Loud cars are what the cops call amplified cars. Putting speakers in the trunk I refer to an amplified car-- a system designed not to listen in the driver's compartment but to produce a vibrating car and sound wave to annoy me as the resident of a neighborhood through which the vehicle moves.
I'm wondering if any amplified customization has to do with microphones in the engine compartment. There's a Mitsubishi in my lot that has the loud car gear installed but when there's no beat going on the car is still loud. What kind of plant can produce this noise and as it legal for street use.
Loud here means that its sound wave is going on in my residence through glass and wall. Sub sonic noise need not be deafeningly loud to be disturbing. It's like getting my guts curdled when the car starts up.
I'm wondering if any amplified customization has to do with microphones in the engine compartment. There's a Mitsubishi in my lot that has the loud car gear installed but when there's no beat going on the car is still loud. What kind of plant can produce this noise and as it legal for street use.
Loud here means that its sound wave is going on in my residence through glass and wall. Sub sonic noise need not be deafeningly loud to be disturbing. It's like getting my guts curdled when the car starts up.
as someone who sold car audio before the stupid "loud" craze started...
... I never bought into the "loud" thing at all for its own sake, I guess only to the point of a home audio system: dynamics and headroom. I'm in my late 40's now and still have good hearing (thankfully), and I don't really listen that loud in my house. A little loud sometimes, but it is a rare occasion. In car audio, one ligitimate consideration is that a system must overcome road noise for the listener. This can be done easily by making sure there is sound damping material installed throughout the interior of the vehicle.
Unfortunately, Dynamat and similar products are quite expensive, and there's the rub. If it doesn't make it louder, most younger folks won't buy it. Sort of like a kid who wants to build horsepower, but really needs brakes, shocks, tires and steering components. We (as in older folks) can advise them, but most will not listen to us anyway.
I bought some quite good car audio stuff about 15 years ago at a closeout price, but have never installed it into any car as I hadn't had one of suitable quality. I now have a vehicle with suitable quality to justify the installation of an "upgrade", but just don't have the interest to actually do it.
For any car audio fans: I'm not really trying to disrespect you other than your noise pollution is why you guys get (or should get) ticketed. The point of making it loud is to win sanctioned SPL events. If you aren't involved in these do yourself a favour, consider quality over quantity and dampen your interiors. There are less costly alternatives to Dynamat out there (as little as 35¢ per sq. ft.). Please save your ears for those events (even SPL competitions only place a microphone for an RTA inside the passenger compartment). Good home audio costs way less than car audio
... I never bought into the "loud" thing at all for its own sake, I guess only to the point of a home audio system: dynamics and headroom. I'm in my late 40's now and still have good hearing (thankfully), and I don't really listen that loud in my house. A little loud sometimes, but it is a rare occasion. In car audio, one ligitimate consideration is that a system must overcome road noise for the listener. This can be done easily by making sure there is sound damping material installed throughout the interior of the vehicle.
Unfortunately, Dynamat and similar products are quite expensive, and there's the rub. If it doesn't make it louder, most younger folks won't buy it. Sort of like a kid who wants to build horsepower, but really needs brakes, shocks, tires and steering components. We (as in older folks) can advise them, but most will not listen to us anyway.
Significant bass can curdle your stomach if there is enough content below 20Hz (as in seismic 12 Hz or lower) at a high enough level. It used to be that the loudest things we heard were at rock concerts, but some of these SPL machines can dwarf the sound levels coming from a live concert. ( Loud Rock Concer,115dB, 15 mins or less can create permanent damage, look here for some examples.
I bought some quite good car audio stuff about 15 years ago at a closeout price, but have never installed it into any car as I hadn't had one of suitable quality. I now have a vehicle with suitable quality to justify the installation of an "upgrade", but just don't have the interest to actually do it.
For any car audio fans: I'm not really trying to disrespect you other than your noise pollution is why you guys get (or should get) ticketed. The point of making it loud is to win sanctioned SPL events. If you aren't involved in these do yourself a favour, consider quality over quantity and dampen your interiors. There are less costly alternatives to Dynamat out there (as little as 35¢ per sq. ft.). Please save your ears for those events (even SPL competitions only place a microphone for an RTA inside the passenger compartment). Good home audio costs way less than car audio
Thanks Stew,
I've seen many post from you over at Full Range which is where I only ever monitor new remarks on the DIY forums.
