step up voltage

segasonicfan · 16th August 2005, 12:02 PM

Anyone know a good way to step up ithe 12v car battery to a 25 or 30v supply for amp(s)?

-Segasonicfan

Dr. Fosgate · 16th August 2005, 03:20 PM

You can use a switch mode power supply, but your amps already have that built into them. You would gain no efficiency by doing this.

What are your goals for 25-30V operation? Reduced current draw, cleaner signal through regulation, SPL competition, etc…

segasonicfan · 16th August 2005, 08:31 PM

what do you mean they have a switch mode power supply built into them? My goal is to power some really nice amps in my car like the LM3886 and the LM4752. However, to get the full output for them I need 25-30v (or that's what I understand from the schematic).

-Segasonicfan

Dr. Fosgate · 16th August 2005, 09:42 PM

Most any car audio amplifier uses a switch mode power supply to boost 12V up to useful rail voltages for the output transistors. Using a FET, the input 12V is pulsed into a transformer, and then rectified back to a higher positive and a negative DC source for the amplifier’s rail voltages.

If you need 25V from 12V, a switch mode power supply would get you there.

Do you require positive 25V, and negative 25V for your project? If so, then you could either build your own power supply, or you could part out half of a preexisting amplifier to use as your source.

segasonicfan · 17th August 2005, 12:27 AM

yea, I'd like to build my own b/c those amps do require + and - 25v I need a DC-DC step up converter to go from 12v-25v at at least 1 amp and I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a good circuit to use.

-Segasonicfan

Perry Babin · 17th August 2005, 03:40 AM

The following power supply will do what you need:

http://sound.westhost.com/project89.htm
(figure 2)

The voltage will have to be set to ±28 volts for the 3886. It would probably be best if you used the same ICs for all channels since different voltages are required for each.

They recommend using a core from an inductor. While this may work, it's best not to use a core that has unknown properties. The F-193A-F or the F-140A-F from the following company should work properly with the supply above:

http://www.cwsbytemark.com/prices/toroidal.php

The supply above has a grounded secondary center-tap. This means that you'll need some sort of isolation for the shield ground (to prevent ground loops). An audio isolation transformer is the easiest form of isolation. For a cheap transformer, you can use a ground loop isolator. Better transformers can be purchased from companies like Jensen Transformer (relatively expensive).

http://www.jensen-transformers.com/ln_in.html

Dr. Photon · 18th August 2005, 12:05 AM

I'd recommend using either the ESP project, or just using the power supply from a cheap and or blown up car amplifier. The ESP project and the internal PSU in a car amp work in the same way.

The "cheap" option would be to make a regular home power supply and use a cheap-o inverter (and filter enough to get the cheap inverter crap out of the signal). This is a "ghetto" solution.

segasonicfan · 18th August 2005, 01:40 AM

thanks for your help guys. The schematic to make my own looks albit overly complex compared to other DC-DC circuits I've seen. And to build it would cost a damn fortune in parts. I have 2 scrap audio amps from cars and I'm going to the auto junkyard tomorrow to get some more. It seems like the easiest solution would be to pull out the step up voltage conversion from these.

So far I can't find the step up on these two but maybe some at the junkyard will have it.

-Segasonicfan

Dr. Fosgate · 18th August 2005, 03:15 AM

If you want an amp with 25V rails, I have a Rockford Punch 60ix I am working on. The powersupply side is just fine, but I cannot get one of the channels to work.

I am still working on it though.

segasonicfan · 21st August 2005, 03:59 AM

hrmmm it looks like I solded my problem

Looking over the LM8336 schematic I saw there are two input pins for positive voltage-pins 1 and 5. Further down the schem it says:

"The optional external components shown in Figure 2 and described above are applicable in both single and split voltage supply configurations."

So it looks like you can input +12v (or 13.8v on a full car batt charge) to each pin to get a cool 24-27.6v power supply!

Has anyone tried this or think this may not work?

