Icepower Vs Hypex digital amplifiers. Which is best?

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cirrus18

Member
Joined 2008
In this test of various digital amplifiers 2008 - Class D Amplifier comparasion test the Icepower was bottom of the pile.
I have no idea how accurate this test was though.

I have been looking at the Hypex VCD180 HG series which offers amazingly good value for money, it also gets very good reviews.
Believe the Hypex, class-D DIY amplifier - UcD, universal class-D .


Available[/url] here, https://www.hypexshop.com

UcD180
180Wrms amplifier-module based on UCD-technology
Price: € 60,00 excl. VAT

UcD supply ST
Power supply to power one or two UcD180/400's. On-board DC protection.
Price: € 65,00 excl. VAT

So for only Euros €185 excluding VAT for 2 VCD180 HG modules and a power supply to power them both.
Just a little over the price for only one Icepower module.

Perhaps someone with more technical knowledge than me would like to have a look at their respective datasheets and let us have your opinions.

The Ice Power can be downloaded from here, ICEpower — Speaker Engine Solutions.The VCD180 HG from Hypex Electronics B.V..
 
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calvert73

Member
Joined 2005
wrong way around!

Very odd, that test places the Hypex ahead of B&O ICE, not my impression at all, I cannot take this seriously, personal preferences are one thing but the comments made about the ICE I just dont understand. I used both as standard and have modified both to higher performance and the ICE for me sounds more real. I guess you should try both.
Forget about trying to fathom what the performance with music is like from data sheets, unless of course you're clairvoyant.

RC :confused:
 
bwaslo

bwaslo

Member
Joined 2006
libinst.com
I think you still have to come up with a power transformer to make an amp with the UcDs after your 180. They don't have built-in SMPS supplies like the ICEpowers usually do and the power supply kit is the board with rectifier and filter caps.

Haven't heard the UcDs, but have heard good things about them (and their inventor has written some pretty impressive papers on the subject). I have a couple of ICEpowers and I wouldn't trade them for any class A, AB or B amps I've ever had access to.
 
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cirrus18

Member
Joined 2008
Re: wrong way around!

calvert73 said:
I used both as standard and have modified both to higher performance and the ICE for me sounds more real. I guess you should try both.
RC :confused:
Click to expand...

Thank you for your reply.
I see that you prefer the ICEpower. I have been looking to see where I can buy them from with not much luck except on eBay., no guarantee or backup there.

May I ask where you bought your ICEpower modules from, price paid, and I would also be interested to know what modifications you made to both types to make them sound better. That would be most interesting. Many thanks.
 
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ArthurG

Member
Joined 2004
pwm-audio.com
I'm not sure they address the same market. ICE modules are old tech now but they are reliable and that's why so many pro audio companies use them successfully.
On the other hand, UCD are more end user oriented. At least I've never seen it in pro audio.
Regarding sound quality, it's subjective but on the bench, UCD has better performance.
 
BWRX

BWRX

Ex-Moderator
Joined 2005
ArthurG said:
ICE modules are old tech now
Click to expand...

Old tech, eh? That depends on what you're comparing it to ;)

These "which is best" threads are pointless because the responses you get are all subjective. If you can, listen to both for yourself. If you can't, choose the one that is most economical for you. You probably won't be disappointed either way.
 
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classdphile

Disabled Account
Joined 2008
BWRX said:


Old tech, eh? That depends on what you're comparing it to ;)

These "which is best" threads are pointless because the responses you get are all subjective. If you can, listen to both for

yourself. If you can't, choose the one that is most economical for you. You probably won't be disappointed either way.

Click to expand...

How about compared to UcD, then.

Normally I'd agree about the futility of such threads, even considering some responses have more behind them than mere subjectiveness. For instance, take a gander at this Pierre feller in a similarly titled thread that dweekie linked to here, quel example. These threads seem to bring the sharks into shallow waters. How'd Tripath get a mention in this anyway?

The OP here had his interest peaked after mistaking a viral ad campaign for a test, where in this instance test is a word I use begrudgingly, but remember that's not just my subjectively worthless opinion, all my friends agree, and they've marketed virally forever.

He also didn't do his homework so well in comparing costs, having started off discussing the HG version and pricing the cheaper ST version instead, aptly weighed against a grossely inflated IcePower no less.

All the same, he asked for technically oriented opinions based off the datasheet information and there's little to be subjective with in this case because one is so right while the rest, so not.

The facts are that UcD is the only one able to claim low, flat THD response, invariant of frequency, load, and very nearly power, with a frequency response that is entirely load invariant. Important criteria to high quality sound reproduction, and areas the others don't measure up to, as seen repeated in third party comparative measurements if one were so inclined to look them up. IcePower is not the worst of the lot, neither is it UcD.

Further critical to performance as well as sound is Hypex's unrivaled EMI performance wrt to emissions or susceptibility, conducted and radiated. This helps avoid or totally alleviates a variety of issues that commonly plague junk, making them robust and user friendly such that no more than your basic every-amp techniques prove satisfactory.

