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-   -   2nd Interesting Link (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/analogue-source/20159-2nd-interesting-link.html)

Audio Addict 12th September 2003 05:00 AM

2nd Interesting Link
 
http://www.theanalogdept.com/susp_tim_bailey.htm


Dennis

Dude111 27th June 2013 10:18 PM

Yes that does seem interesting but wouldnt putting the table ON SPRINGS make it more vulnerable to moving up and down if it feels a vibration?? (Someone stomping on the floor,etc) Might not produce good results!

moray james 29th June 2013 12:36 AM

more with springs than without. you got it but you got it wrong. up and down motion is harmless it is lateral motion which causes the problems. So you design a suspension which channels vibration into a plane which does no harm. Best regards Moray James.

andyr 29th June 2013 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moray james (Post 3543208)
more with springs than without. you got it but you got it wrong. up and down motion is harmless it is lateral motion which causes the problems. So you design a suspension which channels vibration into a plane which does no harm. Best regards Moray James.

Hi Moray, I'm interested to know your opinion of the effect of spring stiffness on the effectiveness of the spring suspension.

What effect would increasing the stiffness of the springs by, say 30%, have (on a Linn-type, 3-point suspension)?


Thanks,

Andy

Dude111 30th June 2013 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moray james
more with springs than without. you got it but you got it wrong. up and down motion is harmless it is lateral motion which causes the problems.

Yes how silly of me,of course back and fourth would cause more issues!!

Thank you Moray!

sq225917 30th June 2013 11:22 AM

Increasing the stiffness of the spring would raise the resonant frequency of the LP12 suspension, moving it closer to the critical arm/cart resonance. Not what you want.

I seem to recall their suspension is tuned 4-6hz, typical arm resonance is 6-12hz.

andyr 30th June 2013 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sq225917 (Post 3544438)

Increasing the stiffness of the spring would raise the resonant frequency of the LP12 suspension, moving it closer to the critical arm/cart resonance. Not what you want.

Thanks, sq - that makes sense. :)

OK, 2 Qs:

1. What will I notice happening, if the arm/cart resonance was the same as the resonant frequency of the LP12 suspension?

2. If I don't notice any difference in the arm/cart resonance (when playing a test LP) ... then presumably whatever springs I have used in place of the stock Linn springs have not moved the RF too close to the arm/cart resonance? :confused:

(BTW, I do have a specific reason for asking these Qs! ;) )


Thanks,

Andy

moray james 3rd July 2013 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andyr (Post 3543259)
Hi Moray, I'm interested to know your opinion of the effect of spring stiffness on the effectiveness of the spring suspension.

What effect would increasing the stiffness of the springs by, say 30%, have (on a Linn-type, 3-point suspension)?


Thanks,

Andy

Andy: if you use stiffer springs in your table and your moving mass is kept the same then the rate of frequency that your suspension resonates or bounces at will increase in frequency so the table will bounce faster. Use softer springs and the table will bounce at a slower rate, You want your bounce to be at a lower frequency than your arm cartridge combination. You arm or cartridge maker should be able to tell you what your combination of arm and cartridge will resonate at tune the suspension 2 -3 Hz. below that.
The Analog dept has some of the best tweaking info you will find on line so check them out. It has been decades since I have done any of this stuff so if I am in error forgive me I will be happy to be corrected but I think I have it right. Best regards Moray James.

andyr 3rd July 2013 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moray james (Post 3547695)
Andy: if you use stiffer springs in your table and your moving mass is kept the same then the rate of frequency that your suspension resonates or bounces at will increase in frequency so the table will bounce faster. Use softer springs and the table will bounce at a slower rate, You want your bounce to be at a lower frequency than your arm cartridge combination. You arm or cartridge maker should be able to tell you what your combination of arm and cartridge will resonate at ... tune the suspension 2-3 Hz. below that.

The Analog dept has some of the best tweaking info you will find on line so check them out. It has been decades since I have done any of this stuff so if I am in error forgive me I will be happy to be corrected but I think I have it right. Best regards Moray James.

Thank you, MJ - very interesting information which makes sense to me! :)

So, if I can paraphrase what you said:

a) if I use my test LP to find the Hz (vertical & horizontal) that my cartridge oscillates at, in my new 12" UP arm on my new 'SkeletaLinn' TT, then

b) if this oscillation behaves in exactly the same way as it did with (the same cartridge in) my LP12 ... my new 'SkeletaLinn' (with stiffer springs) plus 12" arm combo must have a perfectly acceptable suspension resonance?

Am I correct?


Thanks,

Andy

ashok 3rd July 2013 09:42 AM

Horizontal damping
 
At the 2011 RMAF I think it was Oracle who was showing the effect of horizontal damping. The difference between no damping and some damping was quite audible. It kind of locked the image in space ! The damping adjusted too little or too much killed the effect. I was impressed !


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