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Old 2nd January 2003, 06:57 PM   #1
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Location: Phoenix AZ
Default New Thread. My DIY turntable plan

Greetings and well met everyone. This is my first post on this forum and am excited that there are many others just like me!
I've been on AudioAsylum Vinyl/Tube/Speaker/DIY forums for almost 3 years now. Built Jon Risch's bass traps, room lenses, sound panels, speaker cables 89259. Planning on building Bottlehead Foreplay and Seduction to replace my Rotel separates.

Iv'e owned an LP12 w/Basik Plus, Pro-Ject 1.2, MMF-5, NottingHam Interspace w/Hyperspace Platter. My best cartidge is the Goldring Erocia MC. I've demo'ed the Rega 3 & 25, ClearAudio Champ1, GyroDek SE, SME10.

I've posted this topic over at the Vinyl Engine and many platter material postings on AA but with limited responses. Maybe I can gain some new prespectives and insights on this forum.

DIY TURNTABLE PLAN
Buy the Teres maxxon motor ($400)
Buy Teres inverted bearings ($250)

My best friend is a master machinist and shop forman for the Univiersity of Colorado research lab with 15 years experience. I'm going to enlist his aid to manufacture the platter, plynth and possibly a separate tonearm pillar.

Platter: Sandwiched layers starting from bottom. 1" black PVC-1" alumunum-1" black PVC. Professional Plastics say they do have 1" PVC black in stock. (question: 12" platter the correct size?)

Plynth: Sandwiched layers starting from bottom. 1" Alumunum-1" black PVC. Maybe another 1" alunumun layer on top of that too?
If I were to build an armboard attached to the plnyth it would be another sandwiched layer of pvc and alumunum. Black Racing cones for the feet.

Tonearm Pillar: Stainless, Alumunum or Brass 4" cylindar. Filled with mineral oil coated lead shot. Mounted on Black Racing cones.

Options for Plynth and Platter:

Use stainless steel instead? Alumunum is 14 lbs per sq foot

1" STAINLESS T-304 ANNEALED HRAP PLATE is Weight/square foot: 41.328 pounds

0.5" STAINLESS T-304 ANNEALED HRAP PLATE is Weight/square foot: 20.664 pounds

Further resonance control: I was thinking of using that damping material sold at Parts Express. have a 1/2" thick groove carved into the bottom of the platter and run a strip of that stuff along it. This should help I was told. Maybe some of the bottom of the plynth also.

Placement: Grizzly Industrial - search on part #G9654 for this 154 lb. plate granite slab.
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Old 2nd January 2003, 10:59 PM   #2
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Default HOWDY!

Hi,

Welcome.

It appears you have big analogue plans.

Can I invite you to go through this thread?

DIY TT

It contains a wealth of information and may spark some inspiration.

I'll quite likely get back to you later if I can be of assistance.

Cheers,
__________________
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Old 2nd January 2003, 11:02 PM   #3
halojoy is offline halojoy  Sweden
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Default Good Luck StylinLP

StylinLP
Good luck with your TT-project.
It is not the easiest one can do ....

The most extreme turntable I have read about
was the prototype to this
ELP Laser Turntable -
This is a simpler one!, with a price more suitable for the consumers market:

ELP Laser Turntable

Keep us informed how your work goes.
There are a lot of people here who knows about this subject.

This is the turntable without a needle but with a laser!

http://www.elpj.com/images/laserturntable.jpg

/halojoy - uses needle
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Old 3rd January 2003, 12:21 AM   #4
halojoy is offline halojoy  Sweden
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Default Correction to previous post

The most extreme turntable I have read about
is not the ELP player.
-----------------------------------------------------------
I ment the constructions of Takeshi Teragaki.
His first extreme TT was SIGMA 5000.
But then he made a simpler version for consumers market.
It was SIGMA 3000.
Both uses a laser first to read all of the vinyl record.
Then the data is used to guide the arm and the pickup
through the tracks. It follows the tracks
with perfect tracking! when the record is played.

