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Old 20th January 2012, 07:59 AM   #2181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Virpz View Post
One of my friends was unlucky because she's board turned to be a fire machine. Before connecting the speakers I always like to do some basic tests and so I connected 8 ohms 2 watt resistors to the board outputs and at the power on the board instantly set the resistors on fire. Now imagine if we had jumped the test and connected the speakers ( infinity p362 ) to the board.
Anyone has an idea of what kind of fault can cause that kind of disaster ? feedback caps and resistors maybe ?

[]'s
What do you expect when you connect a resistor rated for 2watts, to an output of a 100 watt amplifier? thats 50 times more than the resistor can handle
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Old 20th January 2012, 04:06 PM   #2182
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Originally Posted by Virpz View Post
Okay I tested the mod done by elfish here so by connecting a 0.33uf mkt cap to ground and earth of my meanwell s350-24 I maded my 4x100 noiseless and my friends 2x100 reduced 70% of the noise .


After my good experience with the sure 4x100 wich I was able to do insane mods, two friends of mine purchased the 2x100 version. I still have one 4x100 unmodded so I was able to compare both and it ends that the STOCK 4x100 sounds much better than the STOCK 2x100 and the 4x100 outputs much less noise.

One of my friends was unlucky because she's board turned to be a fire machine. Before connecting the speakers I always like to do some basic tests and so I connected 8 ohms 2 watt resistors to the board outputs and at the power on the board instantly set the resistors on fire. Now imagine if we had jumped the test and connected the speakers ( infinity p362 ) to the board.
Anyone has an idea of what kind of fault can cause that kind of disaster ? feedback caps and resistors maybe ?

[]'s

I had similar problem with 2 boards 2x100w
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Old 20th January 2012, 05:19 PM   #2183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElFishi View Post
I have some spare time while I wait for the new sure board to replace the one I scorched. So I completed the list of mods and things around the board I did. Maybe you find that interesting.

PSU Mean Well 24/145:
- cranked up to almost 30V
- 0.47uF MKS btn GND and COM

Sure board:
- changed PCB traces per audio1st suggestions (diyAudio - View Single Post - Sure Electronics New Tripath Board tc2000+tp2050)
- removed D1,2
- added 0.1uF parallel to C6 from the underside of the board
- exchanged C22&27 for 470pF as per the TC2000 data sheet
- re-wired pins 24 on both TP2050s to 21,22 (Vdd) instead of gnd
- removed tank caps from rails and replaced with 2 x 2 Panasonic FM 1800uF/35V on the rails
- replaced C3 with same type Pana FC
- added 0.1uF/100V MKP4 parallel to C3
- replaced C4 with standard-middle-of-the-road cap 100uF/10V
- replaced R2 with 2 green low-current LEDs, V_F=2.0V
- replaced R3 with 470Ohm
- added diodes 1n4001 btn Vadj/Vout and Vin/Vout
- replaced output filter
  • 12uH self-wound toroids: T68-2 with 46 windings of 0.6mm enameled wire, sets of 2 plain windings followed by 1 clove hitch to double up the wire layer on the inner perimeter of the toroid
  • .47 uF/250V MKP4 as common mode capacitors
  • .22uF/630V MKP4 (had those in the box) as differential mode capacitor
  • .22uF/250V MKP4 as Zobel capacitor
  • 10 Ohm/1W Metal Oxide as Zobel resistor
- replaced R16,30 with 22kOhm metal film
- interrupted traces btn input RCA and screw terminal
- removed R11,27 and replaced with 22kOhm metal film connected btn old solder pad and screw terminal
- removed R4 to open loop over SignalGND, Earth and B1
- added modified Pass B1 buffer (http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/B1%20Buffer%20Preamp.pdf, diyAudio - View Single Post - B1 Buffer Preamp) to input
- 1nF/1000V MKP4 from speaker terminals to chassis

B1 specs
- R1 2.4 Ohm
- C1,2 2 x 3 x 3800uF/35V Panasonic FC
- C3 1uF MKP-10
- Cx00: 1uF MKP-10
- Cx01: 2.2uF MKP-10, directly linked to input resistor of sure board
- Rx05,x05: dropped
- 50k Vishay conductive plastic, log taper
- added 1N5401 to input of positive rail, bypassed by a 1k resistor for a controlled discharge of the caps (otherwise the sure amp makes an ugly noise when going down)