The SPL contest is going on in the neighborhood. I have contacted my city representatives who say that they are giving out lots of tickets in the downtown (prob'ly during bar run on Friday and Saturday night) but I can't get anybody nailed out here in the neighborhood. Since I spoke to the police chief about this in person at city council meeting (after being introduced to him by the mayor who bailed on my questions) nothing has been done.
My take on it is that any amplified equipment not in the driver compartment is a public address system and should be regulated and ticketed like anyone with unauthorized use of a bull horn (nearly everyone.) And this noise doesn't sound like the popsicle truck going through the neighborhood.
I also think that this is done by this white neighborhood's kids and they are afraid of backlash from the neighbors either implied or overt.
All that is beside the point. I am pushing for new ordinances. I did wonder about that loud Mitsubishi Eclipse though. It sounds like it has a locomotive engine in it.
I've seen many post from you over at Full Range which is where I only ever monitor new remarks on the DIY forums.
The SPL contest is going on in the neighborhood. I have contacted my city representatives who say that they are giving out lots of tickets in the downtown (prob'ly during bar run on Friday and Saturday night) but I can't get anybody nailed out here in the neighborhood. Since I spoke to the police chief about this in person at city council meeting (after being introduced to him by the mayor who bailed on my questions) nothing has been done.
My take on it is that any amplified equipment not in the driver compartment is a public address system and should be regulated and ticketed like anyone with unauthorized use of a bull horn (nearly everyone.) And this noise doesn't sound like the popsicle truck going through the neighborhood.
I also think that this is done by this white neighborhood's kids and they are afraid of backlash from the neighbors either implied or overt.
All that is beside the point. I am pushing for new ordinances. I did wonder about that loud Mitsubishi Eclipse though. It sounds like it has a locomotive engine in it.
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Lon,
This could be tough thing to quash. Depending on the year the Mitsubishi could be a hatchback. Now if the car is owned by someone in an apartment building or condo complex a complaint can be made to the manager and/or condo board. If the manager/condo board make a serious effort and have the rights to do so, the result could be eviction or forced sale of condo if warnings are not heeded. You need not live in apartment or condo within a complex for this to be effective: a complaint can be made against the owner(s) of an apartment. If the car is "visiting" then the owner/tenant within a condo or apartment complex could be cited the same from the manager or the condo board with the same results. For some reason, I'm thinking of an apartment complex or condo.
Now if the car is owned by an occupant of a free-standing home you can make a complaint against the owner of the home, via the police or local bylaw enforcement people.
These are only ideas, but I think they could work.
This could be tough thing to quash. Depending on the year the Mitsubishi could be a hatchback. Now if the car is owned by someone in an apartment building or condo complex a complaint can be made to the manager and/or condo board. If the manager/condo board make a serious effort and have the rights to do so, the result could be eviction or forced sale of condo if warnings are not heeded. You need not live in apartment or condo within a complex for this to be effective: a complaint can be made against the owner(s) of an apartment. If the car is "visiting" then the owner/tenant within a condo or apartment complex could be cited the same from the manager or the condo board with the same results. For some reason, I'm thinking of an apartment complex or condo.
Now if the car is owned by an occupant of a free-standing home you can make a complaint against the owner of the home, via the police or local bylaw enforcement people.
These are only ideas, but I think they could work.
Yes, no doubt hard to quash.
There's a chance it will sort itself out. The couple has three cars here. An old beater was acquired for the missus and now a Jeep Commanche is also in their stable with Mitsu. At most two cars are allowed per apartment unit not including 'visiting.' No one has made any big deal about it so far.
They have new baby and a toddler. He's recently returned from Iraq. It would make sense if the fun car got sold as impractical. But no action on it yet.
There's a chance it will sort itself out. The couple has three cars here. An old beater was acquired for the missus and now a Jeep Commanche is also in their stable with Mitsu. At most two cars are allowed per apartment unit not including 'visiting.' No one has made any big deal about it so far.
They have new baby and a toddler. He's recently returned from Iraq. It would make sense if the fun car got sold as impractical. But no action on it yet.