Only the pickup head has a weight of 400 grams.
But the arm is steared by this replaying robot
in an "irongrip" with hyper precision, based on the data.
At shows Teragaki invited the visitors the try to
lift the arm of the player by force, but nobody succeded!
----------------------------------------------------------
Here is some pictures of SIGMA 5000 Mk II
SIGMA 5000 Mk II - Gallery

Here is the simpler machine with same technique SIGMA 3000
including 3 different prototypes
See Teragaki
Teragaki SIGMA turntables

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Here is one prototype to the first SIGMA 5000
Attached Images
File Type: jpg sigma5000proto.jpg (17.7 KB, 2706 views)
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Old 3rd January 2003, 12:40 AM   #5
Apogee is offline Apogee  United States
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Default Welcome StylinLP!

You might consider checking out some of the parts from these guys... They have taken the Teres project to the next level...

http://www.redpoint-audio-design.com/

If you call and speak with Thom, you'll find him very knowledgeable as well as a very nice guy!

Good Luck!
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"If I had my life to live over again, I would have made a rule to read some poetry and listen to some music at least once a week." - Charles Darwin
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Old 3rd January 2003, 12:51 AM   #6
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Location: Phoenix AZ
Default Interesting laser table

That laser turntable is quite interesting but I'm in no way interested in my analog sound touching an ounce of digital.
I can't wait to get away from transistors and build my Bottlehead tube preamp and phono preamp.

I was looking over the weight of alumunum and stainless steel. Looks like stainless is twice as heavy at half the thickness. I have no idea what the sound properties of the two is or the resonance so maybe I should stick with Alumunum since thats the common material used by $2000 and up turntables. Here is a listing of what some of the $2000 and up turntables use for platters.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First off, most tables under $1000 retail are made of spun glass. bright harsh sounding resonating glass platter. Turntables don't come any cheaper. Sheer Audio has a Acrylic replacement acrylic platter provides tighter, deeper, and more accurate sound reproduction. The highs are cleaned up and resonances at higher frequencies are eliminated.

Once you get into the $1000 to $1500 range of tables all the platters are made of solid acrylic. Even platters of this material has some major weakness's. Acrylic doen't handle energy very well. It reflects the energy up back into the stylist. Both frequency extremes are stepped down. High end because of the channeled energy and low end because of the weight and rotational inertia. Some companies like Teres will add lead shot weights or other companies will add gold layered pucks to the platter to compensate for this. Linn's LP12 is a marvel of engineering. LP12 will hang onto a note a little longer than most tables resulting in a longer decay. Acrylic cuts off notes rather short unless its heavy and weighted enough to compensate some of it.

Now we get to the $2000 and up turntables. With the exception of ClearAudio and Basis tables all turntables use several materials combined or in layers for the best performance. If you read the manufactures websites they do explain whats in their platters.

Mitchel uses proprietary self-damping compound of
carbon/vinyl -loaded acrylic.

Kuzma - STABI XL
platter is a sandwich construction of aluminium and
acrylic plates screwed together in pre-stressed form to damp all unwanted vibration

Kuzma - Stabi Reference
This is constructed from two plates, each plate being made from a sandwich construction of two 10 mm aluminium plates, separated by an acrylic plate clamped together with prestressed, non-magnetic, stainless steel screws

Bluenote Bellagio Turntable
The 40mm thick platter is actually two 20mm thick black rectified polyvinyl discs. 16 gold plated weights increase the peripheral weight (and rotational stability). They also serve to dissipate vibrations.

