I dunno, my HP4274 never lies
Let's see, 10R multiplied by 10^=1000, plus copper resistances loaded with 47K... Sounds about right.
Best, M
I dunno, my HP4274 never lies
Really? Are you SURE it was working late at the office last Friday? Inquiring minds want to know.
Oh, ok. Gotcha. I thought you were referring to input impedance.
My bad.
se
Sorry for asking but if i wanted a 0,50mv output MC "transformed" to a 2,50mv output at what ratio of windings should i be looking?
I think my tubed phono is streched to it's limit by the lowish output of my cartridge and i crave for the ease of drive and dynamics i had with a 2.5mv output cart.
I think my tubed phono is streched to it's limit by the lowish output of my cartridge and i crave for the ease of drive and dynamics i had with a 2.5mv output cart.
1:5 minimum theoretically, and depending on how you load it, up to 1:10.. My DL-103 runs unloaded into 1:6 and of the transformers I had on hand this was by far the best.(Giving me about 2.2mV into my phono stage) Were you to load your cartridge into something approaching its source impedance the output voltage level would drop by half hence the 1:10 recommendation, loading from wide open to equal to your source impedance should be no problem with a 1:10 SUT as long as your phono stage can handle 5mV without overloading if you choose to run wide open. (no load)
My SF Phono-1 has an overload spec of 50mv at 1KHz(!) so overloading is not a problem.
Also has variable resistor loading and capacitance loading through dip switches.
I have checked my cartridge spec and it is 0,6mv and i would like that to equal 2,5mv.
So a 1:5 to 1:10 variable tap transformer would suit my needs ok?
What else do i have to check (electric compatibility wise)?
Also has variable resistor loading and capacitance loading through dip switches.
I have checked my cartridge spec and it is 0,6mv and i would like that to equal 2,5mv.
So a 1:5 to 1:10 variable tap transformer would suit my needs ok?
What else do i have to check (electric compatibility wise)?
Marik will probably advise, but you just need to be able to find the optimum loading for your cartridge usually by trial and error.. You should know at the onset what the generator impedance and recommended load impedance range of your cartridge happens to be so that you can pick the most appropriate transformer. Also IMHO the fewest taps required to give you the flexibility needed to achieve your goals should also result in the best performing transformer. Mine actually have no taps at all, just a primary and secondary - and outperformed by a wide margin anything else I could afford, but I had the opportunity to try a pair before I bought them, so zero risk.
You will probably find that your pre-amp does not have sufficient loading flexibility to provide the ideal load with your cartridge/transformer combination and you should plan on an external load. All this from experience. Depending on transformer I've had some pretty odd combinations.. I always mount the actual load resistors at the transformer with a default 47K at the pre-amp.
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I am at work right now but i will check the specs of my Condor tonight.
The Phono-1 has also additional empty positions for extra resistor loading-so,ok there!
If a single tap is better, i thing that my best bet would be something in the 1:10 ratio.
That would give me a margin to compensate for even lower output carts...
The Phono-1 has also additional empty positions for extra resistor loading-so,ok there!
If a single tap is better, i thing that my best bet would be something in the 1:10 ratio.
That would give me a margin to compensate for even lower output carts...
As Kevinkr has already hinted, the loading is the answer.
What is your cartridge impedance? Say, your cartridge is 10 Ohm, and we are using 1:10 transformer. Say, you load it with a 47K resistor, so the cartridge sees 47k/10^=470 ohm. With the same 47K load, the same 10 Ohm cartridge with 1:5 ratio at the same time will already see 4 times higher load. Really, everything depends where your cartridge feels the "happiest", but in this case, I'd rather use higher ratio and lower resistor load value than vice versa.
But wait a second, we already were talking that the higher ratio, the higher the resistance noise. But since the tubes are usually noisier, in this case actually, I'd go with higher ratio. You will be still staying well within 50mV overload on the input.
