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Old 11th February 2006, 02:52 AM   #1
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Default new FETs installed, no power.

i just replaced some Z44n on the PPI 2150M but LED do not light up.

however, in the process of FETs replacement, i found out that the ground path of the PCB have no conductor(burnt) due at the TS1 area(other side of the PCB).

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

anything else i can do? i want this to be a learning experience, so money isnt a problem.

btw, i havent replace the gate resistor on the FETs.

btw, thanks for TO-3 and others.
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Old 11th February 2006, 03:39 AM   #2
TO-3 is offline TO-3  Peru
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Default Re: new FETs installed, no power.

Quote:
Originally posted by profuse007
i just replaced some Z44n on the PPI 2150M but LED do not light up.

however, in the process of FETs replacement, i found out that the ground path of the PCB have no conductor(burnt) due at the TS1 area(other side of the PCB).

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

anything else i can do? i want this to be a learning experience, so money isnt a problem.

btw, i havent replace the gate resistor on the FETs.

btw, thanks for TO-3 and others.
You should find the name of the PWM chip and find the data sheet for it. Figure out which pin is the reset pin and measure to see if the pin is turning the chip off. Is the chip active high or active low?
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Old 11th February 2006, 05:33 AM   #3
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With powered applied to the amplifier (including remote), what's the DC voltage across the terminals where the missing thermal protector was connected?

If you follow the traces, does it look like the remote line passes through it?

Do both ends of the thermal device go back to the PWM chip? If so, which terminals?

Can you measure the voltage on each pin of the chip and post the readings (meter on DC volts, black lead on main ground terminal)?

Make the results clear. Post them like this:
Pin 1: x volts
Pin 2: x volts...
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Old 11th February 2006, 12:53 PM   #4
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Default Re: Re: new FETs installed, no power.

Click the image to open in full size.


alright, i tried to read about the IC other day(what does IC stand for?) but couldnt quite understand it. the only thing i understood about the chip is that pin 11 and 14 (V-outputs) is connected to teh gate resistors and also to ground (i think....lol), then to the transformer via switchers.

getting back to the PWN, i cant seem to find anything about reset pin. the only thing that i can find about is the push-pull config and it mentiona lil bit about reset. other than that, the pic(click on pic for link) doesnt say which pin is reset.

and if there is a reset pin, how do i test it to see?

Quote:
Originally posted by TO-3


You should find the name of the PWM chip and find the data sheet for it. Figure out which pin is the reset pin and measure to see if the pin is turning the chip off. Is the chip active high or active low?
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Old 11th February 2006, 01:24 PM   #5
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first of all, i use a computer power supply to bench test this so the input is 12v, if not slightly under 12v.

-to answer ur quesiton, the terminal shows 12v, same as the input(from the comp power supply) voltage.

-yes the remote line is connect to the TS1. shows 0v when remote line is disc.
****note: I WILL Reference the TS1 terminal thats connecting to the remote line will be [TSRem], the other one is [TS0].

-the TSRem goes to all of the PWN pins except for 9, 8, 7, and 5, w/ constand resistance.
-the TS0 goes to all of the PWNvpins except for 9 and 8, w/ varrying resistance.

Pin voltage:
1-4 : 12V
5: 11V
6: 12V
7: 11V
8: 11V
9: 6V
10-16: 12V

okay i see some good signs, 11 and 14 have power goin through the gate resistors. it seems like all gates have power, 12V.

alright, those are the only assessment i can make. what else is there?

thanks again, i will make some contribution to this site. do they take paypal?
Quote:
Originally posted by Perry Babin
With powered applied to the amplifier (including remote), what's the DC voltage across the terminals where the missing thermal protector was connected?

If you follow the traces, does it look like the remote line passes through it?

Do both ends of the thermal device go back to the PWM chip? If so, which terminals?

Can you measure the voltage on each pin of the chip and post the readings (meter on DC volts, black lead on main ground terminal)?

Make the results clear. Post them like this:
Pin 1: x volts
Pin 2: x volts...

BTW, TO-3, what do you mean by active low/high?
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Old 11th February 2006, 02:28 PM   #6
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You need to find the reason that pin 12 is not grounded. It should have read 0 volts. Repair that and then make all of the measurements again.

