Bad amp, wiring mistake, too much power, inappropriate enclosure if we're talking raw drivers.
FWIW I've never heard of sub woofers needing warm up..
Many more details are needed to know the answer.. (Burned voice coils, VC formers run into the pole piece due to over excursion, shredded/mangled cones, ripped surrounds, shredded spiders?)
FWIW I've never heard of sub woofers needing warm up..
Many more details are needed to know the answer.. (Burned voice coils, VC formers run into the pole piece due to over excursion, shredded/mangled cones, ripped surrounds, shredded spiders?)
Yeah I don't know all that.. He's a friend from work. So I'll have to look at the speakers next time I see him at work. He said smoke was coming from the speakers..
Since he's new to all the speaker stuff.. I'm sure he did something wrong with the wiring. Sub warming is when you get new amp...and you slowly turn the knobs up to figure out the standing point of how much your subs can handle...also warming up new ones...you don't just pop in subs and blast your music...that'd be asking for trouble. There is a ton of stuff I can think of how they blew...but they were being seriously under powered...so I'm stumped on how much information I know now.
Will update when I learn more.
Since he's new to all the speaker stuff.. I'm sure he did something wrong with the wiring. Sub warming is when you get new amp...and you slowly turn the knobs up to figure out the standing point of how much your subs can handle...also warming up new ones...you don't just pop in subs and blast your music...that'd be asking for trouble. There is a ton of stuff I can think of how they blew...but they were being seriously under powered...so I'm stumped on how much information I know now.
Will update when I learn more.
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Can you post an example of any piece of documentation where the manufacturer suggest warming up a woofer as you described?
Before you connect any other speakers to the amp, you need to measure the DC voltage across the speaker terminals to confirm that there isn't an excessive amount of DC present.
Before you connect any other speakers to the amp, you need to measure the DC voltage across the speaker terminals to confirm that there isn't an excessive amount of DC present.
actually, perry, i recall clearly that rockford outlines a "break-in" procedure that thay suggest. just look up a cheap rocford sub manual pdf and it should be in there....that being said, tha point of a break-in is to loosen up the spider and surround a bit, which is not really a science on proven effectiveness, becuase break-in is going to happen, it's just a cover your bum insurance-piece of mind thing. i've done it before....couple times, and even blew a house reciever, so gave up bothering. i completely agree thet the problem lies in either clipping, wiring, or both. when you check it out, make sure he has sufficient power wire to handle the current that the amp is fused at, and the same size, or larger ground (don't need larger) and ask him to crank the stereo "loud" in front of you....leave it thaere and walk a few feet away from the car. if it does not sound clear, then he was likely clipping it. you can definately over-power many subs many times over, and even daily, if you really know what you are doing, but you can blow them allot easier under-powering them and clipping, or "distorting" think of it as putting the speaker at a much higher duty cycle, and diminished cooling movement.
Maybe I am too literally minded but "warm up" and "break in" connote two very different things to me. I always (the very few times I done this) break in a driver before measuring the TS parameters for example if I want to do a box design for a new driver, but otherwise just let them break in with moderate use..
I don't tend to push things nearly as hard though as they in the auto audio world..
Smoke seems to imply the VC burned out, and IMHO an inadvertent connection to DC (battery?) or a bad amplifier seems quite likely.
I don't tend to push things nearly as hard though as they in the auto audio world..
Smoke seems to imply the VC burned out, and IMHO an inadvertent connection to DC (battery?) or a bad amplifier seems quite likely.
The test for that is... Have they continued to recommend that for every woofer from that point (when I assume that they learned that it helped speakers in some way)?
If EVERY manufacturer gave specific guidelines for breaking in woofers, that would make me believe that there was something to it. If only half would recommend it, it would likely mean that there's no proof that it does anything. Since very few recommend it, I can't see that it's anything that needs to be done.
The materials should not change in their physical properties in any significant way. If they did, the woofer would wear itself out relatively quickly.
If EVERY manufacturer gave specific guidelines for breaking in woofers, that would make me believe that there was something to it. If only half would recommend it, it would likely mean that there's no proof that it does anything. Since very few recommend it, I can't see that it's anything that needs to be done.
The materials should not change in their physical properties in any significant way. If they did, the woofer would wear itself out relatively quickly.
