Best sounding Gainclone...

ElectricHead · 31st October 2005, 10:41 PM

After studying several GC schematics and reading many threads and websites I'm wondering what you Gaincloners consider as the best sounding circuit. I've read that some of you think that an inverted GC may sound harsh on the top.

I'm thinking about building a tube buffered GC with snubberized Carlos PSU. Yes I like snubbered PSU's.

BTW, I'm experienced in terms of tube amps.

I would be glad about some responses - thanks in advance.

Anthony Dockril · 1st November 2005, 12:17 AM

I’m just about to find out if the Non-inverted is superior to the Inverted for myself. I've just come back to Gainclones after a 2 year break.

2 Years ago the Inverted was the flavour of the month and I built a battery powered Inverted Gainclone and while I was very taken by the amp over time I found its was just not refined enough up top especially for someone who had come from valves. The Inverted clone still had many great qualities that I'd love to be able to hear again.

So I’m now about to build one of Audio Sector’s premium kits. I’ll post my findings as soon as they are built and burned in….

Cheers,

Anthony

Jay · 1st November 2005, 02:06 AM

I'm not interested in GC as a non-integrated amp. Whichever circuit I built, they are just chip amps. I'm interested in matching the GC with a pre. And my objective is matching with BOZ. And I believe IGC is better than NIGC, as an amp or integrated with BOZ.

Will · 1st November 2005, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jay
I'm interested in matching the GC with a pre. And my objective is matching with BOZ. And I believe IGC is better than NIGC, as an amp or integrated with BOZ.

Veiled... My experience with the BOZ partnering with my VBIGC is veiled. I got better results using a passive step ladder attenuator for my VBIGC than the BOZ (note my BOZ uses black gates for input and output caps yet I'm not getting good result).

regards,
will.

javven · 1st November 2005, 02:19 AM

Will I was looking at doing the same thing. Now it looks like my GC will power my front channels in my HT setup, relying on my rcvr for input. My BOZ will be done first, though (most likely) and I have no idea what I'll drive with it.

Jay · 1st November 2005, 03:02 AM

Hi Will,

Like I have said in another thread, I would like to match the LM chip with single ended IRF610 or IRL510! (BOZ). My objective is single supply, inverted opamp, and probably with common input bias network.

You may say that it does not work, but it is not that I have never built IGC+BOZ. I know that there are hundreds of probabilities to get different sound. The LM itself is very sensitive to power supply. Using Solen MKP bypass for example, outperform my BG 1000uF bypass near LM pin. The BOZ is even more sensitive to PS ripples. And we still have probabilities to match the Zout of BOZ with Zin of the opamp. Can anyone suggest a working schematic for what I'm looking for? I'm tired of burning my chips

Jay · 1st November 2005, 03:08 AM

Oh, Will, I don't think that Black Gate electrolitics are better than MKP for the input and output of the BOZ. Auricap is my favourite, black Solen is standard (high performance to price ratio). Or may be it is a break-in issue, I'm not going to wait for it.

ElectricHead · 1st November 2005, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Will

Veiled... My experience with the BOZ partnering with my VBIGC is veiled. I got better results using a passive step ladder attenuator for my VBIGC than the BOZ (note my BOZ uses black gates for input and output caps yet I'm not getting good result).

regards,
will.

I'm only interested in absolute sound quality. I'm not religious - tube or transistor. But one thing is VERY sure for me: Without an extreme good tube pre-amp you can do what you want it will never sound really good. I'm willing to build some transistor, chip or hybrid power-amps but the thing with the pre-amp is "no discussion here please". I've listened to many different pre-amps in my audiophile life and NEVER heard a non-tube pre that sounded acceptable, in most cases quite horrible.

Passive designs are mostly used by people who listened years to transistor pre-amps (no offense here), and ofcoure it is better than a semicon pre but will never beat a monster PSU tube pre with expensive parts.

ElectricHead · 1st November 2005, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jay
Oh, Will, I don't think that Black Gate electrolitics are better than MKP for the input and output of the BOZ. Auricap is my favourite, black Solen is standard (high performance to price ratio). Or may be it is a break-in issue, I'm not going to wait for it.

Well, using the overpriced, slow, muddled and dull Auricaps is a good idea to tame the nasty semicon pre sound.

Greg Erskine · 1st November 2005, 10:29 AM

Hi ElectricHead,

I would suggest you build a few P2P Gainclones and come to your own conclusion.

Regards

31st October 2005, 10:41 PM	#1
ElectricHead Banned Join Date: Oct 2005	Best sounding Gainclone... After studying several GC schematics and reading many threads and websites I'm wondering what you Gaincloners consider as the best sounding circuit. I've read that some of you think that an inverted GC may sound harsh on the top. I'm thinking about building a tube buffered GC with snubberized Carlos PSU. Yes I like snubbered PSU's. BTW, I'm experienced in terms of tube amps. I would be glad about some responses - thanks in advance.

1st November 2005, 10:29 AM	#10
Greg Erskine diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Sydney/Australia	Hi ElectricHead, I would suggest you build a few P2P Gainclones and come to your own conclusion. Regards __________________ Greg Erskine

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1st November 2005, 12:17 AM	#2
Anthony Dockril diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Australia	I’m just about to find out if the Non-inverted is superior to the Inverted for myself. I've just come back to Gainclones after a 2 year break. 2 Years ago the Inverted was the flavour of the month and I built a battery powered Inverted Gainclone and while I was very taken by the amp over time I found its was just not refined enough up top especially for someone who had come from valves. The Inverted clone still had many great qualities that I'd love to be able to hear again. So I’m now about to build one of Audio Sector’s premium kits. I’ll post my findings as soon as they are built and burned in…. Cheers, Anthony

1st November 2005, 02:06 AM	#3
Jay diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Jakarta	I'm not interested in GC as a non-integrated amp. Whichever circuit I built, they are just chip amps. I'm interested in matching the GC with a pre. And my objective is matching with BOZ. And I believe IGC is better than NIGC, as an amp or integrated with BOZ.

1st November 2005, 02:19 AM	#5
javven diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2005	Will I was looking at doing the same thing. Now it looks like my GC will power my front channels in my HT setup, relying on my rcvr for input. My BOZ will be done first, though (most likely) and I have no idea what I'll drive with it.

1st November 2005, 03:02 AM	#6
Jay diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Jakarta	Hi Will, Like I have said in another thread, I would like to match the LM chip with single ended IRF610 or IRL510! (BOZ). My objective is single supply, inverted opamp, and probably with common input bias network. You may say that it does not work, but it is not that I have never built IGC+BOZ. I know that there are hundreds of probabilities to get different sound. The LM itself is very sensitive to power supply. Using Solen MKP bypass for example, outperform my BG 1000uF bypass near LM pin. The BOZ is even more sensitive to PS ripples. And we still have probabilities to match the Zout of BOZ with Zin of the opamp. Can anyone suggest a working schematic for what I'm looking for? I'm tired of burning my chips

1st November 2005, 03:08 AM	#7
Jay diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Jakarta	Oh, Will, I don't think that Black Gate electrolitics are better than MKP for the input and output of the BOZ. Auricap is my favourite, black Solen is standard (high performance to price ratio). Or may be it is a break-in issue, I'm not going to wait for it.