Mundorf AG 10000uf or 10 x 1000uf Elna silmic 2 for psu - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Amplifiers > Chip Amps

Chip Amps Amplifiers based on integrated circuits

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th August 2012, 09:32 AM   #1
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Default Mundorf AG 10000uf or 10 x 1000uf Elna silmic 2 for psu

Is it recommended to use 1000uf/35v silmic2 x 10 pieces in parallel rather than one 10000uf Mundorf AG Mlytic? The reasons are paralleling the caps will reduce the esr by 10 times and the ripple current of each silmic 2 caps is 1.6 Amps and x 10 will be 16 amperes. If I take just Mundorf it gives only 4.8 amps. But i dont have the esr for the silmic2 i believe using this will reduce the esr substantially resulting strong psu.

Does anybody knows the esr of the silmic 2 I couldnt find it in the datasheet.

I found this kind of psu system in Aussieamplifiers ..
http://www.aussieamplifiers.com/nxv101_2_1.jpg

whats your opinion. Which is better in this case?

price wise both come to close but ripple current will be pretty high and esr will be pretty low. Im only concerned with the signature of these two caps.

If the signature of elna silmic 2 is better then its better to use these as psu caps. The ripple current using in 10 parallel caps is higher than the Mundorf Mlytic HC+ which is phenomenal... but if anybody says to use Silmic 2 as psu it would be great.. On bulk purchase we can get better pricing on silmic2 caps..

Last edited by rhythmsandy; 11th August 2012 at 09:36 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th October 2014, 08:51 PM   #2
Rewind is offline Rewind  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
Rewind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
From what I read, 10000-15000 is a good number. What happened to your project?
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th October 2014, 01:22 PM   #3
frank1 is offline frank1  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Devon UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhythmsandy View Post
Im only concerned with the signature of these two caps.
You are worrying needlessly. Its a power supply!
Just use good quality caps and stop reading the rubbish published about power supply capacitors.
Frank.
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th October 2014, 01:33 PM   #4
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Scottish Borders
These are my thoughts developed over a few years:

The local decoupling supply the fast changing current demands of the load.
The smoothing capacitors see the mains voltage variations and the resulting current variations, but have to supply the slower changing load current demands.

A PSU that is working in conjunction with an adequate local decoupling implementation does not have much impact on the medium frequency and no impact on the high frequency performance of an amplifier.
The smoothing capacitors that meet ordinary commercial and industrial standards can adequately meet all the demands of a current varying load when the local decoupling is well implemented.

However, a badly implemented local decoupling scheme, or a load that has no local decoupling will put quite different demands on the PSU. Do it wrong and the performance will be adversely affected.
__________________
regards Andrew T.
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 04:23 PM   #5
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Agreed andrew I was in the similar thought I tried silmic2 i didnt understand why people are behind it. I tried using it everywhere like decoupling near the pins of both the transistor pins VAS decoupling, at feedback cap, tried even directly at psu. Overall it doesnt have transparent signature and it sounds as if there is some phase issue on the entire spectrum. I have tried all together even as input coupling caps. Finally a big No to silmics as it was smearing all the details and layers in the music. Instead I would like to get something like smoother by increasing the details but this does opposite.. but some like that signature of bland sound...
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 04:26 PM   #6
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Im thinking this possibility as using 100uF/100V at the decoupling location like Nichicon FG and then using a large psu cap as large as 100000uF Industrial grade to take the beating and then use a 10000uF Nichicon KG or KS along with the big one. What do you say in this case?
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 05:40 PM   #7
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Scottish Borders
Quote:
a big No to silmics as it was smearing all the details and layers in the music.
you changed what capacitor, in what amplifier, to hear this unknown sound effect?
__________________
regards Andrew T.
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 06:11 PM   #8
Rewind is offline Rewind  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
Rewind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhythmsandy View Post
Im thinking this possibility as using 100uF/100V at the decoupling location like Nichicon FG and then using a large psu cap as large as 100000uF Industrial grade to take the beating and then use a 10000uF Nichicon KG or KS along with the big one. What do you say in this case?
That is my plan with the F4 and F5. I will use 69.000uf 80V. Four of them. One of them will be 68 000 uf because I can't find a similar one.

I wonder how 68-69 000uf affects the choice of other components. I will still use the Universal Power Supply from the DIYaudio store. Is it just to replace the 10 000 uf caps? I doubt.

Last edited by Rewind; 8th October 2014 at 06:20 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 08:11 PM   #9
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: New Zealand
Default Decoupling capacitance?

Hi Andrew

Do you know how the value of the decoupling capacitance is worked out - is say, a 10:1 ratio between smoothing and decoupling capcitance a good starting guideline?
Are there any benefits to maximising the decoupling capacitance providing the quality of the cap (ESR, ESL) between different valued caps is the same?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewT View Post
These are my thoughts developed over a few years:

The local decoupling supply the fast changing current demands of the load.
The smoothing capacitors see the mains voltage variations and the resulting current variations, but have to supply the slower changing load current demands.

A PSU that is working in conjunction with an adequate local decoupling implementation does not have much impact on the medium frequency and no impact on the high frequency performance of an amplifier.
The smoothing capacitors that meet ordinary commercial and industrial standards can adequately meet all the demands of a current varying load when the local decoupling is well implemented.

However, a badly implemented local decoupling scheme, or a load that has no local decoupling will put quite different demands on the PSU. Do it wrong and the performance will be adversely affected.

Last edited by marcus1; 8th October 2014 at 08:23 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th October 2014, 08:27 PM   #10
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
LM3886 Bypassing Revisited (applies to other chip amps as well)

Marcus, start there. Should give a good primer.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Elna Silmic II or Elna Cerafine? rg12 Parts 77 16th June 2014 05:16 AM
Mundorf "M-LYTIC AG" psu caps for Salas hotrodded blue DCB1 build dvb projekt Group Buys 80 25th October 2010 03:54 PM
Need some Elna Silmic II Stefanoo Parts 6 18th November 2008 10:43 AM
WTB: ELNA Silmic 1000uF/50V deskmate88 Swap Meet 2 16th April 2007 04:28 PM
Elna Silmic capacitors Jules Swap Meet 4 9th June 2002 05:43 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:05 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright Đ1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2