True clone design

[kartoffel]

I'm about to take my first leap into building an amp. I've decided that for my first project the "gainclones" should be perfect for me. It sounds like the designs are well established and it will be up to me and my soldering skills to make it work.

This is what I want to do. Make as close as possible to a true clone of the orignal gaincard as possible. Even down to the Humptydumpty powersupply. I want this to be my "reference" system as I learn more about audio. Then I can try out everyone's spin on the design.

Can someone point me to a schematic of what the general consensus is for the partlist (brands and values) and schematic for the amp and powersupply? It shouldn't be hard to give it to me since there are so few parts . The schematic I basically have I'm just wondering about the actual values. I've found tons of websites all over the net but each seems to put their own spin on the design and I want to try to start from the beginning.

Maybe someone here has built what they consider a true clone. I'd like to hear what components you used. Even down to the wire. (since I only need 2x32mm I can splurge on Ag )

I'm especially confused about choosing the transformer. Can someone just tell me what to get for that (in the US) remembering I want to truly clone the humpty.

Finally can someone tell me the outside diameter of the humpty psu?

Finally I want to use p2p wiring for the design (not pcb). I read somewhere that I shouldn't use protoboard. How would I wire it up? What sort of board would I use (digikey or relevant part/manufacturer id #'s would be helpful)? I've read references to peter d's p2p design but I can't find an image of it. I've seen the "supposed" actual gaincard circuit and I don't believe it's real. But what is the board called it's built on. Like protoboard without the holes.

That should be it with the question until I find out more about the parts I need to order.

If this has been covered before just post the links. I've seen the links to decible dungeon but I think I want something a little different.

Thanks
Jeff

[Nuuk]

I don't know the exact 'recipe' of the original Gaincard, and possibly nobody outside of 47Labs does if you are talking about details of wire etc!

If I remember correctly, the Gaincard used a custom made transformer for the power supply so you would have to find out the exact specifiaction and have one made.

So, nice idea but a little difficult to do 100%!

My suggestion? Start with any one of the minimal designs that you have seen around. Make it and use that as your reference point as you try all the variations.

[ofb]

two cents,

kartoffel, i started digging though the literature with a similar intent. after considerable reading and weighing, i suggest you take nuuk's excellent advice.

by all means, read and weigh for yourself, but i do think you will come to the same conclusion so you might as well get started soldering. you'll have good music sooner.

and are the photos fake? please consider the legitimate shigaraki photos as well, if you have not already.
http://www.hifi.nl/recensies.php?id=1966

the board in the 'supposed' gaincard photos is a homemade style pcb. if you want to build a purist gc as you describe, you'll be doing that using the tidy layout shown, not p2p.

but as nuuk says, we don't know all the values, or all the types. nor have we sourced the type of transformer described in the humpty. better to build one of minimalist circuits that have been shared by people who've already started at the beginning. their different spins are first to fill in the blanks in what was known, and second to improve on their results. there is no complete description of the gaincard hidden and ignored somewhere.

or go do *all* the reading. it worked for me. everything you can ask is already discussed and archived for your leisure. google awaits.

[kartoffel]

I understand. I'm just about lost in a sea of designs. Can someone point me to a well described minimalist setup? Especially the powersupply.

Is one of the avel transformers from parts express fine for this amp?

Jeff

[platenspeler]

Hi Kartoffel,

Jerry and I made a clone that more or less resembles the original, look at platenspeler.com gainclone pages under Cyclone project. The Geenkloon project contains the easiest configuration for building an non-inverted clone.

On the other side, you might want to start with a kit of BrianGT, which includes a PCB and all components.



Maarten

[kartoffel]

Maarten,

I read your pages last night. Can you give me dimensions of your cyclone cases and the powersupply diameter? I like how they look and I was thinking of putting mine together like that. (I haven't completely decided on the round powersupply yet). I realize these things are small but I never have a real idea of the scale.

I also read your geenkloon page and so far that has been the closest to what I want to do. I was just looking for a US based design because sometimes that's a little easier for the newbie to know what parts to get.

Thanks
Jeff

[ofb]

the briangt kit is a "well described minimalist setup". make a schematic of it and see.

if you dig through the archived experiments of peter daniel you will see much of its parentage there. also the kit makes it very easy to get your components. it's a very good choice for building what you are asking.

there's a couple of psu schematics here, http://gainclone.com/ps_gc_1.gif

for information on putting this all together into a finished amplifier, keep reading decibel dungeon. it can sound like a broken record, but reading DD is often the best answer to all beginner questions. nuuk did a wonderful job of describing everything for the beginner. very kind of him.

for a particular transformer part # in america, i'm not sure. perhaps someone can help out there? i've lost track of what are the popular choices at the moment. (check the briangt kit pdf too -- perhaps there is a recommendation there.)

[cantskienuf]

I used the Avel transformers from Parts Express in mine. Built monoblocks with a 160vA PTx in each. You may want to think about adding some AC line conditioning in front of them though. My BrianGT premium NIGC amps pick up more AC noise than my tube gear does. A JR recipe line conditioner fixes it right up. If I were building them again, I'd put one in each box for convenience.

[kartoffel]

Originally posted by cantskienuf
A JR recipe line conditioner fixes it right up. If I were building them again, I'd put one in each box for convenience.

Can you post links to plans for this? I couldn't find it.

Jeff

[cantskienuf]

Here is the link to the recipe:

http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/surge.htm

I got all my components from Mouser. I looked back through my orders and I'm pretty sure these are the part numbers.

.047uF capacitors #539-158X473
.01uF capacitors #539-158X103
100uH inductors #70-IH-10-100
150 VRMS MOVs #576-V20E150
10 amp circuit breakers #655-W28-XQ1A-10

I built them on Radio Shack perf board cut to appropriate size, stuffed that in a three-gang outlet box from Home Depot, drilled a 7/16" hole in a blank end panel cover (get the segmented snap-together pieces at $1.79 each) to mount the circuit breaker, added a blank center panel cover, and put a Pass & Seymour heavy duty grade outlet with an end outlet cover in the third gang. Input was braided 12-3 stranded hardwired to the circuit breaker and terminated to a Pass & Seymour heavy duty grade plug. This makes it an in-line unit that I can move to any of my devices. But next time I build an amp, I think I'll just add this conditioning circuit inside the amp after the switch and in front of the power transformer.