Hello to you all,first time I make a post on this forum.I recently bought a new table,analog reading.It's a THORENS TD 115 MKII,I had it second hand so it was kindda cheap(70 euros).Works perfectly,and cartridge associated is the Shure M95EDM.
I don't know much about analog tables but I found the combination of the 2 awsome.Much better than my previous attempt.
Especially on 33/1/3 LP of the Final Cut by Pink Floyd,the sound is rich ,well detailed,subtle,huge and powerful sometimes (depends of the mix and age of vinyl).
I am shocked by all those listening qualities.In my opinion gets so much better and expressive than CDs!!!....
Can anyone advise me on best way to tune weight and antiskating,etc.Is it possible to modify electronics inside (especially speed regulation)???
Please answer me !!!!!
Best regards
Anael
PS:I have an Alephono in construction.To match the THORENS...
I don't know much about analog tables but I found the combination of the 2 awsome.Much better than my previous attempt.
Especially on 33/1/3 LP of the Final Cut by Pink Floyd,the sound is rich ,well detailed,subtle,huge and powerful sometimes (depends of the mix and age of vinyl).I am shocked by all those listening qualities.In my opinion gets so much better and expressive than CDs!!!....
Can anyone advise me on best way to tune weight and antiskating,etc.Is it possible to modify electronics inside (especially speed regulation)???
Please answer me !!!!!
Best regards
Anael
PS:I have an Alephono in construction.To match the THORENS...
Welcome nar
(says he with 5000 LPs and <50 CDs)
I'm not that familiar with either of these... so can't help with the details. Making sure that the cartridge alignment is right makes a big difference. There is a thread with a number of attached templates.
Dig thru the analogue forum, there is much to learn there.
dave
(says he with 5000 LPs and <50 CDs)I'm not that familiar with either of these... so can't help with the details. Making sure that the cartridge alignment is right makes a big difference. There is a thread with a number of attached templates.
Dig thru the analogue forum, there is much to learn there.
dave
Hi nar,
I don't want to bring you down, but the TD115 belongs not to the highly recommended Thorens-tables. It represents the attempt to trick physics with electronics... The platter and the whole device is light-weighted, and I guess by your question there might be some problems covering that issue.
You will find that e.g. the models TD150, TD160 and others won't have speed stability problems. These are robust as sewing machines.
Of course you can work over the electronics board, check transistors and caps!
Anyway, have fun with the device (and keep an eye open for another thorens... ;-)
Rüdiger
I don't want to bring you down, but the TD115 belongs not to the highly recommended Thorens-tables. It represents the attempt to trick physics with electronics... The platter and the whole device is light-weighted, and I guess by your question there might be some problems covering that issue.
You will find that e.g. the models TD150, TD160 and others won't have speed stability problems. These are robust as sewing machines.
Of course you can work over the electronics board, check transistors and caps!
Anyway, have fun with the device (and keep an eye open for another thorens... ;-)
Rüdiger
should be ok. There are different versions around (of TD150, TD14x, TD16x): some have plastic inner platters, some metal. There are two different spindels as well: one is 7mm, the former (?) is 10mm in diameter. The thicker one is regarded to be superior, though I have never compared those directly. The bearings are different here, too.
There have been several posts in german forums regarding the grading of different thorens editions, however, it seems somewhat unpredictable which features a given edition has.
Rüdiger
There have been several posts in german forums regarding the grading of different thorens editions, however, it seems somewhat unpredictable which features a given edition has.
Rüdiger
Thought I'd add a bit. The Thorens TD-145 is exactly like a TD-160 with the addition of an electronic arm lift.
As for suspension adjustment, if you have a very solid foundation to set the table on, the springs should be set as soft as they can go without bottoming out when lightly bounced. If, however, you have a springy floor and have a problem with footfalls causing groove jumping, try adjusting the springs tight so that the sub-chassis and main chassis are as one solid chassie with no suspension. This practically eliminates footfall problems. The motor on these is so small and smooth running that I could hear no extra noise when doing listening tests even though there was no isolation being brought about by having a suspension system.