Really depends on how the transformer is wound. When I say "taps" in our transformers, I mean the primary is actually split into two even coils, which connected whether in parallel or in series for either 1:20, or 1:10 operation respectively. While more complicated, this topology has much greater advantages, both sonically, in term of resistance noise, and CMR.
Best, M
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Sorry for the typo, of course, I meant "higher ratio and HIGHER resistor load value".
Best, M
Well,i've checked the data of my cart:
This was an order to Vd Hul with silver windings and lightened
metal chassis and the specs are:
Load Input :200 Ohm-47KOhm
Optimal Load:500 Ohm -1 KOhm
Output level :0,55mVolts
Coil resistance / channel:96 Ohms (+/- 10%)
I would really like to have a second tap to cater for a future purchase in the region of 0,3mVolts output (a second hand Colibri perhaps, that has almost identical specs)
With all these in mind at what ratios am i looking at,to reach a 2,5mVolt equivalent?
Recommendations?
Marik,can you make me such a thing?
At what cost?
I have taken the PS section out of my phono to a separate box and i was thinking of installing the transformers inside where there is plenty of room.
Maybe use different inputs for transformer-less/1:X/1:2X operation?
This was an order to Vd Hul with silver windings and lightened
metal chassis and the specs are:
Load Input :200 Ohm-47KOhm
Optimal Load:500 Ohm -1 KOhm
Output level :0,55mVolts
Coil resistance / channel:96 Ohms (+/- 10%)
I would really like to have a second tap to cater for a future purchase in the region of 0,3mVolts output (a second hand Colibri perhaps, that has almost identical specs)
With all these in mind at what ratios am i looking at,to reach a 2,5mVolt equivalent?
Recommendations?
Marik,can you make me such a thing?
At what cost?
I have taken the PS section out of my phono to a separate box and i was thinking of installing the transformers inside where there is plenty of room.
Maybe use different inputs for transformer-less/1:X/1:2X operation?
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Looking at the cartridge specs it seems the transformer should be 1:7 as with the stock 47K the cartridge will see the load of 47K/7^=959 Ohm, which is pretty close to the spec. If you go 1:5, then you might want to use additional resistor in parallel to the 47K.
I would not go any higher than that, and here is why. The 96 Ohm is quite high source impedance, so it needs quite a bit of pri inductance and turns.
Then, we will need to think about the secondary, which for 1:7 will need to have turn count 7 times higher (in fact, even more because of losses and coupling). In order to put that much of the turns on a small core (and we don't really want to use for those application a bigger one, as the bigger core, the harder to "wake it up") we will need to use smaller gage wire. But we don't want to do it either, as the copper resistance will go up along with the noise and losses. Also, because of such a high turn count we will need to wind it with more sections to keep the capacitance down.
It is certainly possible to make such transformer, although it would not be a trivial task to make it with low enough DCR and good bass response! If we could make it with -1dB roll off at 30Hz instead of 15Hz, then it would've been a bit easier...
I will need to make some calculations to see what's the best way to do such thing. If you are interested in this project please PM me or email to:
ribbonmic(at)comcast(dot)net
Best, M
I bought from a german gentleman through ebay a selection (3 pairs) of BeyerDynamic MC transformers for a very modest sum.
These pairs are: 1:3 bifilar (also 1:6) ,1:5 bifilar (also 1:10) and 1:7 single tap.
He sends me also all relative data regarding them.
My goal is to check various combinations to see how is the sound affected and then make a decision and order from Marik the final version.
I will post the data and findings when i have them in my hands.
These pairs are: 1:3 bifilar (also 1:6) ,1:5 bifilar (also 1:10) and 1:7 single tap.
He sends me also all relative data regarding them.
My goal is to check various combinations to see how is the sound affected and then make a decision and order from Marik the final version.
I will post the data and findings when i have them in my hands.
