Hey all,
I was reading an interesting discussion and thought I would pass the thread link along. I think it is pertinent...
http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/viewtopic.php?t=14379
David
I was reading an interesting discussion and thought I would pass the thread link along. I think it is pertinent...
http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/viewtopic.php?t=14379
David
Pertinent to what? The thread lasted just six posts because somebody had the common sense/knowledge to mention system synergy.
IMHO, there have been too many discusssions of this nature on this forum and the subject has been done to death!
For the record, I will say that my GC based system has the deepest soundstage I have heard in any system, regardless of cost!
Nick,
I just wanted to mention the discussion as I took a few points from it. To give you some background: The commercial amps they are comparing the gainclone to are in the $3,000 - $4,000 range. Also the poster is a dealer for one of the products mentioned.
This is a new thread that was only started Saturday.
For the most part, I was interested in the comparison. As you mentioned, they did not seem to try too many speaker combinations to find amore suitable match. So my question for all the GCs (any flavor) out there, what speakers work well for you?
Dave
p.s. Last year I sent you some Elna Silmics - what did you think of them?
I just wanted to mention the discussion as I took a few points from it. To give you some background: The commercial amps they are comparing the gainclone to are in the $3,000 - $4,000 range. Also the poster is a dealer for one of the products mentioned.
This is a new thread that was only started Saturday.
For the most part, I was interested in the comparison. As you mentioned, they did not seem to try too many speaker combinations to find amore suitable match. So my question for all the GCs (any flavor) out there, what speakers work well for you?
Dave
p.s. Last year I sent you some Elna Silmics - what did you think of them?
Hi Dave,
I must admit, I didn't realise that it was a new thread! But these sort of discusssions inevitably lead to bad feelings and as we have just had a 'Gainclones are not state-of-the-art' argument, I was trying to nip another one in the bud!
I'm not sure what such a debate is really trying to discover. GC builders like myself will argue that the GC is a very good amplifier and possibly scoff at those who part with thousands for somethnig commercial that may sound a tiny bit better.
Conversely, those that do spend that sort of money want the reassurance that they have got something considerably better than the DIY attempts that we make for considerably less outlay.
I doubt that we will ever bring both sides together and in any case, this is such a slippery egg to catch hold of as system synery is variable factor that makes direct comparsions somewhat meaningless.
What speakers work well with a GC? It may be a more meaningful question if we say what speakers work well with my]/b] GC in my room! ).
My open baffles work very well. Carlos FM swears by his GC with Epos 11's. Ron Clarke loves his battery powered GC's with his horn speakers. I know of a few more GC owners who swear by their horn speakers so may be there is a synergy there - I am yet to try them.
The Silmics? I'm sorry to tell you that they never arrived. I didn't say anything in case you had simply forgotten to send them or found a use for them after all. I guess a postman somewhere is enjoying them in his GC! (What else would a postman listen to?)
I must admit, I didn't realise that it was a new thread! But these sort of discusssions inevitably lead to bad feelings and as we have just had a 'Gainclones are not state-of-the-art' argument, I was trying to nip another one in the bud!
I'm not sure what such a debate is really trying to discover. GC builders like myself will argue that the GC is a very good amplifier and possibly scoff at those who part with thousands for somethnig commercial that may sound a tiny bit better.
Conversely, those that do spend that sort of money want the reassurance that they have got something considerably better than the DIY attempts that we make for considerably less outlay.
I doubt that we will ever bring both sides together and in any case, this is such a slippery egg to catch hold of as system synery is variable factor that makes direct comparsions somewhat meaningless.
What speakers work well with a GC? It may be a more meaningful question if we say what speakers work well with my]/b] GC in my room! ).
My open baffles work very well. Carlos FM swears by his GC with Epos 11's. Ron Clarke loves his battery powered GC's with his horn speakers. I know of a few more GC owners who swear by their horn speakers so may be there is a synergy there - I am yet to try them.
The Silmics? I'm sorry to tell you that they never arrived. I didn't say anything in case you had simply forgotten to send them or found a use for them after all. I guess a postman somewhere is enjoying them in his GC! (What else would a postman listen to?
)Nuuk said:
t. said:Also not all GC's are the same
I went a long way to have the results I have now.
My first GC was very typical: unregulated low capacitance PSU, no zobel (or call it snubber), no series resistors, and LM3875 chips.
At the time I tested many commercial speakers and the results were not convincing.
The amp couldn't drive most of them.
Also, speaker cables type made a huge effect on the sound, they made the amp sound horrible to very good.
All this is past, all that water has passed under the bridge.
For a long time I'm using the LM3886, a better choice IMHO, along with several other tricks I've posted here.
My Epos ES11 speakers are not easy to drive and I couldn't rest until I could make them sing properly, as I love them.
I will take my amps now to anywhere, to test with most common speakers and cables and it sounds very good: very detailed, harmonics and note decays to die for, magical midband, tight and dynamic bass, with "slam", with authority.
Bring on the commercial amps to compare, I'm ready.
EDIT: Instead of dispersing your attention through other forums, you guys should be where the action is: diyaudio.com
My friend in Alice Springs would like to hear them Carlos. Have you got a current passport?
Seriously, you make a good point. Many of us have put an awful lot of work into developing our GC's and may be that is why we are a little bit touchy about seeing a bog standard chip amp put up against 'the opposition'!
Spot on boys
Strange you mentioned about the speaker cable Carlos, I now find that the cable that wouldn't work with my first unregged/unbuffered GC now sounds great with my current GC.