-Segasonicfan

16th August 2005, 12:02 PM	#1
segasonicfan diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2005	step up voltage Anyone know a good way to step up ithe 12v car battery to a 25 or 30v supply for amp(s)? -Segasonicfan

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16th August 2005, 03:20 PM	#2
Dr. Fosgate diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Muskegon, Michigan	You can use a switch mode power supply, but your amps already have that built into them. You would gain no efficiency by doing this. What are your goals for 25-30V operation? Reduced current draw, cleaner signal through regulation, SPL competition, etc…

16th August 2005, 08:31 PM	#3
segasonicfan diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2005	what do you mean they have a switch mode power supply built into them? My goal is to power some really nice amps in my car like the LM3886 and the LM4752. However, to get the full output for them I need 25-30v (or that's what I understand from the schematic). -Segasonicfan

16th August 2005, 09:42 PM	#4
Dr. Fosgate diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Muskegon, Michigan	Most any car audio amplifier uses a switch mode power supply to boost 12V up to useful rail voltages for the output transistors. Using a FET, the input 12V is pulsed into a transformer, and then rectified back to a higher positive and a negative DC source for the amplifier’s rail voltages. If you need 25V from 12V, a switch mode power supply would get you there. Do you require positive 25V, and negative 25V for your project? If so, then you could either build your own power supply, or you could part out half of a preexisting amplifier to use as your source.

17th August 2005, 12:27 AM	#5
segasonicfan diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2005	yea, I'd like to build my own b/c those amps do require + and - 25v I need a DC-DC step up converter to go from 12v-25v at at least 1 amp and I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a good circuit to use. -Segasonicfan

17th August 2005, 03:40 AM	#6
Perry Babin diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Louisiana	The following power supply will do what you need: http://sound.westhost.com/project89.htm (figure 2) The voltage will have to be set to ±28 volts for the 3886. It would probably be best if you used the same ICs for all channels since different voltages are required for each. They recommend using a core from an inductor. While this may work, it's best not to use a core that has unknown properties. The F-193A-F or the F-140A-F from the following company should work properly with the supply above: http://www.cwsbytemark.com/prices/toroidal.php The supply above has a grounded secondary center-tap. This means that you'll need some sort of isolation for the shield ground (to prevent ground loops). An audio isolation transformer is the easiest form of isolation. For a cheap transformer, you can use a ground loop isolator. Better transformers can be purchased from companies like Jensen Transformer (relatively expensive). http://www.jensen-transformers.com/ln_in.html

18th August 2005, 12:05 AM	#7
Dr. Photon diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: texas	I'd recommend using either the ESP project, or just using the power supply from a cheap and or blown up car amplifier. The ESP project and the internal PSU in a car amp work in the same way. The "cheap" option would be to make a regular home power supply and use a cheap-o inverter (and filter enough to get the cheap inverter crap out of the signal). This is a "ghetto" solution.

18th August 2005, 01:40 AM	#8
segasonicfan diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2005	thanks for your help guys. The schematic to make my own looks albit overly complex compared to other DC-DC circuits I've seen. And to build it would cost a damn fortune in parts. I have 2 scrap audio amps from cars and I'm going to the auto junkyard tomorrow to get some more. It seems like the easiest solution would be to pull out the step up voltage conversion from these. So far I can't find the step up on these two but maybe some at the junkyard will have it. -Segasonicfan

18th August 2005, 03:15 AM	#9
Dr. Fosgate diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Muskegon, Michigan	If you want an amp with 25V rails, I have a Rockford Punch 60ix I am working on. The powersupply side is just fine, but I cannot get one of the channels to work. I am still working on it though.

21st August 2005, 03:59 AM	#10
segasonicfan diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2005	hrmmm it looks like I solded my problem Looking over the LM8336 schematic I saw there are two input pins for positive voltage-pins 1 and 5. Further down the schem it says: "The optional external components shown in Figure 2 and described above are applicable in both single and split voltage supply configurations." So it looks like you can input +12v (or 13.8v on a full car batt charge) to each pin to get a cool 24-27.6v power supply! Has anyone tried this or think this may not work? -Segasonicfan

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