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Old 7th October 2013, 08:54 PM   #11
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The two blue wires are connected both to one wire (neutral for example) of the mains.
There is a capacitor between red and black.
For CW connect the other wire (line) of the mains to the red wire, for CCW connect to the black.

Of course if you use a two phase inverter or another power supply you must remove the capacitor and drive the two coils separately.

Last edited by Arch Stanton; 7th October 2013 at 08:56 PM.
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Old 7th October 2013, 09:01 PM   #12
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gotcha!
The problem with the capacitor is that if I want to go down in frequency, say 42 Hz to get to 33 1/3 RMP, the size of the cap has to be different from the regular 60Hz recommended by the manufacturer.
This is what I was told by Hurst. With the 2 phase sine wave generator, I don't need capacitor so no problem with that.

Isn't there any better AC motor than the Hurst I am currently using?
Still waiting on some expert here to pour out some good advice
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Old 8th October 2013, 02:26 AM   #13
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Little update, I have bought few orings at the store tonight.
Unfortunately, they were all too thick though.
As a result, the motor would just stall running out of torque unable to turn the platter even if I would try to push it.
Confirmed by me trying to turn the platter and it turned out to be pretty hard.
So I trimmed the oring out with snippers to make it thinner.
Result was that the platter spinner properly at that point. The method seemed to work well, in regard to speed regulation, much better than belt.
Nevertheless there was an audible noise when platter spins and my guess is that it's not the motor but rather the irregular oring causing irregular rubbing noise.
Also, is there any recommendation as far as what material to use for oring?
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Old 8th October 2013, 02:43 AM   #14
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefanoo View Post
I have started fiddling around with my VPI classic 3 + SDS.
Hi,

You want an experts opinion ? After spending $6K on a turntable
you have got more money than sense thinking you can improve it.
If you can then you've spent $6K on a very poorly designed turntable.

rgds, sreten.

FWIW you should be able to interject a precision tensioned rubber wheel
between the motor and the rim solving all of your imagine problems,
for one speed at least, but I doubt it will work better than it does.
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Last edited by sreten; 8th October 2013 at 03:00 AM.
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Old 8th October 2013, 02:54 AM   #15
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Your input makes little sense. I could kind of see your point somehow.
However, if you have noticed the motor is not a top quality part. I haven't received yet an advice on that. Does it mean that no better motor than ac hurst exists?
Also all vpi tables but the classic have access to the rim drive upgrade.
If you research, many people have benefited from either single the rim drive or a Teres direct drive.
Research and you will see it for your self.
Does it mean that many tables are poorly designed? Well I don't think so. I just think that a rim drive is a viable SURE upgrade. I also have a linear air bearing tone arm, does it still mean that the table is poorly designed?
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Old 8th October 2013, 11:54 AM   #16
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Hi,

If its viable SURE upgrade why don't VPI offer it then ?

In what way is the motor not "a top quality part " ?

For sure its high speed motor intended for belt drive.

rgds, sreten.
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Old 8th October 2013, 04:32 PM   #17
dtut is offline dtut  United States
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Stefano,

Have you seen the VPI rim drive upgrade? Even if you don't want to buy it, you might get some ideas for your own conversion.
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Old 8th October 2013, 07:31 PM   #18
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Yes I know...thank you for bringing that in. Unfortunately it wouldn't work with my classic 3. Play can't reach there.
Have a look at my vpi classic 3 maybe can help understand a little the situation...
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Old 9th October 2013, 12:40 AM   #19
AVWERK is offline AVWERK  United States
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I have to agree with sreten on the motor. I use the same one and even though I use a non standard lead filled acrylic platter and have to hand start it sometimes, I can detect no speed issues compared to my other SOTA star table. I might even say maybe slightly even better, but thats a tough one.

I would like to know what it is about a physical contact rim drive concept that people are so interested in. Is there some documentation that shows more speed stability or lower rumble ( having trouble on that one) that moves people in this direction?

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Old 9th October 2013, 01:21 AM   #20
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I don't know if the motor is a high quality part or not....that is why I was asking to experts here.
On all my research I have done so far, hurst motors seem to be considered pretty low/average quality.
Speed stability is in the nature of an AC motor, provided the sine wave fed to it is stable. The problem with an AC is hum/mechanical noise.

Not sure what the sonic qualities of pulley vs belt, since I have never owned one, not lessrumble IMHO.
I am pretty sure that it should be more resolving on highly modulated passages.
Think about the amount of pressured imparted by the needle on highly modulated passages. The belt will automatically stretch out.
Provided the motor won't slow down, the platter will initially slow down and then belt will pull back thus accelerating the rotation and then it will settle down to the proper speed.
Now,in a complex recording, these hard passages will happen constantly and a frequency distortion will occur throughout.
Apparently frequency distortion is even worse than amplitude, as ear is more sensitive to tone and timing than it is to clipping.
This is the main reason why I am chasing after the rim drive solution.

My platter spins pretty nice and I noticed that noise is very related to the material and thickness used for the oring.
I will contact vpi to ask for a recommendation. For sure though...I can't imagine the pulley being quieter than a belt...just my two cents.
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Last edited by Stefanoo; 9th October 2013 at 01:41 AM.
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