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-   -   Eminence Lab 12 + Amp + Box combo (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/car-audio/132574-eminence-lab-12-amp-box-combo.html)

metaverse 5th November 2008 07:12 AM

Eminence Lab 12 + Amp + Box combo
 
Hi everyone ,

I recently started doing a bunch of research into upgrading the sound system in my 97 nissan maxima with the factory bose system and was pleased to find that all I need to do is some basic wiring in order to get my new head unit to work the with the bose speakers , each of which has an amp attached to it.

I decided on grabbing a clarion head unit, the DXZ785USB, but I also want One subwoofer with one amp in a nice box. Nothing ultra technical but definetly not bottom of the barrel either.

I'm feeling like for price and what I desire this is the perfect sub for the job :

[Eminence Lab 12"]

*Power handling: 400 watts RMS/800 watts max

*VCdia: 2.5" *Le: 1.48 mH

*Impedance: 6 ohms *Re: 4.29 ohms

*Frequency range: 25-125 Hz

*Magnet weight: 160 oz. *Fs: 22 Hz

*Sensitivity: 89.2 dB 1W/1m *Vas: 4.4 cu. ft.

*Qms: 13.32 *Qes: 0.39 *Qts: 0.38

*Xmax: 13 mm

*Dimensions: Overall Diameter: 12.32", Cutout Diameter: 10.98", Mounting Depth: 6.44".


http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...90-570&scqty=1

does anyone have a box design and monoblock amp they suggest on pairing with this sub ??

I'm HOPING I can get away with spending less than 200 dollars on an amp. I'm not looking to win competitions but i'm certainly not looking to pair this sub with a piece of crap either.

seeing as i'm a novice at best in this area I was wondering if you guys could offer some advice so I dont royally f**k something up. Not that i'm half retarded but I do like to be thorough in my choices.

thanks for any input/links , ect ...

MatthewS 5th November 2008 08:20 AM

Re: Eminence Lab 12 + Amp + Box combo
 
Quote:

Originally posted by metaverse
Hi everyone ,

I recently started doing a bunch of research into upgrading the sound system in my 97 nissan maxima with the factory bose system and was pleased to find that all I need to do is some basic wiring in order to get my new head unit to work the with the bose speakers , each of which has an amp attached to it.

I decided on grabbing a clarion head unit, the DXZ785USB, but I also want One subwoofer with one amp in a nice box. Nothing ultra technical but definetly not bottom of the barrel either.

I'm feeling like for price and what I desire this is the perfect sub for the job :

[Eminence Lab 12"]

*Power handling: 400 watts RMS/800 watts max

*VCdia: 2.5" *Le: 1.48 mH

*Impedance: 6 ohms *Re: 4.29 ohms

*Frequency range: 25-125 Hz

*Magnet weight: 160 oz. *Fs: 22 Hz

*Sensitivity: 89.2 dB 1W/1m *Vas: 4.4 cu. ft.

*Qms: 13.32 *Qes: 0.39 *Qts: 0.38

*Xmax: 13 mm

*Dimensions: Overall Diameter: 12.32", Cutout Diameter: 10.98", Mounting Depth: 6.44".


http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...90-570&scqty=1

does anyone have a box design and monoblock amp they suggest on pairing with this sub ??

I'm HOPING I can get away with spending less than 200 dollars on an amp. I'm not looking to win competitions but i'm certainly not looking to pair this sub with a piece of crap either.

seeing as i'm a novice at best in this area I was wondering if you guys could offer some advice so I dont royally f**k something up. Not that i'm half retarded but I do like to be thorough in my choices.

thanks for any input/links , ect ...



My first thought? Good luck..

Eminance has been one of the largest OEM speaker manu's in the USA, making OEM woofers for a TON of prestigous companies past and present. When it comes to loudspeakers, they know what they are doing.

That said, it's a 6 ohm SVC driver, that would like to have 400 watts RMS and you want a monoblock that delivers that wattage, into that impeadance, for under 200 bones.. thats where the dream ends.

