benefit of lowering the noise floor, not that it's too high, but it's perceptible. When I ordered it he gave me options for the gain setting and I went with the higher one, I'm not sure how much of a difference there was between the options, but I kinda wish I had gone with the lower one, but I had a thirst for power and bass. But I'm not familiar with how to make this change off hand, i would have to figure that part out and order the right components.
Suggestions? SQ seems fine (excellent) right now, but I just want everything to be optimized and ideal, as I'm sure there's some room for improvement (like with air coils or input caps).
My amp has a high amount of gain so I certainly don't need to boost output, I need to attenuate it. In foobar I'm usually attenuating at -18 to -36 db (-24 avg.) depending on desired level.
I could also lower the gain on the TA-3020 which would have the added benefit of lowering the noise floor, not that it's too high, but it's perceptible. When I ordered it he gave me options for the gain setting and I went with the higher one, I'm not sure how much of a difference there was between the options, but I kinda wish I had gone with the lower one, but I had a thirst for power and bass. But I'm not familiar with how to make this change off hand, i would have to figure that part out and order the right components.
Suggestions? SQ seems fine (excellent) right now, but I just want everything to be optimized and ideal, as I'm sure there's some room for improvement (like with air coils or input caps).
Lee Spencer,
I believe that going with an active stage (a very good one mind you) gives you better overall SQ.
I have used all kinds of passive pots (stepped with high quality resistors) in the past (before I went active), ie. series, ladder and finally shunt, and I found that by using shunt (with a Vishay resistor in series) I had the best SQ result compared with the straight connection of the source to the amp (using the payers volume to adjust loudness as you do). I have used that combination for some years before I went active.
I also think that using the highest possible gain in a Tripath amp (since I have tried that too) had higher noise floor and that in combination with my medium to high sensitivity speakers and my position in front of them made the situation kind of unbearable. But I didn't find any real difference in SQ so it's up to you. If you want to lower the gain you can contact Connexelectronic for advise or use the formula they have in their site (where they have the info for their amp, bottom line).
With an active stage (like the ones I mentioned in my earlier post) the shunt type was the best combination soundwise also. I have also found that the Tripath amps pair great with very high quality tube preamps (like Mactone and Leben) but I don't like the idea that everytime I turn on my tubed preamp I hear a little worse than yesterday and they cost a lot!
My advise is to check things with a cheap volume pot (an blue Alps is OK to begin with), check also a good commersial active solution (but with a better pot than the Alps if possible) and see which of the two you like better. Then you can start thinking about what you will end up with. I believe you have lots of room for improvement.
P.S. Give the MusiCHI player a test run. I think it has much better SQ than foobar even if it is a bit more complicated.
I believe that going with an active stage (a very good one mind you) gives you better overall SQ.
I have used all kinds of passive pots (stepped with high quality resistors) in the past (before I went active), ie. series, ladder and finally shunt, and I found that by using shunt (with a Vishay resistor in series) I had the best SQ result compared with the straight connection of the source to the amp (using the payers volume to adjust loudness as you do). I have used that combination for some years before I went active.
I also think that using the highest possible gain in a Tripath amp (since I have tried that too) had higher noise floor and that in combination with my medium to high sensitivity speakers and my position in front of them made the situation kind of unbearable. But I didn't find any real difference in SQ so it's up to you. If you want to lower the gain you can contact Connexelectronic for advise or use the formula they have in their site (where they have the info for their amp, bottom line).
With an active stage (like the ones I mentioned in my earlier post) the shunt type was the best combination soundwise also. I have also found that the Tripath amps pair great with very high quality tube preamps (like Mactone and Leben) but I don't like the idea that everytime I turn on my tubed preamp I hear a little worse than yesterday and they cost a lot!
My advise is to check things with a cheap volume pot (an blue Alps is OK to begin with), check also a good commersial active solution (but with a better pot than the Alps if possible) and see which of the two you like better. Then you can start thinking about what you will end up with. I believe you have lots of room for improvement.
P.S. Give the MusiCHI player a test run. I think it has much better SQ than foobar even if it is a bit more complicated.
Not sure if this thread is still active. I am very interested in getting the HiFimeDIY T1 TK2050 tripath amp, but would like to compliment it with a tube preamp or buffer.