All more or less true, but minute changes in the compliance of the spider/suspension over the first 20 hrs or so result in measurable changes in TS parameters, and in the design world it is considered good practice to run them for a while before measurement. Given the very stiff nature of the suspensions in car sub-woofers I would expect the effect to be much less significant than in high efficiency low compliance pro drivers and woofers generally for domestic HIFI.
The driver manufacturers often make no specific recommendation, but the people who design speaker systems generally do. Vance Dickason, and other people I have worked with in the audio industry are quite specific about this. My limited experience with speaker system design also indicates that it is a real issue at the design level..
Hi Cal. Do you think that you could, approximately 100% of the time, tell the difference between a woofer that had been broken in and one that had not if you had no clue as to whether the woofer had been broken in or not? If there is a 'real' difference, it should be detectable 100% of the time.
Could you do it virtually 100% of the time for virtually 100% of the woofers on the market?
I think this (audibility of woofer break-in) may apply to a tiny fraction of the speakers but not the great majority.
I also think there's a bit of psychological influence here. A lot of people get a new pair of headphones or speakers and don't initially like the way they sound. Then they 'break them in' by playing them when they're not listening to them and all of a sudden they sound wonderful. I've purchased headphones and built speakers that I didn't initially like the way they sounded. I didn't listen to them for about a week and when I went back to them, my opinion had changed and they actually sounded pretty good. Initially, my expectations were too high. When I came back to them I expected much less of them and was surprised at how good they sounded. They sounded no different because nothing had changed over the week. If I had 'burned them in', that would have received the credit for the way they sounded when I went back to them.
Again, discussions like there are too short on specifics.
I think I'll end my comments here. This is subjective and therefore will likely remain unprovable either way.
Could you do it virtually 100% of the time for virtually 100% of the woofers on the market?
I think this (audibility of woofer break-in) may apply to a tiny fraction of the speakers but not the great majority.
I also think there's a bit of psychological influence here. A lot of people get a new pair of headphones or speakers and don't initially like the way they sound. Then they 'break them in' by playing them when they're not listening to them and all of a sudden they sound wonderful. I've purchased headphones and built speakers that I didn't initially like the way they sounded. I didn't listen to them for about a week and when I went back to them, my opinion had changed and they actually sounded pretty good. Initially, my expectations were too high. When I came back to them I expected much less of them and was surprised at how good they sounded. They sounded no different because nothing had changed over the week. If I had 'burned them in', that would have received the credit for the way they sounded when I went back to them.
Again, discussions like there are too short on specifics.
I think I'll end my comments here. This is subjective and therefore will likely remain unprovable either way.
A breaking in period will only be necessary for very cheap drivers. All drivers, and I do mean all, have measurable changes occur in a varying time after production. Some take as little as a few minutes to settle in, others several hours. The point is that a respectable manufacturer does this breaking in for you, and measure the drivers as part of quality control before shipping them to a consumer.
However, some times low cost drivers from even respectable manufacturers are only measured for pre-break in parameters, and if passed within acceptable margin it's shipped directly. It part of keeping the production price low. Note that end-consumer pricing has little to do with production price though.
However, some times low cost drivers from even respectable manufacturers are only measured for pre-break in parameters, and if passed within acceptable margin it's shipped directly. It part of keeping the production price low. Note that end-consumer pricing has little to do with production price though.
I hope you see the oxymoron here.
No, absolutely not.
Absolutely not.
This is where we disagree.
We haven't even touched on that aspect but between you and me, we are on the same page. I have conducted some "trick" experiments to convince me that what you are thinking is correct.
That's ok, they're still civil discussions and that's part of what this forum is about.
Once again, absolutely agree.
My experience deals solely with the units on hand and only subjective results but I do not type what I have without having a rather convincing set of subjective data. I will elaborate more later if this is still open for discussion.
Cheers.
Want me to post a video of my friends D3 diamonds that he has used for 3 years comparing to my brand new D3, same model. same amp. same car, same wiring? Wanna see it?
I have been using a pair of Powerbass 2XL1524's for a few years now. I followed their suggestions and I am convinced due to the performance they still deliver.....
The following is a quote from page 10 of my owners manual
""BREAK IN PERIOD
To get the most from your woofer we recommend a "break-in" period of at least 40 hours at no more than 1/3 of maximum volume. During this time the cone and spider assembly will gradually break in resulting in greater performance and more listening enjoyment.""
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