Dump trucks are not allowed in neighborhoods as too noisy and most areas do not permit semi tractor trailers or straight trucks either. Yet passenger diesels like a Ford Triton which make just as much noise are not questioned. I hear these things tearing around here all the time. Fortunately we have winter and the windows are closed for few months.
This apartment building is built strong and was likely put up in the late 50's. I hardly hear anything through the wall with the neighbor's tv going. But low sonics travel much farther and do not have to be loud to be upsetting.
the trucks not being allowed in the neighborhood are because the weight will crush the road, causing a need to repair the road.
plus there is the possibility that your local government has dug caves underground that they don't want to see caved in because an excessively heavy truck drove over it causing the soil to break loose.
being upset about loud is your equation to deal with.
you either can put up improved sound isolation, or you can ask the landlord about it.. otherwise they are going to tell you to move to the country to relieve your 'upset'
you can't expect to share the world with other people and get by without insurance or sensibility aimed at the other person (and in retrospect, yourself).
think about how the industry aims their focus to allow people to share & be next to eachother.
for example.. all the work done with the combustion chamber inside a motorcycle's engine to custom engineer the chamber for the acoustic output characteristics.. because we all know some people will want a louder exhaust to simply be heard as if it helps keep them safe .. and those same people building the engines don't want their infants hearing to be damaged while in the backseat sitting at a red light in traffic.
yet the blame is equally placed upon the parent who had the window rolled down, perhaps more than equal since the complaint comes from the parent.
same is true for the speakers, you can hear the combing.. but you might not know of the phase missing that would really cause a drastic difference, yet again though.. there are measures in place with the FDA too, because they know infants roll past construction zones with loud machinery at work.
they know police cars, fire trucks, and ambulances blare their siren of the governments action & responsibility.
people in these situations need to stop & think exactly what it is they are trying to teach the other person, and then come to a conclusion about the 'words of advice' as to the sensibility & sanity of their teaching.
you might say 'save your hearing' without knowing any bit of dedication towards bringing the sensitivity up inside the home or workplace
because to the bystander, it might look like the person is experiencing putrid waste with each & every single time they drive down the road with the radio loud.
but if the loud only happens 45 minutes each day, while the rest of the day goes to sensitive hearing .. then the insane person would likely be the person without enough notes taken, as the truth outweighs the sensibility brought to question.
plus there is the possibility that your local government has dug caves underground that they don't want to see caved in because an excessively heavy truck drove over it causing the soil to break loose.
being upset about loud is your equation to deal with.
you either can put up improved sound isolation, or you can ask the landlord about it.. otherwise they are going to tell you to move to the country to relieve your 'upset'
you can't expect to share the world with other people and get by without insurance or sensibility aimed at the other person (and in retrospect, yourself).
think about how the industry aims their focus to allow people to share & be next to eachother.
for example.. all the work done with the combustion chamber inside a motorcycle's engine to custom engineer the chamber for the acoustic output characteristics.. because we all know some people will want a louder exhaust to simply be heard as if it helps keep them safe .. and those same people building the engines don't want their infants hearing to be damaged while in the backseat sitting at a red light in traffic.
yet the blame is equally placed upon the parent who had the window rolled down, perhaps more than equal since the complaint comes from the parent.
same is true for the speakers, you can hear the combing.. but you might not know of the phase missing that would really cause a drastic difference, yet again though.. there are measures in place with the FDA too, because they know infants roll past construction zones with loud machinery at work.
they know police cars, fire trucks, and ambulances blare their siren of the governments action & responsibility.
people in these situations need to stop & think exactly what it is they are trying to teach the other person, and then come to a conclusion about the 'words of advice' as to the sensibility & sanity of their teaching.
you might say 'save your hearing' without knowing any bit of dedication towards bringing the sensitivity up inside the home or workplace
because to the bystander, it might look like the person is experiencing putrid waste with each & every single time they drive down the road with the radio loud.
but if the loud only happens 45 minutes each day, while the rest of the day goes to sensitive hearing .. then the insane person would likely be the person without enough notes taken, as the truth outweighs the sensibility brought to question.
simply another person's existance is upsetting to a selfish person, but that doesn't imply sensibility & rationality should stop progressing from that point.
selfish is how strong people move forward, but it is sad that many people simply aren't selfish enough.
you can view how selfishness can grow simply watching a wheel spin.
the wheel spins faster and the vision gets blurry, the wheel spins faster & the wheel looks like it stops spinning, the wheel spins faster & it looks like it spins backwards, the wheel spins faster & it looks like it stops spinning again, the wheel spins faster & it looks like the wheel spins forward at a different speed, the wheel spins faster & it looks like the wheel is spinning forward at 'regular' speed.