Acoustic Signature - Final Tool
Ruggedly built, with precision machined, 24lb damped aluminum platter

Nottingham Hyperspace
The 'mat' on the interface between the record and Hyperspace is a 25mm thick
graphite platter - which, when married to the soft alloy underneath and coupled by the three anti-expansion rubber rings round the platter, forms a very inert combination indeed

VPI/ARIES TURNTABLE
in an HW-19 sized package. The platter, comprised of an
acrylic/aluminum/lead sandwich

TNT Mk.V Hotrod
materials comprising the platter (aluminum and
lead-filled acrylic) have been carefully matched to damp unwanted vibrations in the vinyl disc

Teres
Solid Acrylic with lead shot filled

Red Point
Solid PVC and Drilled alumunum/PVC
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Old 3rd January 2003, 10:06 PM   #7
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I'm planning to make my platter sandwich comprising 1.5" aluminium base filled with leadshots/oil bolted together with several layers of 10 mm acrylic (Redpoint style). Bolts make the layers replacement experiment possible, and provide good path for vibrations to be sunken in leadshots bath. Recently I'm trying to reduce the aluminium base machining cost compartible with Teres ledfilled platter.

Cheers,
Michael
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Old 4th January 2003, 02:35 PM   #8
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Default NOTTINGHAM

Hi,

Quote:
Nottingham Hyperspace The 'mat' on the interface between the record and Hyperspace is a 25mm thick
graphite platter - which, when married to the soft alloy underneath and coupled by the three anti-expansion rubber rings round the platter, forms a very inert combination indeed
The idea of using graphite as a material for a TT mat was given to Tom Fletcher by me after I reported the excellent results I had with this on my own Mentor Reference TT.

It has the added advantage of effectively ridding static charges of the records.

The soft alloy you are referring to is actually Zamac,an alu alloy.

The outer rubber rings we used already on the Dias TT,these deaden the platter very effectively without compromising the springiness of the platter in the vertical plane.

Cheers,
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Old 4th January 2003, 05:38 PM   #9
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Default NottingHam platters

Fdegrove!
Awsome, someone that knows how the mystical NottingHam platters are made. I've been very curious how they did it. There simply is not much information on the ASL website explaining this. I have a few questions

What exactly is this graphite? Is this some sort of thick matt? Its obviously been stamped/milled with a pattern. Woven pattern? I think its around an 1/2" thick.

Also, the alumunum Zamac. The website of online metals didn't have this material. It does have a listing of differant alumunum's offered. Here is the list below. Could this be one of them?


Aluminum 6061-T6 Bare Plate 1" thick weights 14 lbs


17-4 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

T-302 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE 1/2" thick weights 20lbs

T-304 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

T-316 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

T-321 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

T-347 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

T-410 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE

Maybe I should be looking for another website? Do you know of a website that sells Zamac by the raw plate? Know what it weights?
Does this have a higher damping factor than either Alumunum or Stainles Steel?

Originally my platter I'm designing was going to consist of this. starting from the bottom layer it goes...
T-302 STAINLESS STEEL PLATE 1/2" thick weights 20lbs
PVC black 2 1/2" have no idea what this weights

I wanted to build a sandwiched layered platter consisting of.....
Aluminum 6061-T6 Bare Plate 1" thick weights 14 lbs
PVC black 1" (weights? I will have to call Professional Plastics)
Aluminum 6061-T6 Bare Plate 1" thick weights 14 lbs

I didn't think having a top layer of solid alumunum would sound good. Something about how the vinyl reacts pressed against the Alumunum. Energy. But VPI does this with their new TNT table using some sort of (carbon? graphite?) platter mat.
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Old 4th January 2003, 06:52 PM   #10
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Default TT

Hi,

Re the graphite platter.

It is indeed a weave of graphite impregnated carbon but that is all I can tell you about it.

Zamac contains a high % of zinc (Zn) and its' Q factor will depend on the relation between the two of these metals.

I couldn't find much usefull info for you either but it certainly is not one you mentioned in your posts.

Quote:
Does this have a higher damping factor than either Alumunum or Stainles Steel?
It does.

Cheers,
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