What I noticed about Millwood is a symptom otherwise described as 'one track mind'. His perception is set only on one POV and he doesn't accept any other possibilities. Whenever he sees an opportunity, he tries to enforce his POV, with remarks and opinions that sometimes seem completely out of place. He does not seem like an average DIYer, but as a censor, looking for weak reasoning among other forum members. Personally, I don't feel comfortable facing that type of attitude.
I also didn't notice anybody else on this forum, being this persistant in doing what he's doing.
I also didn't notice anybody else on this forum, being this persistant in doing what he's doing.
What I noticed about Peter is a symptom otherwise described as 'one track mind'. His perception is set only on one POV and he doesn't accept any other possibilities. Whenever he sees an opportunity, he tries to enforce his POV, with remarks and opinions that sometimes seem completely out of place. He does not seem like an average DIYer, but as a censor, looking for weak reasoning among other forum members. Personally, I don't feel comfortable facing that type of attitude.
I also didn't notice anybody else on this forum, being this persistant in doing what he's doing.
Does that sound pretty one-track minded?
I also didn't notice anybody else on this forum, being this persistant in doing what he's doing.
Does that sound pretty one-track minded?
It is true, that I could also be regarded 'one track minded'; the only difference is, I'm not arguing about that the way you do. I just let it go and you don't.
In my case it could also be regarded as dedication, passion or just looking for better ways. You, OTOH, represent all the low key 'virtues' like doubt, despising, being hopeless or just stagnation.
My let go attitude doesn't apply towards you.
In my case it could also be regarded as dedication, passion or just looking for better ways. You, OTOH, represent all the low key 'virtues' like doubt, despising, being hopeless or just stagnation.
My let go attitude doesn't apply towards you.
Peter Daniel said:
you cannot box with one-hand, an old saying has it.
You just cannot accept the fact that people can disagree with you. and resistors don't sound different to the rest of us. and using a sil-pad doesn't make a difference. and damping has no impact on sound. and that egyptian maple box contributed exact nothing to sound. and ...
I never expect you to agree with me. But I do expect people to be able to lay out the facts and agree to disagree.
Your efforts in silencing others as a forum moderator, potentially for commercial gains, don't reflect well on you.
millwood said:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17383&highlight=
Mill, there are various desserts available that go well with the dish called "foot in mouth." One is called humble pie. I know, I've had to make some of my own past meals palatable.
ensen.SY said:
I would be happy to be wrong on this. But I need convincing.
purplepeople said:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17383&highlight=
Mill, there are various desserts available that go well with the dish called "foot in mouth." One is called humble pie. I know, I've had to make some of my own past meals palatable.
Thanks, Pur. I wil leave all of that for you to enjoy, alone,
Give it a rest for 2 days as far as this thread is concerned. If you take up the same line elsewhere or continue in this thread, you will be back in the SinBin.
millwood said:
When I reread your post I see a generalisation meaning that only Peter is the one that hears the difference and "the rest of us " don't hear that. Being one of "the rest" I think that there a *lot* of people hearing the difference. It all depends if you want to do something with that. I for sure don't go as far as some do but do test my components for sonical and technical performance. Direct comparing with non-audio non-technical people confirms my own findings with respect to sonical differences between certain components.
But then again some people claim all opamps sound the same etc. No need for convincing other people nor having an attitude towards the ones that do put time in that what they're convinced in.
a short history
altyhough i am pretty new to the whole diy audio thing, i have been tweaking my own GC for the last couple of days and i must say that i do hear the difference in certain components.
Whereas some components (DC coupling caps, feedback resistor) have a great impact on sound quality, some other components have less impact on it.
I am not only speaking about the much praised Black gates and other *really high end* stuff (as I have not tried those (yet)) but one can really hear the difference between standard el cheapo capacitors & in my case, sprague capacitors, 0.25W5% resistors (carbon film) & 1W1% metal film resistors.
On the other hand, I have not (yet?) heard the difference between some cheap EUR 2 speaker terminals and the speaker terminals I recently bought (EUR 14).
I have also not heard the difference between the wooden plank my GC's are currently stuffed onto and the stainless steel box I intend to mount them in (believe me, i've tried).