**edit**
people's amount of selfishness fit into each rate of speed.
selfish is how strong people move forward, but it is sad that many people simply aren't selfish enough.
you can view how selfishness can grow simply watching a wheel spin.
the wheel spins faster and the vision gets blurry, the wheel spins faster & the wheel looks like it stops spinning, the wheel spins faster & it looks like it spins backwards, the wheel spins faster & it looks like it stops spinning again, the wheel spins faster & it looks like the wheel spins forward at a different speed, the wheel spins faster & it looks like the wheel is spinning forward at 'regular' speed.
**edit**
people's amount of selfishness fit into each rate of speed.
As usual, the SQ guys think the SPL guys are ignorant rude idiots while the SPL guys can respect SQ.
I personally love flat out SPL but can respect and appreciate a well done SQ setup, or any setup for that matter. Not everyone whose car is loud rides around full tilt through neighborhoods. To be honest, most that do that are usually pretty quiet and sound terrible and running junk equipment. When I say quiet, I mean <140db. Usually running kickers/Hifonics/Lanzar/Boss/Pyle/etc. in a sealed box or ported prefab box tuned to 55hz.
I personally turn my stereo down in neighborhoods and usually at stoplights and have it up everywhere else.
Theres no feeling in the world like getting hit with 155db @ such low frequencies, like 30-45hz. Also at those levels, dynamat will not help you, or keep the sound inside the vehicle.
I personally love flat out SPL but can respect and appreciate a well done SQ setup, or any setup for that matter. Not everyone whose car is loud rides around full tilt through neighborhoods. To be honest, most that do that are usually pretty quiet and sound terrible and running junk equipment. When I say quiet, I mean <140db. Usually running kickers/Hifonics/Lanzar/Boss/Pyle/etc. in a sealed box or ported prefab box tuned to 55hz.
I personally turn my stereo down in neighborhoods and usually at stoplights and have it up everywhere else.
Theres no feeling in the world like getting hit with 155db @ such low frequencies, like 30-45hz. Also at those levels, dynamat will not help you, or keep the sound inside the vehicle.
not really the argument...
As I stated, the real issue is the lack of respect afforded to others by a significant number of car audio folks (not all, there are always exceptions such as yourself...).
Lon: BIG bass actually can cause one to vomit or loose control of one's bowels, not my idea of "fun".
Nope not the point to this thread. Ignorant CA folks who pound it through neighbourhoods is the issue, this is not a "loud vs. SQ" thread.
Most probably not tuned correctly. Even mediocre stuff can sound good if installed and tuned correctly. But remember that a single exposure to as little as 125 dB (depending on frequency and if the level is at the listener's ears and duration) can produce irreversible hearing damage to the stereocillia (the little hairlike structures within the ear that help naturally amplify the sound entering the ear.).
Then you are certainly in the minority and others could learn from you.
I've had a hit in a Rockford-Fosgate demo van with way too much power and way too many subs and it pressurized my lungs. And it wasn't what I might call musical.
As I stated, the real issue is the lack of respect afforded to others by a significant number of car audio folks (not all, there are always exceptions such as yourself...).
Lon: BIG bass actually can cause one to vomit or loose control of one's bowels, not my idea of "fun".
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Stew,
Yes I'm aware of the effect that low level noise can have on the diaphragm (fluttering) and on the anal sphincter (involuntary dilation and muscle release.) This effect was first observed so far as I know at the premier of the film Earthquake during which special subaudial equipment was used to increase the reality of the show. That may be legend by now but I recall reading it at the time. Elsewhere in speakerland, Speakerbuilder magazine had a reference to such in a build using Sonotube. These were really big Sonotube speaks about 7 feet high. Sonotube is the cardboard casement for concrete used in construction.
I suppose you'd have to stick your finger in a light socket to get your parts tingled.