Someone recommended a Pass B1 Buffer and another recommendation was the Pass Jfet BoZ. Not sure which one will fit best, but I still cannot find a suitable (and simple) tube solution.
Any suggestions as to what should work well with the T1 amp? As you can see I am very very new to audio diy and all the technicalities - so I need something simple (and well documented) if I am to build it myself. Thanks.
Someone recommended a Pass B1 Buffer and another recommendation was the Pass Jfet BoZ. Not sure which one will fit best, but I still cannot find a suitable (and simple) tube solution.
Any suggestions as to what should work well with the T1 amp? As you can see I am very very new to audio diy and all the technicalities - so I need something simple (and well documented) if I am to build it myself. Thanks.
I have the same question, except mine is the TA2022 board.
Yuan-Jing TA2022 2 x 180W Audio Power Amplifier Board
Hi jencelo,
That is a very old post. Probably one of my first, and a lot has happened since then.
I ended up building the Pass B1 buffer and it is an amazing piece of equipment. I used it with the TK2050 amp and if I recall - it really brought out the best in the TK2050. Did not compare with other preamps though.
I have since replaced the TK2050 with a $2 TDA7297 amp from Aliexpress, and the TDA actually sounds much much better than the tripath. I have used this setup (FLAC => HiFimeDIY Sabre 9018 DAC => B1 => TDA7297 => Tannoy Monitors) for quite a long time now and am very very satisfied with the sound.
The TDA amp was recently replaced with a Pass ACA Class A amp, which improved things even more. However, with the low powered (7W) ACA amp the B1 is not sufficient to drive my (88dB) speakers to satisfactory listening levels. If I swop the B1 with a tube headphone amp, then I can drive the ACA amp well enough, and it definitely brings in a wonderful warm "tube" sound.
So, from my limited experience I can highly recommend the B1 for your current amp (and the ones to come). The B1 is really easy to build. As a beginner I did it point-to-point. However, it might also be a good option to get a tube buffer if you would like the warmer tube sound (which I love with my headphones). There are many cheap options here, so no harm in trying.
Hope it helps.
That is a very old post. Probably one of my first, and a lot has happened since then.
I ended up building the Pass B1 buffer and it is an amazing piece of equipment. I used it with the TK2050 amp and if I recall - it really brought out the best in the TK2050. Did not compare with other preamps though.
I have since replaced the TK2050 with a $2 TDA7297 amp from Aliexpress, and the TDA actually sounds much much better than the tripath. I have used this setup (FLAC => HiFimeDIY Sabre 9018 DAC => B1 => TDA7297 => Tannoy Monitors) for quite a long time now and am very very satisfied with the sound.
The TDA amp was recently replaced with a Pass ACA Class A amp, which improved things even more. However, with the low powered (7W) ACA amp the B1 is not sufficient to drive my (88dB) speakers to satisfactory listening levels. If I swop the B1 with a tube headphone amp, then I can drive the ACA amp well enough, and it definitely brings in a wonderful warm "tube" sound.
So, from my limited experience I can highly recommend the B1 for your current amp (and the ones to come
). The B1 is really easy to build. As a beginner I did it point-to-point. However, it might also be a good option to get a tube buffer if you would like the warmer tube sound (which I love with my headphones). There are many cheap options here, so no harm in trying.Hope it helps.
Thanks twocents!
I really appreciate the response. I did try few Class D chips even Hypex NCore NC400 but this TA2022 (specifically this chip though), gives me the best vocals and separation of the instruments which I value the most. The bass can be little weak but that maybe also related to my current TP60 (TA2022 based integrated) amp. The reason for this new board is the dual chips (each BTL), which triples the power of my current TP60. I do like lush sound so tube buffer may be first choice but since the B1 is Nelson Pass' design, it usually is a no brainer Except his X series (X150 and so on), I have not met a Pass product that I did not like
I really appreciate the response. I did try few Class D chips even Hypex NCore NC400 but this TA2022 (specifically this chip though), gives me the best vocals and separation of the instruments which I value the most. The bass can be little weak but that maybe also related to my current TP60 (TA2022 based integrated) amp. The reason for this new board is the dual chips (each BTL), which triples the power of my current TP60. I do like lush sound so tube buffer may be first choice but since the B1 is Nelson Pass' design, it usually is a no brainer
Except his X series (X150 and so on), I have not met a Pass product that I did not like- Status
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