On the first hand again, while I've never believed the BS stories of so called "burning in" of interconnects, I recently made some pure silver interconnects. When i first connected them they sounded horrible, absolutely horrible. I let my CD player play all night (repeat, repeat etc) with my amps on volume 0, and the next morning they sounded better than the vd Hul Interconnects I was used to. ALthough I still don't know how and why this works, it works. Strange but true.
The same goed for speaker cables. I used to use normal el cheapo speaker cable, then i switched to the TNTaudio triple T speaker cable. That sounded horrible on my GC. When i read that GC;s don't like high capacitance speakers cable I tried a simple CAT5 (1strand +, the rest -) cable. I did notice a great difference -and for the better that is...
Still, I dont't know why this works but hey, it works. Who cares!
Now, do I belong to "the rest of us" or not? That, imho, is for you to decide...
My $0.02 worth...
heck, i'm getting the hang of this diy thing!
altyhough i am pretty new to the whole diy audio thing, i have been tweaking my own GC for the last couple of days and i must say that i do hear the difference in certain components.
Whereas some components (DC coupling caps, feedback resistor) have a great impact on sound quality, some other components have less impact on it.
I am not only speaking about the much praised Black gates and other *really high end* stuff (as I have not tried those (yet)) but one can really hear the difference between standard el cheapo capacitors & in my case, sprague capacitors, 0.25W5% resistors (carbon film) & 1W1% metal film resistors.
On the other hand, I have not (yet?) heard the difference between some cheap EUR 2 speaker terminals and the speaker terminals I recently bought (EUR 14).
I have also not heard the difference between the wooden plank my GC's are currently stuffed onto and the stainless steel box I intend to mount them in (believe me, i've tried).
On the first hand again, while I've never believed the BS stories of so called "burning in" of interconnects, I recently made some pure silver interconnects. When i first connected them they sounded horrible, absolutely horrible. I let my CD player play all night (repeat, repeat etc) with my amps on volume 0, and the next morning they sounded better than the vd Hul Interconnects I was used to. ALthough I still don't know how and why this works, it works. Strange but true.
The same goed for speaker cables. I used to use normal el cheapo speaker cable, then i switched to the TNTaudio triple T speaker cable. That sounded horrible on my GC. When i read that GC;s don't like high capacitance speakers cable I tried a simple CAT5 (1strand +, the rest -) cable. I did notice a great difference -and for the better that is...
Still, I dont't know why this works but hey, it works. Who cares!
Now, do I belong to "the rest of us" or not? That, imho, is for you to decide...
My $0.02 worth...
heck, i'm getting the hang of this diy thing!
Spec's on the Ebay GainClone (from the seller's e-mail):
The caps are not Black Gate but new parts just the same. I do not remember
if they are Mallory or Panasonic. One or the other.
All resistors are
soldered directly on the LM3875TF chips. All parts are point to point
soldering. There is no card per say like the original. The feedback resistor
is 22K. (GnD Note: This must be a typo - should be 220k) If I recall, all resistors are metal film by Phillips. All are 1%
tolerance. And yes, all components are hand matched.
This amplifier has been
running on a 24 hour a day for over two months without a glitch. I know it
will arrive in good shape. This is not the inverted but like the original
non inverted type. I tried both and the inverted is less involving_ with
less detailing and less resolving as well.
I would like to point out that the casing for such an amplifier is crucial.
And this is a casing that was originally intended for submarines in their
radio installation. The price of such a casing is 250.00$ alone. There is no
RFs here with this thick aluminum brass coated solid milled block .
The caps are not Black Gate but new parts just the same. I do not remember
if they are Mallory or Panasonic. One or the other.
All resistors are
soldered directly on the LM3875TF chips. All parts are point to point
soldering. There is no card per say like the original. The feedback resistor
is 22K. (GnD Note: This must be a typo - should be 220k) If I recall, all resistors are metal film by Phillips. All are 1%
tolerance. And yes, all components are hand matched.
This amplifier has been
running on a 24 hour a day for over two months without a glitch. I know it
will arrive in good shape. This is not the inverted but like the original
non inverted type. I tried both and the inverted is less involving_ with
less detailing and less resolving as well.
I would like to point out that the casing for such an amplifier is crucial.
And this is a casing that was originally intended for submarines in their
radio installation. The price of such a casing is 250.00$ alone. There is no
RFs here with this thick aluminum brass coated solid milled block .
