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Old 10th June 2003, 12:20 PM   #111
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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Interesting work moamps. But... how does it sound !?!? Does it ?

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Old 10th June 2003, 01:03 PM   #112
Nuuk is offline Nuuk  United Kingdom
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It seems that His Holiness didn't manage to seriously distract the die-hard croatian audiophiles
Holy Hiragas! Don't say they've made that a sin now too! I don't suppose that we could convince his Vaticaness that it's a legitimate form of birth control
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Old 10th June 2003, 04:39 PM   #113
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But... how does it sound !?!? Does it ?
How can it sound? Like Peter Daniel's GC only made with nasty parts, no attempt for resonance control, relay at output and a cathode follower at input. Based on pictures only i would say around 70% of the potential sound is realised. The presence of a cathode follower baffles me, but that's just me.
And it really looks gorgeous.


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Old 10th June 2003, 10:21 PM   #114
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Based on pictures only i would say around 70% of the potential sound is realised.
Pppppppppptttttttttttttppppppppppppppppp!!!!!!!!!! !

You should try to make some money with your skills....evaluating sound by looking at pictures....you should get an act at one of the hotels in Las Vegas! :P
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Old 10th June 2003, 10:51 PM   #115
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evaluating sound by looking at pictures
It's very difficult to claim something will sound great based on component selection, circuit topology and vibration control and quite easy to draw the opposite conclusion if all three have been neglected. With luck it may sound pleasant but the full potential remains unfulfilled.
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Old 11th June 2003, 08:52 PM   #116
moamps is offline moamps  Croatia
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Default HGC listening test

Hi,

Listening tests

Fine print: First of all, I'd like to stress that the results of this test should not and cannot be applied to all amps of this type. They are based on my own impressions (and of some people close to me) about the absolute quality and relative listening quality of this amp in comparison with some other amps. Listening preferences and hearing abilities vary from person to person so if I think that a piece of equipment works really well it's by no means meant as a general truth. This been said, I'd like to ask all those who will disagree with me to acknowledge the idea that this is, by default, a highly subjective account of my listening experience and that I have no pretension whatsoever to impose my conclusions on this esteemed readership or participate in discussions (or arguments?) about personal listening preferences.

I've been 'fiddling' with various amp designs for quite some time now but it was not until I read some interesting discussions here and saw some equally interesting projects that it dawned on me to design and build an amp 'trilogy' of sorts and draw my own comparisons and conclusions. The idea was not to try and build THE ultimate amp but to build three different amps that would be decent enough for some meaningful conclusions to be drawn. I wanted the trilogy to include an A class amp Pass Aleph 3 (small version/15W), a GC and a SET with 6C33. Actually, I had already built an Aleph3 and was pleased with it. When I was deciding on what Gainclone to build (chips, topology), I was highly influenced by Joe Rasmussen's excellent thread with some great suggestions on how to improve a typical Gainclone. Thank you Joe Rasmussen.

So, I built myself a hybrid version of a Gainclone, using the most inexpensive and easily accessible elements and parts, for which reason I had to implement things a bit differently than originally suggested by Joe. I tested it with ordinary consumer equipment like Sony QS CD and SACD/DVD players, Sony speakers, JBL Control 1 and Control 5 speakers, and DIY 2way bassreflex speakers of a friend of mine (with Thiel C23 high and Davis Velvet 17 midbass) standard Mogami interconnectors, my Aleph3 and my DIY tube preamp. Test material was based on popular choice :-)) of those present and included Dire Straits Live - On the Night, Cesaria Evora's Anthology, Norah Jones's Come Away With Me, Diana Krall - The Look of Love, The Crusaders-Rural Renewal, etc.

The GC with a buffer definitely sounded better than the GC without it because soundstage was more clearly defined, vocals were more natural, wind instruments also more defined, piano sounded less aggressive, more balanced and more integrated with the whole sound. Highest tones, which sounded aggressive and irritating on lower-quality speakers, became more pleasant and silky-sounding (e.g. Pink Panther Theme). Overall, the music was much less straining to the ear so it could be listened to and played almost indefinitely, even with the volume turned up very loud, without causing any fatigue. I hadn't been able to achieve any of this with the GCs I had built before (TDA or LM).

Although I'm aware that some people on this forum tend to claim that GC sounds better than Aleph, I must say I have never gotten such impression no matter how hard I (or those around me) tried to see their point. Aleph turned out to beat a typical GC by two classes at least. However, a hybrid GC was another story altogether and indeed offered serious competition for Aleph (they have similar distortion range) as well as it somehow managed to compensate for smaller speaker imperfections, which Aleph seemed to highlight rather mercilessly although it did have a bit better control over the low-frequency range than GC.

To sum things up, HGC is IMHO an extremely good idea which is worth an extra buck (or quid, or yen, or kuna or... oh yes, euro :-)) and effort (as its design and implementation are considerably more demanding). For those who tend to distrust the sound of an ECC88 tube or a cathode follower as such, I can only say they should give it the benefit of the doubt as the thing apparently (under the right circumstances and with His Holiness's blessing showered upon one :-)) is capable of a surprise or two.

A friend of mine and I are planning to do a few more listening tests with various speakers (Tannoy, Fostex,...) and GC amps (LM and TDA). He's famous/notorious for his 'golden ears' and an outspoken hatred of all (and I mean ALL) cathode follower concepts. I think he may be able to contribute constructively to the subject, which will conclude the final chapter of 'Amp Trilogy', Book 2 :-))

Regards
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Old 11th June 2003, 08:55 PM   #117
moamps is offline moamps  Croatia
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Default HGC

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Old 11th June 2003, 09:25 PM   #118
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Hi moamps,
You mention a SET with 6C33, but you have not compared it against GC or Aleph? I would be very interested to hear how a tube SET does compete here.
Regards
Wilfried
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Old 11th June 2003, 09:44 PM   #119
moamps is offline moamps  Croatia
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Originally posted by wiligruen
Hi moamps,
You mention a SET with 6C33, but you have not compared it against GC or Aleph? I would be very interested to hear how a tube SET does compete here.
Regards
Wilfried
Hi,

Set with 6C33 will be my next project, which means I'm going to build it in the next couple of months. I'm sorry if anyone understood that I had all 3 amps already built. Please, have patience.

Regards
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Old 11th June 2003, 10:06 PM   #120
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Hi Moamps

Quote:
and an outspoken hatred of all (and I mean ALL) cathode follower concepts. I think he may be able to contribute constructively to the subject
An interesting review. I'll certainly be looking forward to your friends commments as well. We share the same hatred Especially when an ecc88 is involved.


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