What am I doing wrong.
About a year ago, I purchased a starter (cheap, $80 Audio Technica variety) turntable to see how I'd like it. I liked the whole vinyl "experience" and when it sounded good, it sounded GOOD. But, I've had a lot of trouble with pops and clicks while listening to music. I've tried various vinyl cleaners, replacing the cartridge/needle with a better model, etc. FWIW, these are all brand new albums, not used.
Fast forward to now, I upgraded to a new turntable, thinking the reason why I've had so many problems was just a cheap turntable, and that now it was time to upgrade to a big(ger)-boy model. I still haven't invested a lot, just upgraded to a mid-range Denon that is more solid, actually has adjustable tracking/skate, etc. I calibrated the unit, and...still with the popping and clicking! There are albums where I can always hear the same pops and clicks in the same place, which would seem to indicate it's the vinyl, but how is it possible that all of my new vinyl records are popping and clicking, and cleaning doesn't help?
I'm at a loss for what to do.
About a year ago, I purchased a starter (cheap, $80 Audio Technica variety) turntable to see how I'd like it. I liked the whole vinyl "experience" and when it sounded good, it sounded GOOD. But, I've had a lot of trouble with pops and clicks while listening to music. I've tried various vinyl cleaners, replacing the cartridge/needle with a better model, etc. FWIW, these are all brand new albums, not used.
Fast forward to now, I upgraded to a new turntable, thinking the reason why I've had so many problems was just a cheap turntable, and that now it was time to upgrade to a big(ger)-boy model. I still haven't invested a lot, just upgraded to a mid-range Denon that is more solid, actually has adjustable tracking/skate, etc. I calibrated the unit, and...still with the popping and clicking! There are albums where I can always hear the same pops and clicks in the same place, which would seem to indicate it's the vinyl, but how is it possible that all of my new vinyl records are popping and clicking, and cleaning doesn't help?
I'm at a loss for what to do.
Welcome to vinyl.
Unfortunately often not much care was taken at the record pressing plants so brand new records weren't free of pops and clicks. The problem is inherent, there have been some click / pop concealment schemes in the past using analogue delay lines.
I'm not saying CD is perfect (unlike the adverts at the time of release) but it is an improvement in my opinion.
Unfortunately often not much care was taken at the record pressing plants so brand new records weren't free of pops and clicks. The problem is inherent, there have been some click / pop concealment schemes in the past using analogue delay lines.
I'm not saying CD is perfect (unlike the adverts at the time of release) but it is an improvement in my opinion.
the LP record is likely to be holding a static charge as it is a very good insulator incapable of diverting charge away from itself , You need to review how your LP's are stored put away, and the environment in which they are playing. Static regrettably attracts minute dust particles. it can sometimes be avoided by introducing some moisture content. To try this, it could be as simple as opening a window.
As a quick experiment place an LP in your fridge for 10 mins and see if the problem resolves. If that works then rotate your LP's to the fridge for 10 mins before putting them away... as strange as that sounds. Extended periods are not as good as the fridge can increase dryness if left closed.
Cheers / Chris
Thanks for the suggestion. I would think there's enough moisture in the air here as is (SW Florida), but I'll definitely try the fridge trick and see if anything comes of it!
Hi mgudites,
question-
when you say "all your new albums", do you mean the same ones you bought about a year ago with your first turntable and cartridge,
or rather, say you go buy a new album today, clean it and the stylus, and play it with the new turntable and new cartridge... and it also tics and pops?
question-
when you say "all your new albums", do you mean the same ones you bought about a year ago with your first turntable and cartridge,
or rather, say you go buy a new album today, clean it and the stylus, and play it with the new turntable and new cartridge... and it also tics and pops?
Do you clean the records every time before playing? I use a carbon fiber brush, which apart from picking up dust also reduces static. Wipe it on your shirt sleeve (preferably black) afterwards and you'll see how much dust it removed.
It would be instructive to examine the grooves with a microscope, and see what the nature of the obstacle is. Maybe a more aggressive cleanerlike the lift-off polymer solution would help.
