Hello to all,
I will realy apriciate if someone could explain to me the recording process of nowadays LP's. In meaning if its fully analog process or they are using some compression duuring recording process. Are they are using digital equipement and so...
In general is it worth to buy LP's ?
I will realy apriciate if someone could explain to me the recording process of nowadays LP's. In meaning if its fully analog process or they are using some compression duuring recording process. Are they are using digital equipement and so...
In general is it worth to buy LP's ?
Both fully analog recordings on analog tape masters and fully digital masters are used depending on label to produce current records.
I have bought a significant number of recent recordings on LP most which were digitally mastered, and they sound good. (In all cases I prefer them to the CD) So IMHO and YMMV I will generally buy the LP in preference to CD or SACD regardless of the nature of the master used to make it.
Is there an oportunity to look for analog mastered LP's? Are they signed somehow?
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Modern acts recording to vinyl are probably mostly using the digital mix to create the vinyl audio tracks. However, for maximum sound quality, you have to create two masters which will differ slightly, since vinyl and CD have different abilities and limitations.
I don't think it's realistic to expect a vinyl and CD versions of the same song to sound the same. If they do, it means they cut corners somewhere.
I don't think it's realistic to expect a vinyl and CD versions of the same song to sound the same. If they do, it means they cut corners somewhere.
I recently purchased snow patrol, eyes open on vinyl. It's as compressed as the cd version. I can only conclude that it's been produced from the same same appalling master. I was hoping that going back to vinyl would get away from the trend that is to suck the life out of music in the name of making it louder but I was wrong.
Surely it's the other way round? It is essential to compress the dynamic range of recordings for vinyl because of its much narrower useful 'window' between the dust and scratches at one end and the limited amount of needle displacement allowed at the other. CD can just be the master recording un-molested.
Of course, there really should be a third version, dynamically compressed for listening with headphones on the bus.
In this case it sounds as though there is only the third version available.
I had a some experience with "Sound of the universe" from Depeche Mode. Sounds like its dynamicly compressed, I also bought a CD, there is no difference, sounds same..compressed. The older LP's i have sounds much better. For example "Flath Earth" - Thomas Dolby
I've just been reading some bits and pieces on vinyl mastering.
It does seem as though there are sometimes different masters for vinyl and CD, but there are two contradictory aspects:
CD can handle a much wider dynamic range than vinyl, has no restrictions on frequency response between 0 and 20 kHz, and no limitations on stereo image. However, its market may be perceived as being different from that of the vinyl version. So while the CD can handle the recording being 'un-molested', it is suggested they sometimes do use a more compressed version for the CD master - although this may just be a myth. (Hearing what you expect to hear etc.)
More importantly, the restrictions inherent in cutting and playing a vinyl LP means that if a producer is serious about producing a vinyl version, he should build it in from the start i.e. record the music with the dynamic range restrictions in place already. For example it's no use creating a piece of music whose 'signature' is high level stereo bass because the cutting engineer is only going to mix everything below 400 Hz to mono! Similarly, it's no use making a feature of a very fizzy top end, because the cutting engineer will have to cut the treble to prevent the cutting head from exploding. Extreme transients must be limited to prevent the cutter and/or playback needle from skipping!
So, the reality is that if a recording is made for the serious vinyl market, it will unfortunately compromise the results for the CD listener, rather than the other way round.
It does seem as though there are sometimes different masters for vinyl and CD, but there are two contradictory aspects:
CD can handle a much wider dynamic range than vinyl, has no restrictions on frequency response between 0 and 20 kHz, and no limitations on stereo image. However, its market may be perceived as being different from that of the vinyl version. So while the CD can handle the recording being 'un-molested', it is suggested they sometimes do use a more compressed version for the CD master - although this may just be a myth. (Hearing what you expect to hear etc.)
More importantly, the restrictions inherent in cutting and playing a vinyl LP means that if a producer is serious about producing a vinyl version, he should build it in from the start i.e. record the music with the dynamic range restrictions in place already. For example it's no use creating a piece of music whose 'signature' is high level stereo bass because the cutting engineer is only going to mix everything below 400 Hz to mono! Similarly, it's no use making a feature of a very fizzy top end, because the cutting engineer will have to cut the treble to prevent the cutting head from exploding. Extreme transients must be limited to prevent the cutter and/or playback needle from skipping!
So, the reality is that if a recording is made for the serious vinyl market, it will unfortunately compromise the results for the CD listener, rather than the other way round.
Ultraanalog, Fidelio, and others produce all analog LPs..
Fidelio Records | Stereophile.com
You can google..
Yes Dolby's "Flat Earth" is a very good sounding recording on LP that I enjoy regularly. It was a commercial flop, and marked the end of his recording career.. A shame, but he's alive and well in software engineering.
Note that there do not appear to be very many LPs available on the Fidelio label at this time.. Elusivedisc and others sell LPs and in the case where they are analog masters it is often noted.
Very sadly I find this to be the case with all mainstream music produced since the 90's. As you suggest, the only version is the 3rd is available on most formats.
popular music on CD and downloads still suffers from the "Loudness War"
Loudness war - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Loudness war - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
JCX,
Many thanks for the article, no matter it dissapointed me a lot. These days its very hard to find and buy a good recorded media. Im happy i have the album "KRUSHEVO" presenters are two top level acoustic guitarists from Former Yugoslavia. Its recorded in acoustic area without dynamic compresion. As I know they were using just two mics and one tube preamp. (im not so technicaly educated in recording processes). Anyway sounds GREAT!!! I know it was available to buy this album in UK. I recomended it to anyone who want to hear how an recording should sound.
But very often even analogue masters are cut to LP through a digital delay line, as opposed to using a tape machine with proper preview heads and doubled-up processing rack.
The only way for knowing for sure is to record the LP at 88.2kHz or higher and check it with a spectrum analyser for the tell-tale ridge at about 20kHz.
The only way for knowing for sure is to record the LP at 88.2kHz or higher and check it with a spectrum analyser for the tell-tale ridge at about 20kHz.
But very often even analogue masters are cut to LP through a digital delay line, as opposed to using a tape machine with proper preview heads and doubled-up processing rack.
The only way for knowing for sure is to record the LP at 88.2kHz or higher and check it with a spectrum analyser for the tell-tale ridge at about 20kHz.
And I was wondering if I was doing something wrong (I have noticed this ridge on some LP to CD transfers. While experimenting with different sampling rates, this ridge was there always).
Thank you Werner for solving this puzzle for me.
Regards
George
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I'm sure the Loudness war has been done to death!!! I have to say I find it extremely depressing to know that the studio masters will exist somewhere in audio quality that would be to beheld. The likes of us mere mortals will never hear the awesome quality that the artist heard during the recording and mixing of the studio masters. What we will get to hear, preserved for prosperity is the ipod mixdown of total crap that barely resembles the original.
Why not let those who want compression, compress the recording themselves after the purchase????
Why not let those who want compression, compress the recording themselves after the purchase????
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