I will be very interested to know if those transformers will work with your cartridge. The problem is the usual MC impedance does not usually go much over 10 Ohm and the Pri inductance is calculated with (more or less) that source impedance in mind. Your cartridge is almost 100 Ohm, so I'd expect quite a significant low end loss.
Please let me know, I am really curious.
Best, M
Well...it's not a typo.It's in his site and written by hand on the wooden box that was in when i got it.See for yourselves:
The CONDOR
What do you get when you cross a Colibri with a Frog?
Yes........ a Condor!
The CONDOR is a top performance custom handbuilt moving coil phono cartridge. A crossbreed of our The FROG and The COLIBRI (two of the world’s finest cartridges) featuring the best of both and available in a wide range of versions matching the personal demands of the customer.
A huge leap beyond the pond:
“Up there, high in the sky, she graciously glides, her sharp senses capturing the entire soundscape, never missing any detail”
A.J. van den Hul’s newly created phono cartridge, named The CONDOR, is a very innovative moving coil design specifically made for very high replay quality. It is the first cartridge in the world that doesn’t have any mechanical signal transfer to the tone arm or the other way around: No sound coloration and no background noise!
The CONDOR is based on The FROG and uses the design philosophy of The COLIBRI: take away from the body what you don’t need, thus making the cartridge lighter and with fewer materials to resonate and influence the sound in a negative way. The CONDOR has no front-pole and employs a very strong magnet. The suspension is an advanced three rubber system. While being more robust in construction and having a healthier output, The CONDOR exhibits the same highly refined sonic properties as The COLIBRI: a very high resolution combined with an extremely good spatial reproduction. The CONDOR is made for many different arms without any problem. Tracking is excellent and the top-end is very smooth.
The CONDOR is built in a number of versions:
* XC-LO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, C = matched crystal Copper wire coils, LO = Low Output)
- Low output all-round model
- Output voltage: 0.25 mV/channel
- Types available: XCP-LO and XCM-LO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XC-HO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, C = matched crystal Copper wire coils, HO = High Output)
- High output, most suitable for jazz and pop music
- Output voltage: 0.55 mV/channel
- Types available: XCP-HO and XCM-HO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XG-LO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, G = matched crystal Gold wire coils, LO = Low Output)
- Low output, most suitable for classical music
- Output voltage: 0.25 mV/channel
- Types available: XGP-LO and XGM-LO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XG-HO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, G = matched crystal Gold wire coils, HO = High Output)
- High output, most suitable for jazz and pop music
- Output voltage: 0.45 mV/channel
- Types available: XGP-HO and XGM-HO (P and M type suffix see *4)
Version: a) XCP-LO & XCM-LO
b) XCP-HO & XCM-HO
c) XGP-MO & XGM-MO
d) XGP-HO & XGM-HO
Stylus Replacement Available: see (*1)
Stylus Shape: VDH - IS
Stylus Radii: 2 x 85 Micron
Frequency Range: 5 - 55.000 Hz
Tracking Force: 13.5 - 15 mN
see (*3)
Static Compliance: 35 Micron/mN
see (*3)
Tracking Ability at 15mN at 315Hz: 70 - 80 Micron
Output Voltage at 1 kHz at 5.7 cm/s eff.: a) 0.25 mV RMS
b) 0.55 mV RMS
c) 0.35 mV RMS
d) 0.45 mV RMS
Channel Unbalance: < 0.3 dB
Channel Separation at 1kHz / 10kHz: > 36 / > 30 dB
Equivalent Stylus Tip Mass: 0.32 Milligram
System Weight: see (*4)
Vertical Tracking Angle : 22 Degrees
Optimum Load Capacitance: see (*2)
Recommended Load Impedance: a) 500 (> 200) Ohm
b) 1000 (500 - 47k) Ohm
c) 500 (> 200) Ohm
d) 1000 (500 - 47k) Ohm
Recommended Eff Tone arm Mass: see (*3) + (*4) + (*5)
Moving Coil Resistance per channel: a) 21 Ohm +/- 10%
b) 96 Ohm +/- 10%
c) 36 Ohm +/- 10%
d) 62 Ohm +/- 10%
Extra Info: (*1): Stylus replacement and other services available on request.