Soft Start/ Mute On Off Circuit
- 24V/0.4W relay 8A 2CO contacts (tyco RT424024)
- 2 white LEDs (~6V drop) in line with coil
- 47 Ohm/ 5W resistor to fill the tank caps up to operating voltage for the relay
- 1N4148 parallel to relay coil
- 0.39 Ohm/5W resistor to filter the power supply and to sense the current
- TL081 as comparator (TL081 can work in high-side applications)
- 2 x 10k voltage divider to drive a
- BS170 that mutes the amp when power is switched off and the tank caps unload via the SMPS and the current sensing resistor
- 100uF btn MUTE and GND to keep the amp mute a little longer
- 3 x 3300uF/35V Yageo SY tank caps
- 1800uF/35V Panasonic FM next to output (close to amp power input)

piccie of the board w/ toroids and schematic of the "mute on off" circuit attached
Wow that is a lot of work. I wish there were more detailed pics and explanations as I would like to do some of these mods. I see the rca connectors are untouched. Are you still using those after all these other mods? or do you go direct to the screw terminal connectors?
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Old 20th January 2012, 06:25 PM   #2184
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Originally Posted by bonusbartus View Post
What do you expect when you connect a resistor rated for 2watts, to an output of a 100 watt amplifier? thats 50 times more than the resistor can handle
Well, I forgot to mention that I had no source ( no input signal ) and by that I expected the resistors to survive with ease.
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Old 25th January 2012, 09:10 PM   #2185
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Sure refused to refund or replace my friend's damaged board. No explanation's.
They asked for a picture of the board, she sen't and they never replied .
She openned an ebay dispute and lost it. Plain simple.
Great value indeed, if it is not faulty.

Since I don't wat to try my luck I shall not recommend it to my friends and I will stay away from their low Quality Control and prototype boards for now.

[]'s
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Old 25th January 2012, 09:19 PM   #2186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Virpz View Post
Sure refused to refund or replace my friend's damaged board. No explanation's.
They asked for a picture of the board, she sen't and they never replied .
She openned an ebay dispute and lost it. Plain simple.
Great value indeed, if it is not faulty.

Since I don't wat to try my luck I shall not recommend it to my friends and I will stay away from their low Quality Control and prototype boards for now.

[]'s
Unfortunately, my first board broke (version1), and after contacting Sure, I got replacement.
The second board (v2) went literally up the smoke

I decided not to contact again.

I was quite happy with the sound especially with the first one.
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Old 25th January 2012, 09:38 PM   #2187
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i bought 2 boards (biamping) have worked just fine over a month with 33.5V! heat sink is half of an old Pentium4's gives 38 Celsius degrees.
sounded just marvelous but after changing the output filters to 4,7mH 0.47uF it got a touch of brightness! i guess i'll put back tht original caps! but a little afraid of damaging the boards!

Last edited by Nosian; 25th January 2012 at 10:02 PM.
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Old 25th January 2012, 09:54 PM   #2188
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I have three boards. Only one is still fine.

Two are modded, worked fine (bi-amping) and a spare one I just bought.
That last one was tested and almost burnt my brand new Fostex speakers. 20V DC offset!!
Speakers were tested and are fine, a TA2020 and a SS amp, all fine.
Then used my pair of modded Sure's TK2050 back. One vanished in smoke suddenly.
We've asked for a replacement one for the 20V DC one, hope to get it work. Or I'll build a stereo amp, still very good sounding, until failure... or not...

A pair of HiFiMeDiy T1 STA510 are on the way, I wish they were on market before the Sure...
Avoid these amps, for quality issues, even if I wonder if the top modded -then more expensive- Sure compares to a HiFiMeDiy...
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Old 26th January 2012, 12:37 AM   #2189
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I am waiting on a Hifimediy T2, should be here any day. I'm really looking forward to comparing it to my Sure 4x TK2050.
One mod I am looking forward to trying is replacing the output filter with one designed to match my speakers. All class-d amps that use an LC filter and zobel must be designed for a specific speaker impedance. If your speaker has a higher impedance than the one the filter was designed for, there will be a big peak in the response that will extend low enough to effect the sound of the amp. If your speaker has a lower impedance, the high end will roll off. The same goes for a mismatched zobel. I believe this is why the Sure 4x board sound so bright to most DIYers because their filter was designed for a very low impedance so nearly all speakers will have a high freq peak with the Sure.
You can design and apply your own filter that is matched to your speakers by getting the DC resistance and inductance of your high freq driver from the manufacturer (if your speaker is diy), or measuring it, then calculating the values of the output filter and zobel yourself.
I have recently written a thread on Diyaudio giving the equations, named "Class-D Output Filters - A Case Study".
I need someone to check my work before anyone commits to trying it out though.
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Old 29th January 2012, 03:01 PM   #2190
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Don't forget to report this test.
Sure is sending me a second card, I'll be able also to compare fully modded Sure's la Sendler ( top clear sound ) vs T1 STA510a. Hope that Sure will be OK...
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