If IcePower are said to be reliable, it's only so far as their slew of protection circuits remain functional, it is so cheaply constructed that it's fully reliant on them not to burn up. Personally I'd prefer a module that's robust enough already to not have to rely on every type of protection possible. Further consider this a likely candidate as to why IcePower is not sold to ignorant hobbyists, or its reputation for reliability would suffer greatly.

Economical can be subjective too. To me it's dealing with a reliable company, one that only takes orders for products that actually exist and are in stock, with a good warranty and strong support. Compare that with cons that create demand they can't fill but still cash orders for, which has happened more than once or even twice, and from a number of people. Gambling to me is poor economic practice unless it's with someone else's money of course, kind of like your reply does. The wrong choice here and you'll get no sound at all and since the forum doesn't reimburse after it's users get taken for a ride, in the least you owe them decent advice, or is it the users you look out for?

The UcD ST line measures the same as the HG version, and as such share the same basic-to-UcD-only desirable sonic characteristics between them. Properly implemented the HG variant however easily humbles the very best amps of any particular class. With very little effort it's pretty close to flawless.

IcePower's attraction to the professional community is that it meets their quoted spec for reasonable performance given a commercial product, should survive to the extent of the offered warranty, and is ready to plug in cheaply to max profit margin.

Its attraction to the forum as of late is simply that of a forbidden romance. Regardless of demand it remains cheap commercial grade and will always suffer from its non ideal architecture where UcD doesn't.

Things like load invariant response and EMI simply aren't subjective issues so long as it's actually amplifiers we're discussing and we understand that amplifiers should not double as synthesizers.

Advising one to listen to them both yourself is a cop out at best, realistically not many can, that's why they take stereophile's word for it, or "all my friends". It's also unrealistic given diy based modules where so many uncontrolled variables come into play, namely the user, including their ill conceived modifications toward better sound readily done to make up for a common lack of a reasonable deployment. This is something even supposed pros are guilty of as well in their quest for a marketable gimmick. Unfortunately most understand them no more than your basic hobbyist.

Even were they identically implemented they don't start off on equal footing because so many are faulty by design, as seen in the measurements if they at least have the brass to provide any. It's beyond my understanding how you'd assert disappointment is unlikely regardless of the choice made, as if to say they're all of equal caliber, to even assume his expectations, or ability to learn how to implement one properly. I would say it's true provided you get something truly refined, and likely that you would be disappointed if you don't.

Held to reasonable standards lesser products will have to improve, or sell out to Cirrus Logic after losing their shirts for lying to the wrong people, who it seems in fact were disappointed. There's no sense in apologizing for lesser products unless they're your own, which you could better do through continued improvements. Pretending they're all equivalent is absurd in every respect, because all my friends agree Hypex is on another level, and clearly they do set the bar that others ooze under.
 
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Jan-Peter

R.I.P.
Joined 2003
hypex.nl
john65b

john65b

Member
Joined 2005
Paid Member
I have had built at least four UCD180ST, and AD amps and four UCD400ST and AD amps. The UCD400's were a measured improvement over the 180's on my power hungry Magnepan MGIIIa's. I also had the Bel Canto S300 which has the ASC200 ICEpower. Sounded OK...

I was definitely more impressed with my UCD400AD (the UCD180s were sold and gone) than the Bel Canto. It may have been due to the power tho...

So I have since bought four new Icepower ASC200 modules and will again see what sounds better, biamping my maggies with the four ASC200 or the UCD400AD. It will not be an even playing field as the UCD400AD will be through the modded maggie passive crossover, and the ICEpower will be through the DCX2496 active crossover.

I am pretty sure that the UCD400AD will still be on top.

The UCD400AD has been recently bested by my Krell KSA50 Class A Clone. The UCD400AD is still an awesome amp.
 
Pano

Pano

Administrator
Joined 2004
Paid Member
classdphile said:
.... it is so cheaply constructed
Click to expand...

Are you talking about the current crop of Icepower modules? The ones I've used seem to be very well built, I've had Zero problems with the amplifier and onboard PSU .

Also very low RFI up in the FM band. The filtering seems to be darn good.

The aux power tap, however, is a different story.....
 
J

Jan-Peter

R.I.P.
Joined 2003
hypex.nl
deandob said:
Jan-Peter,

Since the release of the HG modules, have you been tweaking the design and/or components or is the first batch of HG modules exactly the same as the current ones being sold?

Regards,
Dean
Click to expand...

Indeed the design is exactly the same as the first batch. Besides some minor production changes. The first batch was not compatible with the ON/OFF line from the HG supply. Pretty stupid error...:cannotbe:

The HG series has runned several test against a lot of big "High End, Class A" names, in the most cases the HG was the amp the people likes the most.... ;)

In one particuler case the audience thought they were listening to the "Big Name" but after checking the cables/wiring they were listening to the UcD400HG with HxR and HG supplies... :angel:

Regards,

Jan-Peter
 
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