How to calculate RIAA correctly?

Onvinyl · 16th October 2003, 08:26 AM

Hi,
has anybody an article, link or software where the calculating of parts values for the riaa filter is explained deeply for various concepts? That explanation should include the relevant surroundings like impedance of following stages etc.
I would really like to understand such things correctly, in existing designs as well as for trying own ideas.
greets & thanks,
Rudiger

peranders · 16th October 2003, 09:53 AM

I have two Excel files, one for inverting RIAA amp and one for a non-inverting.

Anybody who wants these send me an email,

Do not post me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, etc here

Output is like this:
http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-50674/hif...diagram_ai.gif
http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-50674/hif...lerance_ai.gif

rfbrw · 16th October 2003, 10:48 AM

Stanley P. Lipshitz.
On RIAA Equalization Networks.
Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 27(6), June 1979.

Peter J. Baxandall
Comments on "On RIAA Equalization Networks"
Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 29(1), Jan 1981.

Stanley P. Lipshitz
Author's Reply to "Comments on 'On RIAA Equalization Networks'"
Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 29(1), Jan 1981.

Onvinyl · 16th October 2003, 10:54 AM

Hi,
is the lipshitz article available online anywhere? Google did not find it.
Greets,
Rüdiger

rfbrw · 16th October 2003, 10:59 AM

Not that I know of. If you do not want to order it from the AES, you will have to find a library that holds back issues of the AES journal.

ray

peranders · 16th October 2003, 11:03 AM

It's not very expensive to order from AES, a couple of dollars. I have ordered a couple of old articles and it has been a painless process and the pdf files have been nice scanned.

Jocko Homo · 16th October 2003, 12:50 PM

The Lipshitz article deals with pole-zero interaction due to the effects of finite open-loop gain in a feedback arrangement.

If you want it to be accurate, passive EQ is the best choice. I have been able to construct EQs that were accurate to +/- 0.02 dB that way.

In any case, there is a hump between 200 and 500 Hz that is hard to remove. Doing so yields an accurate sound that few seem to like.

If you do go passive, somewhere I have a program that plots the output error. If you supply me with the values that you have, I could calculate it for you.

Jocko

rfbrw · 16th October 2003, 01:03 PM

The Lipschitz article includes at least two passive networks.

ray.

peranders · 16th October 2003, 01:05 PM

My non-inverting Excel file takes this into account but it's tricky to really compensate for it.

As Jockpo says, it's easier to have separate filters for each time constant.

An example of this can be found in an application note somewhere at Analog Devices.

ashok · 16th October 2003, 01:31 PM

If you go to the Beige Bag software site you will find several pages of info given by John Broskie about building active and passive RIAA circuits and how to simulate them. You could even download a trial version of Beige Bag's Spice software for free and try out the circuits and any modifications that you may want to try out. The circuit files shown can be opened with their software. It's great , easy to use. Try it out.
Cheers.
http://www.beigebag.com/resources.htm

16th October 2003, 08:26 AM	#1
Onvinyl diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany	How to calculate RIAA correctly? Hi, has anybody an article, link or software where the calculating of parts values for the riaa filter is explained deeply for various concepts? That explanation should include the relevant surroundings like impedance of following stages etc. I would really like to understand such things correctly, in existing designs as well as for trying own ideas. greets & thanks, Rudiger

16th October 2003, 09:53 AM	#2
peranders Electrons are yellow diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Blog Entries: 3	I have two Excel files, one for inverting RIAA amp and one for a non-inverting. Anybody who wants these send me an email, Do not post me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, me too, etc here Output is like this: http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-50674/hif...diagram_ai.gif http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-50674/hif...lerance_ai.gif __________________ /Per-Anders (my first name) or P-A as my friends call me BPA300 Group Buy Round 4, SMD-kit and DRV134 pcb. Not too late to sign up. Sign up HERE

16th October 2003, 11:03 AM	#6
peranders Electrons are yellow diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Blog Entries: 3	It's not very expensive to order from AES, a couple of dollars. I have ordered a couple of old articles and it has been a painless process and the pdf files have been nice scanned. __________________ /Per-Anders (my first name) or P-A as my friends call me BPA300 Group Buy Round 4, SMD-kit and DRV134 pcb. Not too late to sign up. Sign up HERE

16th October 2003, 01:05 PM	#9
peranders Electrons are yellow diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Blog Entries: 3	My non-inverting Excel file takes this into account but it's tricky to really compensate for it. As Jockpo says, it's easier to have separate filters for each time constant. An example of this can be found in an application note somewhere at Analog Devices. __________________ /Per-Anders (my first name) or P-A as my friends call me BPA300 Group Buy Round 4, SMD-kit and DRV134 pcb. Not too late to sign up. Sign up HERE

16th October 2003, 01:31 PM	#10
ashok diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: 3RS	RIAA If you go to the Beige Bag software site you will find several pages of info given by John Broskie about building active and passive RIAA circuits and how to simulate them. You could even download a trial version of Beige Bag's Spice software for free and try out the circuits and any modifications that you may want to try out. The circuit files shown can be opened with their software. It's great , easy to use. Try it out. Cheers. http://www.beigebag.com/resources.htm __________________ AM


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16th October 2003, 10:48 AM	#3
rfbrw diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: .	Stanley P. Lipshitz. On RIAA Equalization Networks. Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 27(6), June 1979. Peter J. Baxandall Comments on "On RIAA Equalization Networks" Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 29(1), Jan 1981. Stanley P. Lipshitz Author's Reply to "Comments on 'On RIAA Equalization Networks'" Journal of the Audio Engineering Society, 29(1), Jan 1981.

16th October 2003, 10:54 AM	#4
Onvinyl diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Germany	Hi, is the lipshitz article available online anywhere? Google did not find it. Greets, Rüdiger

16th October 2003, 10:59 AM	#5
rfbrw diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: .	Not that I know of. If you do not want to order it from the AES, you will have to find a library that holds back issues of the AES journal. ray

16th October 2003, 12:50 PM	#7
Jocko Homo Banned Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: As far from the NOSsers as possible	The Lipshitz article deals with pole-zero interaction due to the effects of finite open-loop gain in a feedback arrangement. If you want it to be accurate, passive EQ is the best choice. I have been able to construct EQs that were accurate to +/- 0.02 dB that way. In any case, there is a hump between 200 and 500 Hz that is hard to remove. Doing so yields an accurate sound that few seem to like. If you do go passive, somewhere I have a program that plots the output error. If you supply me with the values that you have, I could calculate it for you. Jocko

16th October 2003, 01:03 PM	#8
rfbrw diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: .	The Lipschitz article includes at least two passive networks. ray.

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