Best internal hook up wiring...............

ashok · 27th August 2005, 04:20 AM

Silver wire supposedly sounds better than copper wires when used for internal wiring in amplifiers .
Since the resistance variation between both is insignificant compared to circuit resistances , some other characteristic , as yet not determined (?), must be responsible for the audible differences.
We won't look at psychological reasons now.

Has anyone looked at copper coated aluminum wires ? Anyone tried this ? If resistance is not the reason for differences , then maybe we can look at aluminum also . They do use them in tweeters.

Anyone ?

Cheers,
Ashok.

sam9 · 27th August 2005, 06:37 AM

Silver plated copper wire like you finf in teflon hook up wire is definitely easier solder than bare cooper. In DIY we all think we are expert solderers (or at least very good) based on the joint looking like the book says it should. Yet more than once I've corrected a problem by the simple expedient of re-heating what looked like a perfect solder joint.

Thus the following hypothesis:

In DIY projects, silver, silver clad copper or silve clad something else type hook up wire can from time to time make an audible difference in the results for the simple reason that the probability of good solder joints is higher than when using bare copper (even cryogenically treated OFC with the crystals aligned however they are supossed to be aligned copper).

wes-ninja250 · 28th August 2005, 10:03 PM

Can solder silver-coated-copper with regular 60/40 electronics solder? Silver solder is a royal pain.

Thanks,
Wes

EC8010 · 30th August 2005, 08:20 AM

True silver solder isn't what is meant. What you want is the stuff that's often sold as low melting point (LMP) solder and that has 2 or 3% silver mixed in with the (nearly) 60/40 ratio of tin/lead.

wes-ninja250 · 30th August 2005, 11:47 AM

Ah, thanks for the tip. I will definately hunt for that the next time I have the opportunity!

Wes

ashok · 30th August 2005, 03:58 PM

I vaguely remember reading somewhere that it is better to use silver solder ( 2% silver ) when soldering silver wire or silver coated copper wire.
There was some explanation but I've forgotten. It seemed to make sense at the time. Does anyone know what it is ?
Cheers.

EC8010 · 30th August 2005, 10:30 PM

Yes, you must use silver-loaded solder when soldering to silver plating to prevent the silver from leaching out of the plating and making it unsolderable. This is also true for surface-mount components even though there isn't (to my knowledge) any silver in their plated soldering surfaces.

rayfutrell · 31st August 2005, 05:22 PM

The US military prohibits the use of teflon insulated silver plated wire in military equipment. The reasons are that teflon insulation will cold flow under pressure, the silver plate is succeptable to "red plague", whisker growth and electro-migration.
Regards,
Ray

EC8010 · 31st August 2005, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rayfutrell
The reasons are that teflon insulation will cold flow under pressure, the silver plate is succeptable to "red plague", whisker growth and electro-migration.

That's interesting, can you expand upon "red plague"?

rayfutrell · 31st August 2005, 06:35 PM

Red plague is a copper oxide corrosion product that forms on silver plate over copper at breaks or pinholes in the silver plate.
Regards,
Ray

27th August 2005, 04:20 AM	#1
ashok diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: 3RS	Best internal hook up wiring............... Silver wire supposedly sounds better than copper wires when used for internal wiring in amplifiers . Since the resistance variation between both is insignificant compared to circuit resistances , some other characteristic , as yet not determined (?), must be responsible for the audible differences. We won't look at psychological reasons now. Has anyone looked at copper coated aluminum wires ? Anyone tried this ? If resistance is not the reason for differences , then maybe we can look at aluminum also . They do use them in tweeters. Anyone ? Cheers, Ashok. __________________ AM

28th August 2005, 10:03 PM	#3
wes-ninja250 diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Kingston, ON	Can solder silver-coated-copper with regular 60/40 electronics solder? Silver solder is a royal pain. Thanks, Wes __________________ Do daemons dream of electric sleep()?

30th August 2005, 08:20 AM	#4
EC8010 diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Near London. UK	True silver solder isn't what is meant. What you want is the stuff that's often sold as low melting point (LMP) solder and that has 2 or 3% silver mixed in with the (nearly) 60/40 ratio of tin/lead. __________________ The loudspeaker: The only commercial Hi-Fi item where a disproportionate part of the budget isn't spent on the box. And the one where it would make a difference...

30th August 2005, 11:47 AM	#5
wes-ninja250 diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Kingston, ON	Ah, thanks for the tip. I will definately hunt for that the next time I have the opportunity! Wes __________________ Do daemons dream of electric sleep()?

30th August 2005, 03:58 PM	#6
ashok diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: 3RS	I vaguely remember reading somewhere that it is better to use silver solder ( 2% silver ) when soldering silver wire or silver coated copper wire. There was some explanation but I've forgotten. It seemed to make sense at the time. Does anyone know what it is ? Cheers. __________________ AM


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27th August 2005, 06:37 AM	#2
sam9 diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Left Coast	Silver plated copper wire like you finf in teflon hook up wire is definitely easier solder than bare cooper. In DIY we all think we are expert solderers (or at least very good) based on the joint looking like the book says it should. Yet more than once I've corrected a problem by the simple expedient of re-heating what looked like a perfect solder joint. Thus the following hypothesis: In DIY projects, silver, silver clad copper or silve clad something else type hook up wire can from time to time make an audible difference in the results for the simple reason that the probability of good solder joints is higher than when using bare copper (even cryogenically treated OFC with the crystals aligned however they are supossed to be aligned copper).

30th August 2005, 10:30 PM	#7
EC8010 diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Near London. UK	Yes, you must use silver-loaded solder when soldering to silver plating to prevent the silver from leaching out of the plating and making it unsolderable. This is also true for surface-mount components even though there isn't (to my knowledge) any silver in their plated soldering surfaces. __________________ The loudspeaker: The only commercial Hi-Fi item where a disproportionate part of the budget isn't spent on the box. And the one where it would make a difference...

31st August 2005, 05:22 PM	#8
rayfutrell diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: virginia	The US military prohibits the use of teflon insulated silver plated wire in military equipment. The reasons are that teflon insulation will cold flow under pressure, the silver plate is succeptable to "red plague", whisker growth and electro-migration. Regards, Ray

31st August 2005, 06:35 PM	#10
rayfutrell diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: virginia	Red plague is a copper oxide corrosion product that forms on silver plate over copper at breaks or pinholes in the silver plate. Regards, Ray

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