It would be instructive to examine the grooves with a microscope, and see what the nature of the obstacle is. Maybe a more aggressive cleanerlike the lift-off polymer solution would help.
Have not had a chance to try yet...but I will!
Both. Brand new, never played albums, as well as the ones I purchased alone with my first turntable.
Yes, I've been very attentive to cleaning. I bought one of these, which seem to come highly recommended. They are dusty to begin with sometimes, and after I use this brush, they really do look clean...but then again I haven't looked with a microscope or anything. Maybe I do just need something better that will lift junk off of the surface?
Some cartridges use stylus geometries that are more prone to picking up clicks and pops due to debris in the bottom of the grooves - what cartridge are you using?
Another angle to consider is your phono pre-amplifier - is this part of a receiver or some inexpensive add on device? What I'm think specifically is that the clicks and pops are strongly accentuated by a phono stage going into ultrasonic frequency induced overload.
Clicks and pops are a fact of life with vinyl, interestingly inexpensive cartridges and phono stages often make the problem more obvious than less..
Another angle to consider is your phono pre-amplifier - is this part of a receiver or some inexpensive add on device? What I'm think specifically is that the clicks and pops are strongly accentuated by a phono stage going into ultrasonic frequency induced overload.
Clicks and pops are a fact of life with vinyl, interestingly inexpensive cartridges and phono stages often make the problem more obvious than less..
Hmm.
Well, I *am* using a relatively inexpensive phono preamp that I bought online. I could just use the one that's built in to the unit, but I haven't tried that yet. I read reviews saying the built in one was really bad.
As for my cartridge, it's an Ortofon 2M Red.
I've tried a few things in the meantime...the fridge thing didn't seem to help. I've tried taking my preamp out of the equation, using the unit's built in equalizer in place of it. I've tried cleaning an album with a damp cotton cloth, to introduce some moisture and get rid of dust...no dice.
Question: if it IS static, would it make sense that I would hear the pops and clicks in the same places each time, or would it be more random? Contemplating buying one of those static gun things, but I have a bad feeling it's just going to be a waste of $100. Sometimes when I pick up a record off the platter, I *do* here some static cling. Wish there was some way to be sure what it is.
Question: if it IS static, would it make sense that I would hear the pops and clicks in the same places each time, or would it be more random? Contemplating buying one of those static gun things, but I have a bad feeling it's just going to be a waste of $100. Sometimes when I pick up a record off the platter, I *do* here some static cling. Wish there was some way to be sure what it is.
Have you ever listened to vinyl anywhere else, on someone else's system? Maybe what you are hearing is normal.
If the pops and clicks are always in exactly the same place, in a piece of music, then it's in the vinyl. Duh.
One thing I remember from back in the 70s and early 80s, when vinyl was my main medium: Brand new LPs were clean and usually had no pops or clicks at all. Pops and clicks were usually due to visible scratches, or visible bits of gunk stuck to the vinyl. I find it difficult to believe that you can't just SEE what is causing the problem. Also, most of the time there would be at least a little pop or click one revolution before and/or after the main one, since a scratch or glob of gunk would rarely occupy only one single groove.
Maybe you should identify a couple of pops or clicks that always happen in the same place and then simply LOOK at that part of the vinyl; the part where the stylus was when they occurred. It would suck if modern pressings were that bad. Where are you located and where are you buying them and where were they made? Do you have any 70s vinyl? Do your albums have paper sleeves, for the LPs? The cardboard inside can scratch them easily, in some cases.
If the pops and clicks are always in exactly the same place, in a piece of music, then it's in the vinyl. Duh.
One thing I remember from back in the 70s and early 80s, when vinyl was my main medium: Brand new LPs were clean and usually had no pops or clicks at all. Pops and clicks were usually due to visible scratches, or visible bits of gunk stuck to the vinyl. I find it difficult to believe that you can't just SEE what is causing the problem. Also, most of the time there would be at least a little pop or click one revolution before and/or after the main one, since a scratch or glob of gunk would rarely occupy only one single groove.