Before I actually went to the city council on this issue I asked those I knew about their experience with loud cars. One woman I know understood loud music but having the feeling in your chest when sitting quietly not engaged in the moment of the music she found disturbing as well. I call it a violation of the body-- something that the military may have thought of to do on one of their jaunts in Falujah. Or the obvious example id Ride Of The Valkyries from Apocalypse Now. It is entirely inappropriate outside of a controlled environment-- way outside like in a cow pasture with no cows in it for fear of getting curdled milk.
Elsewhere a friend who works on the docks opined that if I took the problem to the individuals involved the reaction would be "tough ****, buddy." I sort of hear that here and not surprised by it.
Yes I'm aware of the effect that low level noise can have on the diaphragm (fluttering) and on the anal sphincter (involuntary dilation and muscle release.) This effect was first observed so far as I know at the premier of the film Earthquake during which special subaudial equipment was used to increase the reality of the show. That may be legend by now but I recall reading it at the time. Elsewhere in speakerland, Speakerbuilder magazine had a reference to such in a build using Sonotube. These were really big Sonotube speaks about 7 feet high. Sonotube is the cardboard casement for concrete used in construction.
I suppose you'd have to stick your finger in a light socket to get your parts tingled.
Before I actually went to the city council on this issue I asked those I knew about their experience with loud cars. One woman I know understood loud music but having the feeling in your chest when sitting quietly not engaged in the moment of the music she found disturbing as well. I call it a violation of the body-- something that the military may have thought of to do on one of their jaunts in Falujah. Or the obvious example id Ride Of The Valkyries from Apocalypse Now. It is entirely inappropriate outside of a controlled environment-- way outside like in a cow pasture with no cows in it for fear of getting curdled milk.
Elsewhere a friend who works on the docks opined that if I took the problem to the individuals involved the reaction would be "tough ****, buddy." I sort of hear that here and not surprised by it.
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"diesels like a Ford Triton"
The Ford diesel is called the power stroke. The Ford triton motors are gas powered and no longer produced.
They are not that loud compared to a Dodge Cummins diesel. I think the Chevy Isuzu diesel is the quietest.
Lawn mowers and weed eaters are pretty loud too!!
Airplanes, helicopters and jets are loud too!!
Point is everything is loud and makes noise to some extent, some people can tolerate it and some people cannot. If you want peace and quiet don't live in a city especially an apartment complex.
Move to the country. The air is fresh, and its very peaceful and quiet......although not at my house with guns, dirt bikes, loud music, and 400HP mustang....lol.
Good Luck resolving your issue with the Mitsubishi.
Have you approached the individual tactfully and professionally and simply asked if he could accommodate and respect your needs?
The Ford diesel is called the power stroke. The Ford triton motors are gas powered and no longer produced.
They are not that loud compared to a Dodge Cummins diesel. I think the Chevy Isuzu diesel is the quietest.
Lawn mowers and weed eaters are pretty loud too!!
Airplanes, helicopters and jets are loud too!!
Point is everything is loud and makes noise to some extent, some people can tolerate it and some people cannot. If you want peace and quiet don't live in a city especially an apartment complex.
Move to the country. The air is fresh, and its very peaceful and quiet......although not at my house with guns, dirt bikes, loud music, and 400HP mustang....lol.
Good Luck resolving your issue with the Mitsubishi.
Have you approached the individual tactfully and professionally and simply asked if he could accommodate and respect your needs?
This thread is about the general issue of loud cars. I have made contact with the city and they directed me to someone in law enforcement.
They cite these cars in the downtown (Friday Sat night etc) all the time I am told. The loud car thing started after I was a night cab driver here.
I made another thread on subsonic vibrations possibly related to car security systems. It has to be that or some utility vehicles working round the clock after an ice storm. I can feel the vibration while I'm sitting here at midday like a seat shaker in a car. It's hard to imagine that a passenger car can do that but utility gear like big dump tricks and generators might. I haven not seen any of this equipment nearby but it may be on untravelled streets.
They cite these cars in the downtown (Friday Sat night etc) all the time I am told. The loud car thing started after I was a night cab driver here.
I made another thread on subsonic vibrations possibly related to car security systems. It has to be that or some utility vehicles working round the clock after an ice storm. I can feel the vibration while I'm sitting here at midday like a seat shaker in a car. It's hard to imagine that a passenger car can do that but utility gear like big dump tricks and generators might. I haven not seen any of this equipment nearby but it may be on untravelled streets.
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