(*2): Non critical.
(*3): Versions optimized for lower or higher tracking forces (allowing very light or very heavy arms) can be built on special request. These have a higher, respectively lower static compliance.
(*4): P and M type suffix:
Each of the above mentioned versions of The CONDOR are available with either:
- A regular carbon-nylon plastic body. Total cartridge weight is 8.75 gram. Suitable for arms with an effective tone arm mass of 12 gram to 20 gram. The plastic bodied version carries the -P suffix in its name.
- A metal body. Total cartridge weight is 9.25 gram. Suitable for arms with an effective tone arm mass of 12 gram to 20 gram. The metal bodied version carries the -M suffix in its name.
(*5): The cartridge has been optimized regarding an EFFECTIVE tone arm mass of 12 - 20 gram. Heavier arms CAN produce tracking and resonance problems and arms with an effective mass exceeding 24 gram WILL CERTAINLY! Also see (*3).
Company Profile
New Products
Awards
Advisory Retail Pricelist
Agenda / Shows
Articles & Papers
Discontinued Products
International Distributors
© 2007, A.J. van den Hul BV
Special customer demands/specifications:
Thanks to the many variations in materials available, it is always possible to build a unit to match the personal demands of the customer.
With these personalized cartridges the wooden container can mention the name of the customer it has been specially built for.
This option is exclusively available for The CANARY, The GRASSHOPPER III series, The GRASSHOPPER IV, The GRASSHOPPER “BEAUTY”, The CONDOR and The COLIBRI versions.
The customer demands/specifications that can be taken into account when building a personalized cartridge for instance are:
The tone-arm used, the preamp and load impedance used, a particular brand of records to be played, the type of music generally played (jazz being more dynamic and classical more spacious and detailed) and other personal/sound preferences.
Production time:
The production time for a CONDOR cartridge after ordering is about two weeks. Please call your authorized distributor for delivery time.
The CONDOR
What do you get when you cross a Colibri with a Frog?
Yes........ a Condor!
The CONDOR is a top performance custom handbuilt moving coil phono cartridge. A crossbreed of our The FROG and The COLIBRI (two of the world’s finest cartridges) featuring the best of both and available in a wide range of versions matching the personal demands of the customer.
A huge leap beyond the pond:
“Up there, high in the sky, she graciously glides, her sharp senses capturing the entire soundscape, never missing any detail”
A.J. van den Hul’s newly created phono cartridge, named The CONDOR, is a very innovative moving coil design specifically made for very high replay quality. It is the first cartridge in the world that doesn’t have any mechanical signal transfer to the tone arm or the other way around: No sound coloration and no background noise!
The CONDOR is based on The FROG and uses the design philosophy of The COLIBRI: take away from the body what you don’t need, thus making the cartridge lighter and with fewer materials to resonate and influence the sound in a negative way. The CONDOR has no front-pole and employs a very strong magnet. The suspension is an advanced three rubber system. While being more robust in construction and having a healthier output, The CONDOR exhibits the same highly refined sonic properties as The COLIBRI: a very high resolution combined with an extremely good spatial reproduction. The CONDOR is made for many different arms without any problem. Tracking is excellent and the top-end is very smooth.