The biggest achievment with my GC is the bass tightness and power, it sounded like crap with the standard clone
Strange you mentioned about the speaker cable Carlos, I now find that the cable that wouldn't work with my first unregged/unbuffered GC now sounds great with my current GC.
The biggest achievment with my GC is the bass tightness and power, it sounded like crap with the standard clone
Nuuk said:My friend in Alice Springs would like to hear them Carlos. Have you got a current passport?
A simple ID card is enough to travel through all the UE.
Bring your friend, there's good music, beers and whisky, whatever makes you fancy.
I'm makin' a small LM1875 amp for my bench/computer.
This small amp is on my main system right now driving my Epos speakers in a way I would think impossible a year ago.
The chip hasn't chage, it's just the way to use it.
Nuuk said:Seriously, you make a good point. Many of us have put an awful lot of work into developing our GC's and may be that is why we are a little bit touchy about seeing a bog standard chip amp put up against 'the opposition'!
Absolutely.
Nuuk said:
Oh!
Coolness.
I wonder who is it...
I'm still using Alpha pots that a very nice forum member sent me from New Zealand.
Optimising GC's
Carlosfm,
Perhaps you should post a summary of the major mods/tweaks to making the LM3886 sound so good. To some extent they are scattered all over the site, on a number of posts and interwoven with much noise.
I'm sure the list will be appreciated by most here, especially since many start off with the 3875 sounding a tad bright...
Carlosfm,
Perhaps you should post a summary of the major mods/tweaks to making the LM3886 sound so good. To some extent they are scattered all over the site, on a number of posts and interwoven with much noise.
I'm sure the list will be appreciated by most here, especially since many start off with the 3875 sounding a tad bright...
Hi Carlos!
I was thinking about building a gainclone using LM 3886. Since I feel a bit lazy about trying different variations and resistor values, I will highly appreciate if you could post the schematics of the actual arrangement (and values) you are currently using. I am sure it sounds better than the “ordinary” schematics. (on the National datasheet).
By the way, I was thinking to make it battery powered; by using four 12v 7 AH sealed lead-acid batteries. So I will get +-24 V.
Now the question is: if one side of power supply (two batteries in series) discharges more rapidly than the other one, what happens to the DC offset? (Say one side drops to 22v, while the other one still holds at 24 v)
Second, is it acceptable to run both channels from the same battery pack?
I apologize for these off-topic questions, but I didn’t feel like starting a new thread…
Best regards
Vix
I was thinking about building a gainclone using LM 3886. Since I feel a bit lazy about trying different variations and resistor values, I will highly appreciate if you could post the schematics of the actual arrangement (and values) you are currently using. I am sure it sounds better than the “ordinary” schematics. (on the National datasheet).
By the way, I was thinking to make it battery powered; by using four 12v 7 AH sealed lead-acid batteries. So I will get +-24 V.
Now the question is: if one side of power supply (two batteries in series) discharges more rapidly than the other one, what happens to the DC offset? (Say one side drops to 22v, while the other one still holds at 24 v)
Second, is it acceptable to run both channels from the same battery pack?
I apologize for these off-topic questions, but I didn’t feel like starting a new thread…
Best regards
Vix
Re: Optimising GC's
My thread was closed by the mods before I could post the complete schematic.
They never re-opened the thread, as promised.
I've later posted the complete schematic on other threads by members' request, and I understand that it's hard to find.
Not my fault, though.
Dr.H said:
My thread was closed by the mods before I could post the complete schematic.
They never re-opened the thread, as promised.
I've later posted the complete schematic on other threads by members' request, and I understand that it's hard to find.
Not my fault, though.
Vix said:
You should see no effect on the DC offset with rail variation on the order you describe, as the offset is not a function of rail voltage. In theory, you would only see clipping earlier on one side of the output swing. But how about in practice? I actually fried one side of my regulated power supply, by poking around and creating a short. That resulted on one rail being at the regulated 24 volts, and the other being unregulated at 35V (don't remember which was + or -). I saw no change in DC offset.
Sheldon
Re: Bloody windows zip
Sorry, you have to use Winzip 9.
I had to use maximum (non-compatible) compression to post the file here, as the maximum size is 100Kb.
Whatever.
No, use what you have for a total capacitance of around 10,000uf.
With that voltage you need to regulate.
Around +/- 30V is a "universal" voltage for these chips, either you have 8 or 4 ohm speakers.
D_GR8_1 said:
Sorry, you have to use Winzip 9.
I had to use maximum (non-compatible) compression to post the file here, as the maximum size is 100Kb.
D_GR8_1 said:
Whatever.
D_GR8_1 said:
No, use what you have for a total capacitance of around 10,000uf.
D_GR8_1 said:
With that voltage you need to regulate.
Around +/- 30V is a "universal" voltage for these chips, either you have 8 or 4 ohm speakers.
Carlos,
In another post you say that your pre-amp uses OPA627/BUF634 config.
So you have a pre-amp with these devices & then you buffer the signal with the OPA627 right?
So if I needed to filter the signal it would mean I have to add another stage between the filter & the buffer?
Thanks for your help.
In another post you say that your pre-amp uses OPA627/BUF634 config.
So you have a pre-amp with these devices & then you buffer the signal with the OPA627 right?
So if I needed to filter the signal it would mean I have to add another stage between the filter & the buffer?
Thanks for your help.
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