Bugle2 with Burson Dual Op Amps - diyAudio
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Old 4th November 2013, 04:17 PM   #1
httime1 is offline httime1  United States
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Default Bugle2 with Burson Dual Op Amps

Hey all! Finally back after a long term absence. I'm currently in the process of buying a Pro-ject Debut Carbon turntable with Speedbox and need a good phono MC preamp.

After some browsing for a decently priced phono MC amp I stumbled upon Mr. Hagerman's Bugle2 design( Hagerman Technology LLC: Bugle2 Phonostage $139/kit). For the money and reviews I liked what I read. This kit uses 3x OPA2134 op amps in a DIP package. Then remembered that the Burson Audio discrete op amp (HD Audio Opamp) received glowing reviews as well and that it is a direct replacement for the OPA2134 amp. So this brings me to my question:

Has anyone tried the Bugle2 with the Burson Audio discrete amps? I searched the forums and Google but found nothing. I realize that would be rather expensive but maybe the results would be impressive.

Sorry about the long description...just trying to give an accurate picture of what I'm dealing with.

*Edit: Upon further inspection the Burson's seem to be re-labled Audio-GD's http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/diy/OPA/OPAEN.htm

Last edited by httime1; 4th November 2013 at 06:46 PM. Reason: edit/discovery
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Old 4th November 2013, 05:03 PM   #2
Mooly is online now Mooly  United Kingdom
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Moved to analogue source
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Old 4th November 2013, 05:29 PM   #3
httime1 is offline httime1  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooly View Post
Moved to analogue source
Thanks, wasn't quite sure which sub-forum was the correct one.
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Old 4th November 2013, 07:11 PM   #4
httime1 is offline httime1  United States
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Additional note: Since the discrete op-amps require roughly 60mA (worst case) each, the TLE2426-Rail Splitter Precision Virtual Ground design won't be sufficient. So a discrete rail splitter must be used. Good article on the subject:

Virtual Ground Circuits
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Old 4th November 2013, 09:58 PM   #5
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The older Bugle with the PSU kit might be more suitable. I believe the RIAA/signal portions are basically the same with different power (old: batteries or PSU kit, new: wall wart). The old PSU kit put out 100mA per 15V rail:

http://www.hagtech.com/pdf/powersupply.pdf

I use one of the older Bugles and PSU kits daily with OPA2134's. Nice sound. I'm actually searching around for the next phono preamp project right now (thinking about JFETs), more for a different sound than anything lacking with the Bugle. Perhaps once I've got a new phono preamp running, I'll look more into modding the old Bugle.

Also, The Burson discrete opamps claim 19mA draw per module. Is that 38mA for a dual? Not exactly clear.

Last edited by Sodacose; 4th November 2013 at 10:25 PM.
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Old 4th November 2013, 11:13 PM   #6
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That discrete op amp looks like a solution in search of a problem. On second thought, it seems to add possible problems to a competent design.
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Old 5th November 2013, 06:27 AM   #7
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The Bugle 2 is excellent as is. I have replaced a much more expensive preamp with the Bugle 2 and am more than happy.

I believe that audible changes can only be achieved with a product of this quality by adding distortion of one kind of another, so the real question is this: what kind of distortion do you want to add?

I like a bit of harmonic distortion for some kinds of very simple music - e.g. a solo guitar and voice, where the distortion adds a bit of "ambiance". It's almost like adding echo, or a chorus effect.

But for most music, and as my daily listening solution, low distortion, low noise, wide bandwidth and high headroom are the name of the game.

So I would not change the Bugle 2 at least until you've lived with it for a while and have a clear idea of what you want to change and why.

tim
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Old 5th November 2013, 09:26 PM   #8
httime1 is offline httime1  United States
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Thanks for the replies. I did find someone who had a similar idea but he's using them as a headphone amp instead. I sometimes can't leave well enough alone I'll see if I can dig that link back up....forgot to bookmark it.
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Old 7th November 2013, 03:21 PM   #9
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It will work for high output MC cartridges, for lower ones you may need to add the Piccolo. I would inquire to Jim ( who by the way is a great designer and person) if the MC cartridge is suitable for the bugle. I built the bugle one with the power supply in the same case and had a little hum issue I never could resolve (probably my ineptness). You will find several other projects here for high end MC preamps, I have built the paradise but have not had an opportunity to try it yet. If you are new to building it may be a bit much as a first time project. You may also consider the Salas Folded Simplistic Phono PCB. Those are in the group buy section.

Good luck
Bill
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Old 9th November 2013, 03:52 PM   #10
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The Bugle2 can be built with 2 different gain settings and probably even more for those who proficient in modding. It can be set for either MM or MC. Granted, I personally have not tried the MC gain setting as I don't have any low output MC. But, I would suspect it may not have all the necessary gain for all low output MC.
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