Maybe you should identify a couple of pops or clicks that always happen in the same place and then simply LOOK at that part of the vinyl; the part where the stylus was when they occurred. It would suck if modern pressings were that bad. Where are you located and where are you buying them and where were they made? Do you have any 70s vinyl? Do your albums have paper sleeves, for the LPs? The cardboard inside can scratch them easily, in some cases.
Last edited:
just last night, playing a brand new (1st play ever) album, 45 rpm Columbia record, had about 8 loud tics, not quite a pop, but 8 in a row, once each revolution, much like a scratch. Nothing obvious on the surface but I didn't get the loop out.
But, it may clean up. The original mofi releases used to say something about them quieting down after several plays, and I do believe that to be true.
But, it may clean up. The original mofi releases used to say something about them quieting down after several plays, and I do believe that to be true.
I would suggest the following items in this order:
1) Boston Audio Mat-1 turntable mat Boston Audio - Mat 1 Turntable Mat
2) Groove Glide
3) Vacuum Record Cleaner (Vpi is good, though there are others)
4) Zero stat gun
"new' records are still dirty. They come from the factory with release compound on the surface from the manufacturing process. It really is advised to clean them before use. I have a VPI 16.5 record cleaner that works exceptionally well. The Boston Audio Mat-1 really helped a ton with reducing static and surface noise on my lps (new and old). It is not cheap, but well worth the money.
Nate
1) Boston Audio Mat-1 turntable mat Boston Audio - Mat 1 Turntable Mat
2) Groove Glide
3) Vacuum Record Cleaner (Vpi is good, though there are others)
4) Zero stat gun
"new' records are still dirty. They come from the factory with release compound on the surface from the manufacturing process. It really is advised to clean them before use. I have a VPI 16.5 record cleaner that works exceptionally well. The Boston Audio Mat-1 really helped a ton with reducing static and surface noise on my lps (new and old). It is not cheap, but well worth the money.
Nate
I just recently got back into vinyl, and was amazed at how click&pop-les this can be. In my memory it was much worse, but with new vinyl i hardly hear any.
However i bought a deck (micro dd40 with mc3 turbo) from a guy a few months ago, and in his system the same deck had much more click's and pops, this was definitely not just his vinyl. The difference with my system was night and day, so it could be somewhere in your system.
I'm curious, could you record something and post that online? If not are the clicks and pops all over the frequency range, or is most of it high pitched?
However i bought a deck (micro dd40 with mc3 turbo) from a guy a few months ago, and in his system the same deck had much more click's and pops, this was definitely not just his vinyl. The difference with my system was night and day, so it could be somewhere in your system.
I'm curious, could you record something and post that online? If not are the clicks and pops all over the frequency range, or is most of it high pitched?
Um...yes, I've looked at the vinyl, and I don't see anything. The records do look clean to me. I can't see anything. That's why this is puzzling to me. I haven't listened to vinyl anywhere else; I don't really know anyone else around here who uses it.
I'm not using paper sleeves as I know that's bad. Any albums that have come with paper sleeves, I've replaced with plastic.
I don't have any record stores near me; I live in SWFL which is pretty much a wasteland for stuff like this. My record store is Amazon.com, which for the record, packs and protects what I order really well compared to other places I've seen. I don't have any 70s vinyl yet.
I guess one thing to try would be your turntable and vinyl in a different system. But even easier would be your vinyl on a different system that already has a turntable. (I realize that neither of those might be easy, for you.)
Remember to not leave any LPs in a car when the sun is out, especially in SW Florida.
Of pops and clicks...
There are ways to reduce surface noise without spending a fortune. Clean your records. There are good non-machine based methods usually made up of a few cloths and some sort of cleaning solution.
To reduce static you can mix a small amount of fabric softener with water and put it in a spray bottle (suitable for carpeted floors only). Spray the carpet infringement of your turntable a few times a week to reduce the chance of the lost picking static up off of you. Use a good record brush such as an "Exstatic",Audioquest or similar. Look for a used anti-static gun and use as needed. Make sure your cartridge stylus is clean.
Something that I have become interested in lately is cartridge loading. It may be that the loading built into your phone preamp is closer to a good match than in the other fellow's system. If you resistance is too high,you may get the top end to become elevated in output.
