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Old 21st March 2006, 08:41 AM   #11
owen is offline owen  United Kingdom
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The mouse cable is very similar to the headphone cable, except that you can get 6N and/or pcocc wire in it. The construction tends to be co-axial, so a bit better screening...

It does work well, but that mouse cable sounds interesting

Owen
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Old 21st March 2006, 05:07 PM   #12
JesseG is offline JesseG  Canada
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Quote:
Does it work well also with low mass tonearms, I've a Mayware. Do you have tested with mc cartridge?
Lo-mass arm it works fine - I have a delicate little unipivot I built myself (just playing around). Ths total mass of this arm, without cartridge, is 11gm. Mouse wire has worked very well in it and, because the wire is so flexible, does not interfere in tracking at all.

I have used it with a medium-optput MC - 1.5mV - not yet with a true low oputput (<.5mV) unit. I have no doubt it will work as well as any conductor and better than most. I would probably twist the pairs for use with a lo-output MC.

The teflon coating is as good a diaelectric as can be found, so capacitance is minimum with this wire.

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The mouse cable is very similar to the headphone cable, except that you can get 6N and/or pcocc wire in it. The construction tends to be co-axial, so a bit better screening...
I agree, and tried headphone coax when I did the Grace rewire, however 2 strands was just too large in diameter. I also found that it was a bit too stiff for a unipivot arm like the grace, which is why I went looking for another alternative.

As for how it sounds, I'd say it is pretty neutral. I fancy that I am getting more detail and "micro-dynamics" from my vinyl now, but haven't noticed any coloration or tonal shift with any of the rewire projects I have done.

And, in the end, it is kind of a "try it - you'll like" thing - the materials are so cheap and the rewire so simple that you can do this in an hour to see if it works for you.

BTW: I have found a neat trick for threading the wire without taking the arm apart:
1) strip the cart clips from the ends of your old wires and solder all 4 wires together.
2) Cut your new mouse wire about 3" (70cm) longer than you will need.
3) Then strip about 1/2in (13mm) of all 4 of the new wire, twist them all together and tin well - then solder this to the old wires
4) begin pulling the old wire out from the bottom end of the arm, pulling the new in behind it. Provided that the old wire does not twist around any parts in the arm gimbal, the new wire will slide in when the old is being pulled out (remember, our new wire is teflon coated, so very slippery) and voila! your new wire is in place.

Now just dress the ends and attach the cart clips and your'e done. This has worked for me in three out of the 4 arms I have rewired (the fourth I had to disassemble the old-fasioned way).

Good Luck

Jess
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Old 22nd March 2006, 03:04 PM   #13
tubenut is offline tubenut  South Africa
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Had a look at a mouse cable today but the conductors seem to be about 0.85 mm dia which is a bit thick and not flexible enough imo. Insulation seemed normal PVC, mouse brand was A Open....
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Old 22nd March 2006, 04:40 PM   #14
JesseG is offline JesseG  Canada
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Insulation seemed normal PVC, mouse brand was A Open....
Yeah - could be... I would look for a big brand - Logitech or Microsoft or Apple. Newer is better. If the mouse has a DB9 serial connector, it will probably have heavier wire and pvc coating. If it has a PS2 connector, the wire will be smaller and more flexible, and probably teflon.

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Old 22nd March 2006, 06:59 PM   #15
tubenut is offline tubenut  South Africa
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Twas a PS2 unit....
I will however keep cutting the tails of dead computer mice and see what comes up. They are pretty useless for anything else....
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Old 24th March 2006, 10:14 PM   #16
fergs1 is offline fergs1  Australia
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greetings fellas, I found that of all the 8 mice I tore apart all of them the wires seemed to stiff for a unipivvot and yet the first pair of walkman headphones I demolished contained incredibly thin and pliable enamelled twisted copper (6wires per side) which is litz wire by that descriptioon. I know which one I'll be using. It may not be cardas but at that price(free) its badas(s) cheers fergs
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Old 25th March 2006, 07:07 PM   #17
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The best bang for buck you get by using copper lack wire 0,05mm (normally to wind your own coils has a polyurethan lack coating) this cst about $ 4,-- for 1500 meter and the best way to use it is to pull 4 single strands without any soldered joints from headshell to pre-amp.

I tried this first in my rega 250 (a huge imporvement over stock wire) and later changed it for silver lack wire but that was no improvement, had I known I would have sitcked to the copper version.

Conrad Kupferlackdraht
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Old 25th March 2006, 09:19 PM   #18
JesseG is offline JesseG  Canada
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Quote:
From tubenut
I will however keep cutting the tails of dead computer mice and see what comes up. They are pretty useless for anything else....
Exactly my feeling. When you find the right one...

Quote:
From fergs
the wires seemed to stiff for a unipivvot
I rewired my Grace 714 - a true unipivot (tho not lo-mass) and a very lo-mass DIY design - tracking has been flawless on both.
I guess I just got lucky

Quote:
From ericpeters
The best bang for buck you get by using copper lack wire 0,05mm
Now, this sound's interesting - where do you get this stuff?

Quote:
From ericpeters
the best way to use it is to pull 4 single strands without any soldered joints from headshell to pre-amp.
I've heard about this approach before - this sounds like the right approach to me too. The fewer connections, the better those little electrons can scurry along to the first gain stage.

Do you need to shield the 4 strands once they exit the tonearm?
Did you twist them into pairs?

Gee, this stuff is fun

Jess
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Old 25th March 2006, 09:29 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by JesseG

Now, this sound's interesting - where do you get this stuff?
- Go to www.conrad.com
- Click international or on your country's flag
type : ENAMELLED COPPER WIRE
Press the search icon.


Quote:
Originaly posete by JesseG

I've heard about this approach before - this sounds like the right approach to me too. The fewer connections, the better those little electrons can scurry along to the first gain stage.

Do you need to shield the 4 strands once they exit the tonearm?
Did you twist them into pairs?

Jess
I've twisted them slichtly after exiting the arm but I've put a separate shield around it wich was connected to ground.
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Old 29th March 2006, 12:10 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by ericpeters
The best bang for buck you get by using copper lack wire 0,05mm
0.05mm is AWG44, 0.002in for you Stateside folks. I have some AWG42, probably close enough. Really easy to break the strands, perhaps use two strands per circuit and sort them out by ohm check after rewire?

Note that insulation can't be removed by soldering iron with these small wire gauges, I've scraped them with a small knife, any better suggestions?
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