Most mobile amplfiers are geared to produce their rates RMS wattage at 4 ohms, and keep doubling down. Low loads, and high current are the order of the day these days for anything remotely in your price range and they will not yield what that sub wants at that impeadance. Some older monoblocks along the lines of Linear Power were high voltage amplifiers and would give you what you need. But those came with a 1k+ pricetag when new, and still get over 500 bucks all day long used depending on the model.

Your best bet? look for a stereo amplifier with a CEA rated 600 watts RMS @ 4 ohm mono, and bridge the sucker. And you'll probably buy any one of those amps in your price range used. So I wouldn't be dreaming of a crispy new unit if I were you. At least if you want anything quality that lives up to it's standards.

You chose a nice sub. If I were to go with PE for my drivers, I would have went all out on the Dayton Titanic MKIII's. But you can't go wrong with that sub. Just think you need to bend a little on the idea of a new monoblock doing what you need for that driver because if you do manage to find one, it's not going to be under 200 bucks.


- Matt

tsmith1315 5th November 2008 12:51 PM

Re: Re: Eminence Lab 12 + Amp + Box combo
 
Metaverse,

It shouldn't be that big of ordeal to match a sub to the Bose (25Wx4) system.

What are your plans/expectations? I mean, are you just looking to round out the Bose system and enjoy the music, or do you plan on impressing people down the block?

That's a very nice woofer, but would you consider other options?

metaverse 5th November 2008 06:13 PM

Hey Matt and T,

Thanks for the replys :)

Apologies for not listing this off sooner ... I wrote that message late last night before bed.

What I'm looking for , mainly , is to get down around 30hz. Mainly because I listen to alot of electronic music that focus' mainly on low end ... Now that doesn't mean I want the whole block to hear me , i'm more concerned with having accurate response at a mediocre volume level than I am with impressing everyone around me.
Although at the same time I do like cranking my music, especially on the highway ... so a decent amount of loudness is good too.

That DAYTON MKIII looks awesome ... and from reading the reviews i'm feeling like I should go with one of those instead especially considering the impedence issue , the price and the frequency range.


::: :::

Yes I would consider any other options that would get me to 30hz and below for under 500 bucks for a sub and amp combo. Although i'm guessing i'll probably have to build my own box for the Dayton ...:smash:

metaverse 5th November 2008 06:53 PM

Hows this amp for the dayton sound ??

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=263-906

The only thing that me and my beginner self is feeling might be an issue is the frequency response only goes to 300hz and the dayton goes to 500hz :confused:

MatthewS 5th November 2008 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by metaverse
Hows this amp for the dayton sound ??

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=263-906

The only thing that me and my beginner self is feeling might be an issue is the frequency response only goes to 300hz and the dayton goes to 500hz :confused:

If your referring to this one,

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=295-404

It's a very nice driver, and the one I spoke of. Give it 500 watts rms @ 4 ohms with just about any respectable two channel amplifier bridged mono that is 250x2rms and the mono summed channels will give you both channels combined (mono) and will be cheaper then any dedicated monoblock. That PG amp is nice, but A more reasonable choice would be for example this one (if your hearts set on a mono amp);

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=267-123

Under 200 bucks, and 600 RMS @ 4 ohms. Now it's a good bang for the buck amp, so you can expect it to clip lower then it's rms ratings. But I have one at the shop I benched and I got over 400RMS @ 4 ohms before the sine began to clip, and that was at 50hz @ 14.4v. So with a driver amp combo like that, you could get it done for under 400.00 for the pair. Not too shabby.

And that driver has a nice low fs of 22hz, and tons of excursion at 18mm linear. For the music you like, and what your looking to gain I would build a simple vented enclosure tuned in the high 40's (hz) If you need help with that I could plug the thiel smalls into one of my programs and get you the internal volume and port dimensions. When tuned properly you can gain anywhere from 3 to 6 db's of effeciency and the bass will be very punchy, which is good for your music, and yet ample and deep enough for other stuff too.

As far as the frequency response matching, I wouldn't concern myself with that. When I begin an install that is basic, with no dedicated midbass drivers, I start the crossover cutoff setting at about 125hz and work my way either a hair up or start going DOWN until I'm satisfied. You don't even want to play that thing up in the 200's let alone 500hz.. Your using this for sub duty which most professionals view as 80hz and DOWN. Anything above is set to start rolling off at the crossover which that amplifier has built in.

