I have a question about running in an E50 motor with new bushings:
So, I replaced the bushings, thrust plate and felts of my TD124's E50 motor. Without the belt put in place, the motor runs completely silently and has a spin down time of about 20s after cutting the power.
Now with the belt installed on the motor pulley and step wheel, there's a faint, periodic noise, almost sounds like something grinding.
My question now is if it's safe to continue to let the new bushings run in. Should I give it a week without the belt? Should I run it some time with the belt installed and see if anything changes? Any hints and tips on how to get rid of the last bit of noise?
So, I replaced the bushings, thrust plate and felts of my TD124's E50 motor. Without the belt put in place, the motor runs completely silently and has a spin down time of about 20s after cutting the power.
Now with the belt installed on the motor pulley and step wheel, there's a faint, periodic noise, almost sounds like something grinding.
My question now is if it's safe to continue to let the new bushings run in. Should I give it a week without the belt? Should I run it some time with the belt installed and see if anything changes? Any hints and tips on how to get rid of the last bit of noise?
Maybe you hear the steppulley noise some oil in the bearing wants to help sometimes. Or too tight belt ?
Thanks for your input, guys!
The step pulley got new bushings as well, and with the belt installed there is a very very faint, bell-like ringing coming from the step pulley with my ear right above it, but no bearing noise. Once I get the motor sorted out, I'll try to dampen the step pulley with cork or felt like I've seen some folk do so in this thread.
The noise is most definitely coming from the motor, its location is clearly discernable by ear. I suspect it's the shaft rubbing against top bushing. Guess I'll have to play with alignment some more...
The step pulley got new bushings as well, and with the belt installed there is a very very faint, bell-like ringing coming from the step pulley with my ear right above it, but no bearing noise. Once I get the motor sorted out, I'll try to dampen the step pulley with cork or felt like I've seen some folk do so in this thread.
The noise is most definitely coming from the motor, its location is clearly discernable by ear. I suspect it's the shaft rubbing against top bushing. Guess I'll have to play with alignment some more...
I've used cork on mine, but can't help but wonder if there isn't something better. The degree to which the intermediate pulley rings seems to be related to the pliability of the belt, stiffer belts make it much worse. the mechanism seems to be some sort of stiction that occurs as the belt is trying to leave the pulley, causing it to oscillate and exciting the pulley. Talcing the belt actually does help temporarily, but the operative word is temporary, a few days at best.. A Hanze Hi-Fi belt might be a better long term solution, they are amongst the quietest I have tried. There was also a guy located in Hollywood, FLA selling very good belts on eBay a few years ago.
I noticed squirting alcohol on the belt as it was spinning resulted in dead silence, I'm assuming it allowed for enough slip to occur as the belt left the circumference of the pulley to prevent the problem. Obviously this is no solution, but it might point to some sort of coating (teflon?) on the pulley itself as the solution.
I have noted over time a fair amount of OT posting in this thread, this isn't a general theory thread for idlers, that was not my purpose when I started this thread years ago.
When a legitimate question is ignored to discuss something not closely related to the thread I find that a little disturbing.
Anything not specific to repairing, restoring or improving the TD-124, aftermarket vs OEM parts, E50 and Papst motors, drive train components, platters, adjustments, tweaks, appropriate arms and cartridges, not to mention restoration tips of said tables really ought to be discussed somewhere else.
When a legitimate question is ignored to discuss something not closely related to the thread I find that a little disturbing.
Anything not specific to repairing, restoring or improving the TD-124, aftermarket vs OEM parts, E50 and Papst motors, drive train components, platters, adjustments, tweaks, appropriate arms and cartridges, not to mention restoration tips of said tables really ought to be discussed somewhere else.
Can you post some pictures? It did fail to occur to me explain that there are two major variants to the step pulleys used in the original 124. Units below a certain serial # have a sintered bronze bearing in the top of the stepped pulley and sit on shaft integral with the chassis, later tables have a pair of bearings installed in the chassis, and the stepped pulley has an integral shaft.
Beyond this there are variations in the machining, coating, and balancing techniques used on the later pulleys.
It is theoretically possible that Thorens had a run of pulleys with an unintentionally off sized shafts and changed the bushing inserts to accommodate them.
My experience with this table very limited and I can't rule out the possibility of something new I was unaware of.. I haven't encountered it in the small number of tables I worked on, but have only swapped pulleys around on a very small number during testing.
Mine are not necessarily running the pulleys they came with, but the ones amongst my limited collection that resulted in the best operation in that particular table.
Unfortunately I am not a member there and could only see little pictures and no real detail. Too bad he is not a member here.
Okay, so I found this:
Single Phase Power Source (AC Regenerator) for Induction Motor Powered Turntables
Looks like I've got some reading to do...
Single Phase Power Source (AC Regenerator) for Induction Motor Powered Turntables
Looks like I've got some reading to do...
The only issue is my source was designed to be fixed at one of two frequencies - you could use a DDS to drive this to allow for variable frequency operation. The pyramid 4 phase source might be a better solution for you. (Just use a single phase into a suitable power amplifier and step up transformer.
Sounds like what I'm looking for. You don't happen to have an extra pcb, do you?
Other than that, I've come across another issue that I don't recall being discussed in detail yet. My idler wheel's axis appears to be misaligned relative to the step pulley's axis. Is there any known good way for adjusting the idler wheel axis inclination?
Other than that, I've come across another issue that I don't recall being discussed in detail yet. My idler wheel's axis appears to be misaligned relative to the step pulley's axis. Is there any known good way for adjusting the idler wheel axis inclination?
Absolutlely beautiful. Your strobe looks really bright or is that just colour saturation?
I’m still wrestling with a MKI version that continues to bemuse me. I seem to always have oily fingers! Maybe Kevin was right when I think he made a parallel to British sports car ownership.
I am however so grateful for all the input here. Kudos to all of you!
I think the British Sports Car thing is a bit of a myth. BMW etc are worse if allowed to get in the hands of Mr Cheap Garage. I think it was that the British cars were priced below others that caused people to buy them who didn't have money to run them. With the other makes it was clear from the beginning they would be expensive to own and had to have services history to maintain the residual value which can be $1000 000. Some have complete floor up restorations every 20 000 miles as a routine thing. US cars were very wonderful. Apart from oil and fuel that's all they got and if lucky brake fluid. This was because people found it cheaper to buy a new one. And then they blamed the makers for poor reliability. Often all these cars required was a flushing of the oil and new rubber parts.
One British sports car the Triumph Stage had a very poor reputation simply because no one changed the water when they should. Those that did were OK are are so today. Saab proved that with their own versions.
Why these TD124's give trouble is someone who could easilly have claimed to be a garage mechanic put their hands on one.
One British sports car the Triumph Stage had a very poor reputation simply because no one changed the water when they should. Those that did were OK are are so today. Saab proved that with their own versions.
Why these TD124's give trouble is someone who could easilly have claimed to be a garage mechanic put their hands on one.