Dave
As for suspension adjustment, if you have a very solid foundation to set the table on, the springs should be set as soft as they can go without bottoming out when lightly bounced. If, however, you have a springy floor and have a problem with footfalls causing groove jumping, try adjusting the springs tight so that the sub-chassis and main chassis are as one solid chassie with no suspension. This practically eliminates footfall problems. The motor on these is so small and smooth running that I could hear no extra noise when doing listening tests even though there was no isolation being brought about by having a suspension system.
Dave
thorens motors.
Hi to you all.I have upgraded the td115mkII with a New Grado cartridge,the black prestige one.Amazing!...
All my LPs sound more transparent.
But...still some unsatisfactions.I do not plan to buy a new table.I would like to improve speed stability.I changed the belt for a new one,exact size.The old one was a little loose
Does anyone know how to improve speed stability on this model?
I know I could
1) add some mass inside the metal plate.The question is to do it equally ,and which is the limit?Afterwards the motor will be heavily driven.
2)change the ugly stoboscope with a neon wired on the mains.It is the only speed control but not accurate enough.As the frequency of the AC line is to vary +/-4%.I have in mind a ne555 to get a precise 50Hz flash with leds.
3An external motor...with no belt but a single wire instead,going outside the metal plate.With a DC motor turning very fast seems the speed for the record could be more precise.I could power the motor with a reulated variable DC supply to tune speed precisely(i.e.LM317 with multiturn trimmer).
what do you think guys?
Best regards
Hi to you all.I have upgraded the td115mkII with a New Grado cartridge,the black prestige one.Amazing!...
All my LPs sound more transparent.
But...still some unsatisfactions.I do not plan to buy a new table.I would like to improve speed stability.I changed the belt for a new one,exact size.The old one was a little loose
Does anyone know how to improve speed stability on this model?
I know I could
1) add some mass inside the metal plate.The question is to do it equally ,and which is the limit?Afterwards the motor will be heavily driven.
2)change the ugly stoboscope with a neon wired on the mains.It is the only speed control but not accurate enough.As the frequency of the AC line is to vary +/-4%.I have in mind a ne555 to get a precise 50Hz flash with leds.
3An external motor...with no belt but a single wire instead,going outside the metal plate.With a DC motor turning very fast seems the speed for the record could be more precise.I could power the motor with a reulated variable DC supply to tune speed precisely(i.e.LM317 with multiturn trimmer).
what do you think guys?
Best regards
Re: thorens motors.
You could build your own AC power supply with tighter control over frequency (& grunge). Somewhere (in the intro forum i think) is a tidbit from a fellow who built one of these for his 220V/50 Hz Thorens when he moved to Vancouver.
I'd be interested in this kind of thing too. I have a 50 Hz Linn motor i need to drive.
dave
nar said:
You could build your own AC power supply with tighter control over frequency (& grunge). Somewhere (in the intro forum i think) is a tidbit from a fellow who built one of these for his 220V/50 Hz Thorens when he moved to Vancouver.
I'd be interested in this kind of thing too. I have a 50 Hz Linn motor i need to drive.
dave
Yes, an AC maker seems to be fine
I'm doing this thing (I'm very slow and lazy ) and someday I will finish it. It's well explained in another thread I opened, search for the "Change in the frequency mains" one.
Seems to be an easy project and someone reported good results.
I wouldn't try to put mass in the platter. The Inertia would be higher, but if a perfect calibration can't be achieved the medicine is worse than the illness.
To fit a DC motor with voltage controls doesn't seem bad. I¡m going to search for a kit from some electronic supplier.
I'm doing this thing (I'm very slow and lazy
) and someday I will finish it. It's well explained in another thread I opened, search for the "Change in the frequency mains" one.Seems to be an easy project and someone reported good results.