A quick word on tuned port gains, 3db is essentially the same as doubling your cone area or your power. So if your port gains 3db peak at 48hz, that note will sound like you have two 12" drivers back there. Generally you can get a nice slope so you will enjoy the gains throughout the area you want the driver to play. More bang for your buck sort of thing.

It's all a little complicated, but your beginning so I don't want to get too technical about things. You got enough to be dangerous right now and get yourself started and satisfied.

- Matt

tsmith1315 5th November 2008 11:09 PM

Quote:

I would consider any other options that would get me to 30hz and below for under 500 bucks for a sub and amp combo. Although i'm guessing i'll probably have to build my own box
Both of those are woofers I'd be proud to have.

Boxwise, the Lab12 really needs a couple of cubic feet which isn't small by today's standards. The Titanic can get away with a little less. Either will give you a bit more bottom ported, but the box will grow quite a bit bigger for a proper ported design.

Both options take up a reasonable amount of trunk space and leave you with sort of a "box-inside-a-box."



Or you can make it easier and cheaper on yourself:

http://www.aespeakers.com/drivers.php?driver_id=8

or:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=295-455

Both offer ~10dB more sensitivity at 20Hz than the 12" sealed box options above.

No box needed- just a good, solid, flat baffle up against the back seat.

Plenty of other speakers will work well in this arrangement too, but will usually require 2 x 10" or 12" woofers and won't quite have the 20Hz response of these purpose built IB woofers.



Don't worry too much about impedance. Other factors can be as important. Consider it, but leave the final decision to be a combination of all factors.


Quote:

The only thing that me and my beginner self is feeling might be an issue is the frequency response only goes to 300hz and the dayton goes to 500hz
Upper frequency limit is absolutely not an issue in your application. One less thing to worry about!



edit: this wasn't argumentative, Matt's answer was posted while I was typing...

metaverse 6th November 2008 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tsmith1315
Or you can make it easier and cheaper on yourself:

http://www.aespeakers.com/drivers.php?driver_id=8

or:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=295-455

Both offer ~10dB more sensitivity at 20Hz than the 12" sealed box options above.

No box needed- just a good, solid, flat baffle up against the back seat.

Plenty of other speakers will work well in this arrangement too, but will usually require 2 x 10" or 12" woofers and won't quite have the 20Hz response of these purpose built IB woofers.



Don't worry too much about impedance. Other factors can be as important. Consider it, but leave the final decision to be a combination of all factors.

You guys rock ***! thanks for the help ...

@ Matt -

thanks for the heads up on the MA audio amp, I was curious about the company , haven't heard too much about them but i've seen cars rolling around the city with MA audio stickers. If it clips a bit lower than its rated RMS but still operates rock solid than I wouldn't mind that kind of sacrifice for the cheaper money but on the other hand i'm really looking for something I can get a solid 3+ years out of without any headaches what so ever.

@Tsmith

Cheaper !? Easier!? More Space!? :worship:

I'm All about All 3 of those things ...

So from the little bit of research I did , with the Infinite Baffle setup would I basically be using my trunk as my box - with the Sub in a bracket of some sort right behind the rear seats? Would I need to fashion anything else in my trunk such as walls, ect ... ? I'm really not informed about this kind of thing ...

I had read that 10x the Vas is optimal and if that can't be achieved to go for 4x the Vas. Thats really where my beginner knowledge stops concerning IB setups.

My god this is AWESOME!!! :wave2s:

So do you like the AE's better or that 15" dayton?? And obviously that would change my amp options ...

Ya know sometimes being obsessive pays off and sometimes it just frustrates the hell out of me because I could already have something in my car - obviously not nearly as good as whats coming but still - I can't wait till that first drive with my new setup.

metaverse 6th November 2008 10:40 PM

:bawling:

Whats the deal with the "Znom : 8ohm" :confused:

ppia600 6th November 2008 11:39 PM

Get this amp http://cgi.ebay.com/OLD-SCHOOL-EARTH...1%7C240%3A1318 and a 4 or 6 ohm woofer and be :) . It has more than enough clean power.


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