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Old 15th July 2010, 03:06 PM   #1
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Default Soundstage Help

Hello! I recently revamped my entire turntable setup and am very happy with the results so far... However, the soundstage is not quite as three dimensional as I would like. As it is now, the speakers completely disappear and the music just emanates in front of me, but again the soundstage isn't quite there.

I was curious on your guy's thoughts as to what effects this most between easily replaced components (i.e. tubes, cartridge, etc.)

Current set-up is:

Rega P3 turntable with Ortofon Blue
Tube Audio Labs custom phono stage ((2) 6SL7's, (2) 6SN7's and (1) 5U4)
James Burgess Monoblocks (2a3, Sovtek)
Altec 604-8G's (factory crossover)
All 99.9 silver wire (24 ga from phono stage to amps and 16ga speaker)

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
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Old 15th July 2010, 04:13 PM   #2
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Certainly everything plays a role with the room and speakers being the most important and the cables, tubes, carts - the least. What makes it worse is that even if a single component is less than stellar in this respect it will ruin the soundstage. I don't see how you can fix this without listening to a lot of proven good components inside your room. Probably starting with the speakers.
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Old 15th July 2010, 04:36 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easymac77 View Post
Rega P3 turntable with Ortofon Blue
Maybe time to move up the cartridge food chain a titch. Have you rewired the RB300?

Jeff
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Old 15th July 2010, 05:48 PM   #4
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The 'listening room' is less than stellar, I would go as far as to say mediocre at best. It is ~ 15ft x 12ft with openings to other rooms on three sides, the system is on the lone full wall. I only have them here because it is the only place they will currently fit. My listening chair is no more than 8 ft from the speakers...

I have not rewired the arm as I get a little nervous when I mess with the turntable in general, I'll even avoid cartridge alignment if I can. But is it fairly straight forward for a reasonably competent DIYer?

Any suggestions on cartridges? The time is nigh to replace it...

Thanks for the input so far!
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Old 15th July 2010, 06:15 PM   #5
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Hi,

My stock recommendation for a P3 is a Denon DL110, though some claim
the DL160 is better overall when loaded with ~ 1kohm, IMO the DL110
is a better overall bet than the DL160 into 47Kohm. both are cheaper
than the Blue but seem to work very well in a P3. The DL160 is "better"
in a "hifi" sense, more detail etc but not as well rounded as the DL110.

Alignment is complicated until you get your head round it, then its easy,
following a procedure that does not seem to work rather than knowing
exactly whats going on seems to to be the problem for many.

See the stickies here :
Turntable Forum :: View Forum - turntables and tonearms
And optimally align your Blue before replacing it.

/Sreten.

Is your turntable optimally sited ? Good stand on a solid
floor or rigid lightweight shelf attached to a solid wall ?

Last edited by sreten; 15th July 2010 at 06:18 PM.
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Old 15th July 2010, 06:57 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easymac77 View Post
I have not rewired the arm as I get a little nervous when I mess with the turntable in general, I'll even avoid cartridge alignment if I can. But is it fairly straight forward for a reasonably competent DIYer?
A friend rewired an RB250 with litz wire, and he fits that description.

Quote:
Originally Posted by easymac77 View Post
Any suggestions on cartridges? The time is nigh to replace it...
Nobody ever said anything bad using the Dyna 10x5 in a Rega. The Audio Note IQ2 sounds very nice on a Rega, but getting a bit pricey.

Jeff
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Old 16th July 2010, 12:47 AM   #7
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Default placing instruments?

There is a lot of snobbery in this hobby about placing instruments, hearing the stage. I can't do it. People tell me it is because my equipment is so bad. So I tried it at the Louisville Orchestra live on the Riverfront barge July 3. From 100 feet away in my lawn chair, I couldn't tell where the instruments are either. There are some recordings that have "life", like C.R. Fine engineer Mercury "living Presence", late fifties RCA and Colombia classical (not the bargain line). Some recordings sound dead, like angels, the telefunken von Karajan Beethoven symphony cycle. That, to me, is the essence of the stereo effect. Some recording are just bad. Beatles stuff is great art, but the singers are in one channel and the instruments in the other. Maybe it's because my ears were damaged at summer camp in 1969 by the howitzer, (15000 Hz max ) so everybody go ahead, brag on about your equipment. If it sounds a lot better with the switch in "stereo" compared to "mono", your stereo is doing its job, I think.
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Old 16th July 2010, 05:17 PM   #8
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different systems, but I ran the Ortofon Blue for awhile on a Rega RB300 arm on a VPI HW19 turntable. Speakers were UREI 813As which also use Altec 604 drivers. I was never happy with the overall sound until I upgraded to the Dynavector 10X5. Again, YMMV - but the Blue seemed like a touchy cart that required the VTA to be dialed in 'just right'.
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Old 18th July 2010, 02:14 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kstagger View Post
different systems, but I ran the Ortofon Blue for awhile on a Rega RB300 arm on a VPI HW19 turntable. Speakers were UREI 813As which also use Altec 604 drivers. I was never happy with the overall sound until I upgraded to the Dynavector 10X5. Again, YMMV - but the Blue seemed like a touchy cart that required the VTA to be dialed in 'just right'.
Its not really a bad thing if a cartridge "needs" perfect alignment.Most good cartridges especially those fitted with super line contact tips,do.But when they need perfect alignment,try to do it.If they still "refuse" to deliver what you are after(not just soundstage)and you are certain its their fault,get rid of them
On the other hand,I wouldn't be so sure that the p3/rb300 are masters of soundstage.Haven't heard an ortofon blue so I can't tell but from past experience with ortofons,only their very best MC models were good(not the best though) on soundstaging imo.

Last edited by Panicos K; 18th July 2010 at 02:20 PM.
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