Just my 2 cents...
After reading all the replies and the storm this seems to have started, I thought I'd check out the auction on E-Bay!
As far as I can see, there is nothing wrong with what this chap has done. I believe that the crucial point is that he is (or at least appears to be) selling just one unit, privately. This is quite different from commercially selling replicas in volume. Here is a parallel if you like from the car industry. I think this is a good analogy. The Porsche 550 race car, manufactured around half a century ago. A number of manufacturers today are making copies of this car. They are however not allowed to mention Porsche anywhere in the description of the car. This does not stop the odd owner of such a replica advertising his car for sale as a Porsche 550 replica and many people do advertise their cars as such.
In the ad, the poster uses the word 'clone'. To me this suggests that it's not the original from 47 labs and therefore any claims about its performance are purely the opinion of the author. Likewise if I see an ad for a replica Porsche 550, I'm going to take all the quoted specs with a grain of salt as I know it wasn't produced in the Porsche factory.
The poster quotes the price of the original amp that was copied. He also quotes the price of some amp made by some other company. So what?
Regarding the starting price of $500, I would think he is free to ask whatever price he wants to ask. Some people seem to be suggesting that the materials in the amp aren't worth the $500 starting bid, and that therefore something sinister is going on. To that I would say that material cost sometimes has nothing to do with asking price. If I paint a painting and ask 10000 Euros for it, what's the problem? Think about that too the next time you pay 2 Euros 50 for a can of coke at a fair. Secondly, maybe the amp did cost quite a lot to build. Maybe a lot more than $500. I'm getting side-tracked but....
... more than ten years ago I built a LM1875 based amp. It was my first real DIY amp and by the time I'd bought all the bits and pieces from the local bits and pieces retailer, the amp cost more than $300 US, and it didn't even look pretty. Likewise I've had things made out of aluminium billets and the tooling gets extremely expensive! Custom stuff costs a lot!
Really it's just a case of buyer beware IMO.
...and just to be sure, no it's not me either.
PS, is my LM1875 amp classed as a Gainclone, even though I built it before there was such a thing as the Gaincard? It seems to have very similar components, all gathered from the device application sheet.
After reading all the replies and the storm this seems to have started, I thought I'd check out the auction on E-Bay!
As far as I can see, there is nothing wrong with what this chap has done. I believe that the crucial point is that he is (or at least appears to be) selling just one unit, privately. This is quite different from commercially selling replicas in volume. Here is a parallel if you like from the car industry. I think this is a good analogy. The Porsche 550 race car, manufactured around half a century ago. A number of manufacturers today are making copies of this car. They are however not allowed to mention Porsche anywhere in the description of the car. This does not stop the odd owner of such a replica advertising his car for sale as a Porsche 550 replica and many people do advertise their cars as such.
In the ad, the poster uses the word 'clone'. To me this suggests that it's not the original from 47 labs and therefore any claims about its performance are purely the opinion of the author. Likewise if I see an ad for a replica Porsche 550, I'm going to take all the quoted specs with a grain of salt as I know it wasn't produced in the Porsche factory.
The poster quotes the price of the original amp that was copied. He also quotes the price of some amp made by some other company. So what?
Regarding the starting price of $500, I would think he is free to ask whatever price he wants to ask. Some people seem to be suggesting that the materials in the amp aren't worth the $500 starting bid, and that therefore something sinister is going on. To that I would say that material cost sometimes has nothing to do with asking price. If I paint a painting and ask 10000 Euros for it, what's the problem? Think about that too the next time you pay 2 Euros 50 for a can of coke at a fair.
Secondly, maybe the amp did cost quite a lot to build. Maybe a lot more than $500. I'm getting side-tracked but....... more than ten years ago I built a LM1875 based amp. It was my first real DIY amp and by the time I'd bought all the bits and pieces from the local bits and pieces retailer, the amp cost more than $300 US, and it didn't even look pretty. Likewise I've had things made out of aluminium billets and the tooling gets extremely expensive! Custom stuff costs a lot!
Really it's just a case of buyer beware IMO.
...and just to be sure, no it's not me either.
PS, is my LM1875 amp classed as a Gainclone, even though I built it before there was such a thing as the Gaincard?
It seems to have very similar components, all gathered from the device application sheet. - Status
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