If remote passes directly through the thermal device (~0 ohms from the remote terminal to the thermal), there's a good chance that it was a simple on/off switch (Normally Closed) and you can solder a jumper across it for testing. I would not recommend installing it in a vehicle without thermal protection.

The gates should not have a constant 12 volts. The most you should read on the gate when the amp is up and running is ~6 volts DC (probably less due to the bandwidth of the meter).
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Old 12th February 2006, 01:50 PM   #7
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Default Re: Re: Re: new FETs installed, no power.

Quote:
Originally posted by profuse007
Click the image to open in full size.


alright, i tried to read about the IC other day(what does IC stand for?) but couldnt quite understand it. the only thing i understood about the chip is that pin 11 and 14 (V-outputs) is connected to teh gate resistors and also to ground (i think....lol), then to the transformer via switchers.

getting back to the PWN, i cant seem to find anything about reset pin. the only thing that i can find about is the push-pull config and it mentiona lil bit about reset. other than that, the pic(click on pic for link) doesnt say which pin is reset.

and if there is a reset pin, how do i test it to see?

Look at pin 10. Because it has a bar over the name it is active low. This pin turns the chip off and is usually tied to the fault-sense circuitry(ie. over-temp, over voltage, DC offset). If this line goes low than the amp will turn off.

Also, if indeed you have 12V on pin 12, as Perry said, that is the first issue that you need to address.

And IC stands for Integrated Circuit.
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Old 14th February 2006, 01:46 PM   #8
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sorry ppl but my account, profuse007, is scrwed up and im tring to sort it out w/ the admin.

so, how can i fix problem w/ grounding out to 0V?

im sorry but i dont know whats the on/off switch youre talking about. theres somthing that i havent comprehend about this, plz explain.
btw, this only for educational purposes, i already have a system in my car.

okay i see what you mean about the gate, i forgot about the resistor inline w/ the gate and it should be at ~6v. so what does it say about the PWM output(s) to teh gates?

if im not writing something correctly plz correct me. im really confuse about this.
Quote:
Originally posted by Perry Babin
You need to find the reason that pin 12 is not grounded. It should have read 0 volts. Repair that and then make all of the measurements again.

If remote passes directly through the thermal device (~0 ohms from the remote terminal to the thermal), there's a good chance that it was a simple on/off switch (Normally Closed) and you can solder a jumper across it for testing. I would not recommend installing it in a vehicle without thermal protection.

The gates should not have a constant 12 volts. The most you should read on the gate when the amp is up and running is ~6 volts DC (probably less due to the bandwidth of the meter).
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Old 17th February 2006, 03:38 PM   #9
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: new FETs installed, no power.

(moderator: can yall work on my original sn?)

ignore that last post, because i just briefly learn the basic of switchign power supply.

the pin 12 is grounded. i meant to say that probing that pin 12 w/ 12v constant give me +12V.

how do i test to see the step-up voltage from the switching?
where does the LED indicator connected to?
Quote:
Originally posted by Perry Babin
You need to find the reason that pin 12 is not grounded. It should have read 0 volts. Repair that and then make all of the measurements again.

If remote passes directly through the thermal device (~0 ohms from the remote terminal to the thermal), there's a good chance that it was a simple on/off switch (Normally Closed) and you can solder a jumper across it for testing. I would not recommend installing it in a vehicle without thermal protection.

The gates should not have a constant 12 volts. The most you should read on the gate when the amp is up and running is ~6 volts DC (probably less due to the bandwidth of the meter).

Quote:
Originally posted by TO-3


Look at pin 10. Because it has a bar over the name it is active low. This pin turns the chip off and is usually tied to the fault-sense circuitry(ie. over-temp, over voltage, DC offset). If this line goes low than the amp will turn off.

Also, if indeed you have 12V on pin 12, as Perry said, that is the first issue that you need to address.

And IC stands for Integrated Circuit.
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Old 17th February 2006, 07:31 PM   #10
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You need to post new numbers. Power up the amp (including remote). Place the black meter lead on the amp's ground terminal. Set the meter to DC volts.
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