I wouldn't try to put mass in the platter. The Inertia would be higher, but if a perfect calibration can't be achieved the medicine is worse than the illness.
To fit a DC motor with voltage controls doesn't seem bad. I¡m going to search for a kit from some electronic supplier.
The looser the springs are adjusted, the longer the bounce time, as it lowers the resonant frequency. Tighter makes shorter rate bounces. I'm not sure why this is, but it seems to be, at least it did with mine. Not a big difference, but noticeable.makinson1 said:
I re-read what I wrote earlier and need to make a correction. The springs shouldn't be tight enough to make the sub-chassis actually touch chassis. If floor bounce is a problem, though, I've found that having them as stiff as possible helped in my room. I never did eliminate the problem, though, and ended up selling both my TD-145 and TD-160. I bought a suspensionless table and made a high mass plinth. Foot-fall problems are gone now.
Dave
Td150
Hi,
Mak is right.
The bottom of the springs sit on the washers and in turn on the adjusting nuts. The tops of the spring support the rubber washer and that supports thearms of the cruciform that holds the spindle bearing.
The cruciform/bearing/platter float on the springs.
Adjusting the nuts just moves the platter up and down and when incorrectly set tilts it as well.
Correct adjustment eliminates the tilt and this may give a better bounce. It should not adjust the frequency.
However, the sponges inserted in the springs may change the damping immediately after an adjustment and this temporary condition could lead to an apparently changed bounce. As the sponges settle into their new positions the original damping and frequency will return.
Hi,
Mak is right.
The bottom of the springs sit on the washers and in turn on the adjusting nuts. The tops of the spring support the rubber washer and that supports thearms of the cruciform that holds the spindle bearing.
The cruciform/bearing/platter float on the springs.
Adjusting the nuts just moves the platter up and down and when incorrectly set tilts it as well.
Correct adjustment eliminates the tilt and this may give a better bounce. It should not adjust the frequency.
However, the sponges inserted in the springs may change the damping immediately after an adjustment and this temporary condition could lead to an apparently changed bounce. As the sponges settle into their new positions the original damping and frequency will return.
That may be what it was. The foam was rotted on mine, so I replaced it with some that was in there tight. Never thought of the foam catching on the bolt threads and making a difference, but I can see where it would. Thanks for clearing it up. Makes sense now.
Perhaps one can fine tune the suspension by how much and how tight the foam is?
Dave
Perhaps one can fine tune the suspension by how much and how tight the foam is?
Dave
I rechecked the service manual (available for free download at VinylEngine.com) and it reads "the plastic gizmos raise and lower the chassis. Interestingly emough it shows an optional (disco balls) device to replace the springs in high vibration environments that look like little tennis balls or black rubber balls. So we are back to the beginning: put the TT on a stout stand, level the stand. Adjust the Thorens srews to level the plinth. Hope for the best. Many people, myself included, believe that the foam spring inserts are rubbish. I even tried filling mine with scraps of sorbothane. Probably did more harm than good by raising the fundamental frequency above 3Hz. Would love th know the stock Thorens spring rates. I used to have a contraption that had a scale on the bottom with a platform for the spring, an arbor press type lever to compress the spring, and a dial indicator on top to mesure deflection or amount of compression. So you would pull down on the arm a little, the scale would read 1.25 lbs, the dial indicator would read 0.25in, so we knew by simple division that that spring was 5lbs/inch. mayve if I put my digital phono stylus gauge in the bottom of my rifle cartridge reloading press, inserted the Thorens spring, taped my 6" machinists rule to the side, pulled down on the arm, read the scales and did the math, I would know the Thorens Spring Rate. Actually this would be darn accurate. I could see which springs had gone soft after 35 years of use. Thene I could buy a variety of springs from McMaster-Carr and Small Parts Inc to play with and fine hone the suspension. Sorry for the verbose reply, but sometimes waxing prolix clarifies the muddied waters of discourse. This maters to me personally because I need springs for my new DIY TT Thorens clone: see attached jpg.
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