Just a couple of thoughts...
There are ways to reduce surface noise without spending a fortune. Clean your records. There are good non-machine based methods usually made up of a few cloths and some sort of cleaning solution.
To reduce static you can mix a small amount of fabric softener with water and put it in a spray bottle (suitable for carpeted floors only). Spray the carpet infringement of your turntable a few times a week to reduce the chance of the lost picking static up off of you. Use a good record brush such as an "Exstatic",Audioquest or similar. Look for a used anti-static gun and use as needed. Make sure your cartridge stylus is clean.
Something that I have become interested in lately is cartridge loading. It may be that the loading built into your phone preamp is closer to a good match than in the other fellow's system. If you resistance is too high,you may get the top end to become elevated in output.
Just a couple of thoughts...
Hi - I used to have a record player of some quality I guess with an SME 345 tonearm & a transfiguration cartridge & e.g. L'audiophile Le PréPré for MC step-up.
I often noticed clicks and pops in my records - some of which were new - but besides getting used to it (accepting it), along the road I also found out that the overall acoustic setting (electronics, room, my - then - own sensitivity to "imperfections") had a significant say in how I perceived these clicks and pops. However, in time I also found out that the equipment I used - and not least the way it was relaxed or not about high frequency signals - had a huge impact on the sound. What was annoying with one set of gear was quite amenable with a different type of gear ... Also the room acoustics had a major impact, my room in the beginning being very fluttery and high-frequency focussed and later more balanced.
What I'm saying is that my better system still picked up most of the clicks and pops but did so in an amenable way that was not disturbing me. It also helped a lot when the room was acoustically balanced.
Don't know if this helps - but since you say that the clicks and pops are in the same places of the records I personally would doubt that it is static electricity ...
Best regards,
Jesper
I often noticed clicks and pops in my records - some of which were new - but besides getting used to it (accepting it), along the road I also found out that the overall acoustic setting (electronics, room, my - then - own sensitivity to "imperfections") had a significant say in how I perceived these clicks and pops. However, in time I also found out that the equipment I used - and not least the way it was relaxed or not about high frequency signals - had a huge impact on the sound. What was annoying with one set of gear was quite amenable with a different type of gear ... Also the room acoustics had a major impact, my room in the beginning being very fluttery and high-frequency focussed and later more balanced.
What I'm saying is that my better system still picked up most of the clicks and pops but did so in an amenable way that was not disturbing me. It also helped a lot when the room was acoustically balanced.
Don't know if this helps - but since you say that the clicks and pops are in the same places of the records I personally would doubt that it is static electricity ...
Best regards,
Jesper
"TT of some quality"...and clicks and pops.
It must have been an Oracle as it was/is a custom arm for Oracle, unless you purchased it used or from Oracle... I wish I had bought one to fit to my old Alex MkII instead of the 309 (but it ain't no slouch either).
If pops and clicks occur at the same spot, yes it will be a physical issue with the record. The amount these pops and clicks intrude into the music I think is more so determined by how old you are. If you have had plenty of turntable experience from a relatively young age, then one usually learns to hear past them.
I recall when Stereophile did an interview of John Lee Hooker (they used to do interviews of musicians that often asked what equipment some used at home), he stated an all-in-one "rack" system. He recognized it was junk but suggested that he knew the music well enough that he heard the music, not how terrible the system was. I think this holds true for hearing past the clicks and pops.
It must have been an Oracle as it was/is a custom arm for Oracle, unless you purchased it used or from Oracle... I wish I had bought one to fit to my old Alex MkII instead of the 309 (but it ain't no slouch either).
If pops and clicks occur at the same spot, yes it will be a physical issue with the record. The amount these pops and clicks intrude into the music I think is more so determined by how old you are. If you have had plenty of turntable experience from a relatively young age, then one usually learns to hear past them.
I recall when Stereophile did an interview of John Lee Hooker (they used to do interviews of musicians that often asked what equipment some used at home), he stated an all-in-one "rack" system. He recognized it was junk but suggested that he knew the music well enough that he heard the music, not how terrible the system was. I think this holds true for hearing past the clicks and pops.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.