The CONDOR is built in a number of versions:
* XC-LO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, C = matched crystal Copper wire coils, LO = Low Output)
- Low output all-round model
- Output voltage: 0.25 mV/channel
- Types available: XCP-LO and XCM-LO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XC-HO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, C = matched crystal Copper wire coils, HO = High Output)
- High output, most suitable for jazz and pop music
- Output voltage: 0.55 mV/channel
- Types available: XCP-HO and XCM-HO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XG-LO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, G = matched crystal Gold wire coils, LO = Low Output)
- Low output, most suitable for classical music
- Output voltage: 0.25 mV/channel
- Types available: XGP-LO and XGM-LO (P and M type suffix see *4)
* XG-HO Version: (X = cross shaped modulator, G = matched crystal Gold wire coils, HO = High Output)
- High output, most suitable for jazz and pop music
- Output voltage: 0.45 mV/channel
- Types available: XGP-HO and XGM-HO (P and M type suffix see *4)
Version: a) XCP-LO & XCM-LO
b) XCP-HO & XCM-HO
c) XGP-MO & XGM-MO
d) XGP-HO & XGM-HO
Stylus Replacement Available: see (*1)
Stylus Shape: VDH - IS
Stylus Radii: 2 x 85 Micron
Frequency Range: 5 - 55.000 Hz
Tracking Force: 13.5 - 15 mN
see (*3)
Static Compliance: 35 Micron/mN
see (*3)
Tracking Ability at 15mN at 315Hz: 70 - 80 Micron
Output Voltage at 1 kHz at 5.7 cm/s eff.: a) 0.25 mV RMS
b) 0.55 mV RMS
c) 0.35 mV RMS
d) 0.45 mV RMS
Channel Unbalance: < 0.3 dB
Channel Separation at 1kHz / 10kHz: > 36 / > 30 dB
Equivalent Stylus Tip Mass: 0.32 Milligram
System Weight: see (*4)
Vertical Tracking Angle : 22 Degrees
Optimum Load Capacitance: see (*2)
Recommended Load Impedance: a) 500 (> 200) Ohm
b) 1000 (500 - 47k) Ohm
c) 500 (> 200) Ohm
d) 1000 (500 - 47k) Ohm
Recommended Eff Tone arm Mass: see (*3) + (*4) + (*5)
Moving Coil Resistance per channel: a) 21 Ohm +/- 10%
b) 96 Ohm +/- 10%
c) 36 Ohm +/- 10%
d) 62 Ohm +/- 10%
Extra Info: (*1): Stylus replacement and other services available on request.
(*2): Non critical.
(*3): Versions optimized for lower or higher tracking forces (allowing very light or very heavy arms) can be built on special request. These have a higher, respectively lower static compliance.
(*4): P and M type suffix:
Each of the above mentioned versions of The CONDOR are available with either:
- A regular carbon-nylon plastic body. Total cartridge weight is 8.75 gram. Suitable for arms with an effective tone arm mass of 12 gram to 20 gram. The plastic bodied version carries the -P suffix in its name.
- A metal body. Total cartridge weight is 9.25 gram. Suitable for arms with an effective tone arm mass of 12 gram to 20 gram. The metal bodied version carries the -M suffix in its name.
(*5): The cartridge has been optimized regarding an EFFECTIVE tone arm mass of 12 - 20 gram. Heavier arms CAN produce tracking and resonance problems and arms with an effective mass exceeding 24 gram WILL CERTAINLY! Also see (*3).
Company Profile
New Products
Awards
Advisory Retail Pricelist
Agenda / Shows
Articles & Papers
Discontinued Products
International Distributors
© 2007, A.J. van den Hul BV
Special customer demands/specifications:
Thanks to the many variations in materials available, it is always possible to build a unit to match the personal demands of the customer.
With these personalized cartridges the wooden container can mention the name of the customer it has been specially built for.
This option is exclusively available for The CANARY, The GRASSHOPPER III series, The GRASSHOPPER IV, The GRASSHOPPER “BEAUTY”, The CONDOR and The COLIBRI versions.
The customer demands/specifications that can be taken into account when building a personalized cartridge for instance are:
The tone-arm used, the preamp and load impedance used, a particular brand of records to be played, the type of music generally played (jazz being more dynamic and classical more spacious and detailed) and other personal/sound preferences.
Production time:
The production time for a CONDOR cartridge after ordering is about two weeks. Please call your authorized distributor for delivery time.
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