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Old 17th October 2005, 04:28 PM   #1
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Default Need a car sub for SQ and decent SPL

Right now, I have an audiobahn alum12q sub in a 0.5 cu ft box, and it sounds pretty good. The reason for the small box is because I wanted to fit it in the corner of the trunk. The original plan was to LT it, but I don't even need to. Now, I'm looking for something better. The xmax on the sub is not that great, and I've bottomed the sub out a few times.

What would be a good sub and enclosure type? I'm looking for something with great SQ, but I want it to go loud too. I don't want to go bigger than 12", and I don't want to spend more than $200. I have a JBL GTO1201.1 amp to power this. Any suggestions?
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Old 17th October 2005, 04:50 PM   #2
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With lots amp power available, and that little budget, I'd say just upgrade the drive unit. Maybe if you are lucky with the shopping you could build a bit bigger sealed box.
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Old 17th October 2005, 07:04 PM   #3
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What I want to do is upgrade the driver and the box. The $200 is just for the driver. If that's not enough, then how much would I need to spend to get a decent driver? I was planning on building a new box anyway, so that shouldn't be a problem.
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Old 17th October 2005, 07:46 PM   #4
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Check out the Image Dynamics IDQ series
www.imagedynamicsusa.com

Small box, excellent sound quality, not sure if it will get loud enough for you though. They used to (maybe they still do) build the Arc Audio subs, which are also very highly respected.

www.cardomain.com is the only authorized online retailer
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Old 17th October 2005, 08:37 PM   #5
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Only 13 mm of xmax. Currently, my audiobahn has 14 mm, and I'm running it outside of xmax a lot. Basically, I'm looking for something with lots of xmax and good SQ, and it has to work in a reasonably sized box. It doesn't have to be 0.5 cu ft, but pretty much anything up to about 2 cu ft - the smaller, the better.
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Old 17th October 2005, 08:53 PM   #6
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What you're looking for is made, but not for $200. Something like the IDMAX, XXX, Brahma, or Magnum is what you're looking for I believe, but they all cost upwards of $300-350.

IDMAX
XXX
Brahma
Magnum
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Old 17th October 2005, 09:20 PM   #7
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Thanks for the links. Which one of those would give me the best performance for the money?
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Old 18th October 2005, 12:17 AM   #8
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The Brahma and XXX are basically twin brothers, the XXX is slightly more suited for spl (higher inductance, higher xmax, more suited to ported enclosures) and the brahma is slightly more suited for sq, but the differences are very small and they're the same price, or at least they used to be. Right now neither is available, but you could find a used one of each without TOO much hassle. The new brahmas (the ones in that link) should be available within a month or 2, the new xxx (not shown) should be available early next year, but it will be a different beast entirely.

The Magnum isn't talked about much but it's been around for a while, I still own an Elemental Designs e12a which many considered to be the exact same sub as the Magnum with a different cone. It was nice, but I prefer my current Brahma. I do believe it's the cheapest of those that I listed though.

The IDMAX is a very nice SQ sub, it can't get as loud as the others and it's around the same price ($350 on cardomain). It also doesn't have the BL-optimised motor that the Brahma and XXX have. It is available new though, and it's supposed to sound very very nice.


I went through this same decision last year, I knocked the Magnum and XXX off of my lists and it was between the Brahma and the IDMAX. I settled on the Brahma 15, still not sure why, but I'm happy with it.
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Old 18th October 2005, 02:17 AM   #9
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Quote:
and it was between the Brahma and the IDMAX
Those are the two that I'm looking at too.

Why wouldn't the IDMAX get as loud as the Brahma? Its sensitivity is 88 dB/W and power handling is 1kw rms, and the Brahma is 84 dB/W and 600w (not sure if peak or rms). the IDMAX does have less xmax than the Brahma, but it makes up for it with a larger cone area.

The only thing that I don't like about the Brahma is the foam surround. So would it be better to have a rubber surround, or a flatter BL curve?
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Old 18th October 2005, 03:59 AM   #10
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The IDMAX's 1000rms is sort of a nominal rating, it will hit full excursion on around 6-800. The previous gen Brahma (the one I have) was rated at 1600rms because they gave it a rating based on the true thermal limits. They just got tired of people blowing them all the time with 1.5kw amps who thought that because it had a 1600rms rating it could actually take 1600rms, despite the NUMEROUS warnings all over the site that said it would hit full excursion with less than 1000rms in 90% of the installs out there. So when they redesigned them (they actually improved the thermal power handling a little, it could probably take around 1800rms thermally now, which greatly reduces power compression compared to subs with less power handling) they decided to give it a rating that reflected something more along the lines of "recommended power".

The reason it has a lower efficiency than the IDMAX but can get just as loud on similar power is because of the BL curve, that efficiency will stay strong whether it's moving 5mm p-p or 50mm p-p. The IDMAX has a parabolic BL curve like most other speakers out there, as soon as it moves from rest its BL (which means its efficiency) begins to drop. At full excursion the Brahma still has very strong efficiency, the IDMAX's efficiency will be much lower than at rest.

You're right though, the IDMAX will be able to get as loud as the Brahma, I forgot it had the tiny surround that eats up very little cone area. The Brahma's surround is foam (and large), but it's not bad. Honestly it's very rigorous, and because it's so large it doesn't have the dimpling problem that the IDMAX's surround has at high excursion. Wear shouldn't be an issue, as long as they aren't in the sun a foam surround will last 10-20 years or more.


Honestly they should both be very good subs. I've spoken to the owner and employees of each company on numerous occasions and both of them have exhibited a high level of professionalism and ungodly intelligence. They both have great warranties, great customer service, great employees....it's just up to you. I had already bought over $600 in Adire products before I went looking for a new sub, and they had exceeded my expectations in every way possible up to that point, so I decided to go with them again and still haven't been disappointed. Both are used in successful SQ competition vehicles, and the Brahma Extreme were being used in Scotty Johnson's Bull Pen which was doing somewhere around 170dB last I checked (I don't keep up with SPL competition normally, but it's interesting when they're using almost the exact same sub as you).
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