Craftsmanship and engineering - Page 3 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Amplifiers > Chip Amps

Chip Amps Amplifiers based on integrated circuits

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 25th July 2003, 09:06 PM   #21
diyAudio Member
 
Steve Eddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Sacramento, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by analog_sa
Am i?
...i don't insist preaching to the deaf...

Who are the deaf referred to here?

Quote:
I know you are not, but you won't be caught dead sharing a subjective experience, right? As it doesn't tally well with the theory
I tend not to share subjective experience primarily because I don't take the flyspeck approach to listening that most seem to do so I can't relate my experience in such terms. I listen intuitively and ultimately can only say what it is that I like or don't like.

Also, my particular subjective tastes and preferences aren't the same as everyone else's (nor is anyone else's the same as everyone else's) so I don't see a whole lot of value to it and prefer to simply try things for myself and encourage others to try things for themselves.

And no, my particular tastes and preferences don't have any particular correlation with objective techincal specs and measurements.

se
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 09:11 PM   #22
Pedja is offline Pedja  Serbia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Belgrade
Default chips...

Quote:
Originally posted by Gerontius
The reason that our power opamp audio amplifiers sound good is because of years of science and engineering, and by good design and implementation by teams of engineers National, TI, and others.
Yup, thanks to all of them. However, you’ll hardly find anything there you can call “their own design” – implemented circuits are quite known. I personally wait for that moment when they discover CFB power amp. I will probably forget discrete amps then.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gerontius
We're all just craftsmen putting them in various boxes.
Call it whatever you want to. But, what the difference does it make?

Quote:
Originally posted by Gerontius
2 inches of hookup wire in a case or 2 feet of hookup wire in a power umbililical can't, and do not, have a "sonic signature". They just don't.
I thought the same (because it was “logical” to me) unless I replaced mentioned 2 inches of wire in my passive pre.

Pedja
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 09:29 PM   #23
diyAudio Member
 
analog_sa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Sofia
Quote:
And no, my particular tastes and preferences don't have any particular correlation with objective techincal specs and measurements
I know that. Nor do mine, but a lot of people have a problem with that. I attribute it to aural-deficiency induced bitterness And god help if they've passed a few engineering (and it appears also financial ) courses.
My hearing is not sensational; i hardly hear above 15kHz and certainly am not that perceptive to long term effects like cable burn-in. Do i accuse anyone with better hearing/perception in being deluded or high on placebo pills?

peter
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 09:37 PM   #24
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: US
I guess the point in the whole discussion is that we shall take those golden-ear type claims with a huge grain of salt.

After all, none of them has had the guts to put their claims to an objective test and win $10K of easy money in the process.

But they have no problem insisting on their super-human hearings and their equally super-sounding amps,

No wonder it has been pretty hard selling those amps to san people.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 09:43 PM   #25
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Guys, have some sympathy for me. I've got a crummy 28.8 dialup and a screaming 2 year old. I don't need to spend my time moving yet more of your posts to Texas.
__________________
The more you pay for it, the less inclined you are to doubt it.- George Smiley
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 09:44 PM   #26
Pedja is offline Pedja  Serbia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Belgrade
Quote:
Originally posted by millwood
After all, none of them has had the guts to put their claims to an objective test and win $10K of easy money in the process.
There is not an “objective” test.

Pedja
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 10:01 PM   #27
diyAudio Member
 
Peter Daniel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Send a message via AIM to Peter Daniel
Quote:
Originally posted by millwood
After all, none of them has had the guts to put their claims to an objective test and win $10K of easy money in the process.

But they have no problem insisting on their super-human hearings and their equally super-sounding amps,

No wonder it has been pretty hard selling those amps to san people.

Here's a good read for you. I don't think you've seen this thread and I suspect you might like it
Blind Listening Tests & Amplifiers
__________________
www.audiosector.com
“Do something really well. See how much time it takes. It might be a product, a work of art, who knows? Then give it away cheaply, just because you feel that it should not cost so much, even if it took a lot of time and expensive materials to make it.” - JC
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 10:08 PM   #28
diyAudio Member
 
Peter Daniel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Send a message via AIM to Peter Daniel
Now, here's something to make more so called "golden ear" doubts

As some of you know already, I've been replacing Riken resistors in my amps, because Caddocks appeared to sound better. Now if there was no difference between resistors, do you think I would go through all the trouble to replace them in 20 amps of our initial run? We gave the job to some technician who supposedly new good soldering practices. I was just about to send one amp to Netherlands, but decided to listen to it one more time before shipment. The amp sounded not as I remembered it, the sound was sort of disjoined, artificial and annoying. I opened the amp and this is what I saw (have a look at Caddock feedback resistor)
Attached Images
File Type: jpg r1.jpg (32.1 KB, 436 views)
__________________
www.audiosector.com
“Do something really well. See how much time it takes. It might be a product, a work of art, who knows? Then give it away cheaply, just because you feel that it should not cost so much, even if it took a lot of time and expensive materials to make it.” - JC
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 10:14 PM   #29
diyAudio Member
 
Peter Daniel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Send a message via AIM to Peter Daniel
Now, I was always trying to mount feedback resistor very close to the IC pins, mostly because I was told that short feedback loop was important in this amp and also it looks more elegant this way.

So this was very good opportunity to check the imprtance of the length of feedback loop. I asked my wife to listen more to the amp and so did I, also my son and 6 year old daughter After a while, I changed the mounting of a resistor, this time using indeed good soldering practices and had another listening session. I was not hesitant about it, the amp sounded the way I know the sound of this amp and there was no doubt it was better. Both my wife and my son confirmed it, the daughter wasn't sure

On the right binding post you can see 3 pieces of 2" long solid core wire. Once I used silver solid copper wire, as I thought it may sound better. It didn't, the sound was too light, withought enough of bottom end extention and substance. Top end was probably better, but overall balance was lacking.

As this thread is about craftsmanship, I believe those pics make a nice addition. You probably have to ask Fred, to post some engineering illustrations.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg r2.jpg (32.1 KB, 427 views)
__________________
www.audiosector.com
“Do something really well. See how much time it takes. It might be a product, a work of art, who knows? Then give it away cheaply, just because you feel that it should not cost so much, even if it took a lot of time and expensive materials to make it.” - JC
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th July 2003, 10:37 PM   #30
diyAudio Senior Member
 
fdegrove's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Belgium
Hi,

Peter D,

When looking at the pics I still some no-nos from my book of experience.

I hope you don't mind for pointing you to possible improvements, operative word being "possible".

In both pics I notice some sharp bents on lead out wires. Not good practice since it tends to break copper lattices.
Try gently curved bents, it keeps the electrons on track.

Also, I notice you use the stand-off on the left as a ground, is this a non-magnetic item? If not try to source a copper based one such as brass.


Thirdly, you are going to remove the plastic from the BG caps one of these days, aren't you?

Oh, yes..most silverplated copper wire sounds pretty thin IME.

You could give pure 4N silver a try, after all you won't need much of it anyway. It will subjectively shorten the signal path even more.

Cheers,
__________________
Frank
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Engineering quality Lars Clausen Everything Else 10 25th November 2004 11:29 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 10:04 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2