Good evening all,
I have begun to give some thought to experimenting with making turntable belts. My DIY turntable uses a heavy platter with massive bearing. So far I've tried rubber belts but want to try other material. I have been checking out the Teres turntable and not that they have used various materials to drive their heavy platters. My platter weighs about 15 pounds which is not light.
I was looking at starting with "leader tape" but note that is does not seem to be sticky enough. I would think that platter slippage would be a problem with this material. Any thoughts from those of you who have gone down this road? Thanks for all comments.
Bob
Is this what you are looking for?
Welcome to Moriteq USA
Or this?
Belt Corporation of America | Timing Belts, Endless Belts and Custom Belt Fabrication
There are many more. Just Google "flat rubber belts".
Bob,
Ever given any thought to directly driving the platter from the motor capstan using a small tire. You would eliminate all wow noise imposed by the belt.
There are several old sewing machine companies that still make leather belts for there equipment. They are known to be very quiet and performance is excellent. If I can find some old manuals, think very old, I will post sources for you.
I built my turntable using an old Hunter ceiling fan motor and suspending the entire platter on magnets. There is no mechanical contact to anything, it just floats in the air. Works very well. Had a solid state speed controller made to adjust the armature to the proper rpm.
Tad
Ever given any thought to directly driving the platter from the motor capstan using a small tire. You would eliminate all wow noise imposed by the belt.
There are several old sewing machine companies that still make leather belts for there equipment. They are known to be very quiet and performance is excellent. If I can find some old manuals, think very old, I will post sources for you.
I built my turntable using an old Hunter ceiling fan motor and suspending the entire platter on magnets. There is no mechanical contact to anything, it just floats in the air. Works very well. Had a solid state speed controller made to adjust the armature to the proper rpm.
Tad
If there are any eccentricities in the "tire" you will still get some wow. (Also the case if slightly out of round or off center) This is more or less the latest variant of the old idler drive which is incidentally also rumble prone. There seem to be a number of outboard motor kits that offer exterior rim drive as an option in addition to belts.
There should be plenty of discussion on Vinyl Engine | The Home of the Turntable and some good advice as well.
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Thank you very much for both URL, especially the last. "Endless rubber belts" is the right keyword for "google". My english isn't good, so I did not like it.
Now the next step is to learn how to perform the matching record player belt (including the appropriate rubber glue and suitable adhesive bonding technology
If one dominates, we can produce for many other purposes (CD loader cassette decks) individually all kinds of matching rubber belts.
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Good evening all,
I have begun to give some thought to experimenting with making turntable belts. My DIY turntable uses a heavy platter with massive bearing. So far I've tried rubber belts but want to try other material. I have been checking out the Teres turntable and not that they have used various materials to drive their heavy platters. My platter weighs about 15 pounds which is not light.
I was looking at starting with "leader tape" but note that is does not seem to be sticky enough. I would think that platter slippage would be a problem with this material. Any thoughts from those of you who have gone down this road? Thanks for all comments.
Bob
I've actually been happy with the generic rubber belts available from places like Turntable Basics. Turntable Belts, Parts and Accessories.. I've not had good luck with carcass weave belts. Because of their increased stiffness, any motor speed fluxuations, noise, shaft runouts etc are more efficiently transmitted to the platter.
My $.02
Cheers,
Hi Guys
I am new here, I got pictures showing I use very thin elastic thread (from clothing material supply) in one condition is to use both hand turn start before switch on, ratio is 1 to 1 between plate and driver's pulley (real big pulley) and if weight well balanced will not have slip problem, Result ? this is the best (I did a lot test of different materials) can give more live of sound, rest all feeling dull try same size sewing tread (nonelastic) you will have the answer right away.even changing weights to the driver's plate, the sound quality will follow, worth to have a try, it won't cost much money and have a great fun.
I modified the DD Technics SL1100 by separated the power supply and changed the better VR for better speed control, and also cut a small grove to keep the thread in place
Tony Ma
I am new here, I got pictures showing I use very thin elastic thread (from clothing material supply) in one condition is to use both hand turn start before switch on, ratio is 1 to 1 between plate and driver's pulley (real big pulley) and if weight well balanced will not have slip problem, Result ? this is the best (I did a lot test of different materials) can give more live of sound, rest all feeling dull try same size sewing tread (nonelastic) you will have the answer right away.even changing weights to the driver's plate, the sound quality will follow, worth to have a try, it won't cost much money and have a great fun.
I modified the DD Technics SL1100 by separated the power supply and changed the better VR for better speed control, and also cut a small grove to keep the thread in place
Tony Ma
Attachments
An off-topic question: Do you know also a delivery source about lid hinges for dust cover (for turntables resp. record players)?
If yes, please, send your reply there:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/anal...sony-turntables-repair-orig-brand-wanted.html
Thank you very much
Thanks everyone for your great comments and suggestions. Actually, if I can find a company that makes small diameter rubber belts That would be great. I can order them from China but I am not sure of the quality of those belts. They appear to stretch out of shape easily after a short while. I am going to try the O ring belt from Turntable Basics and see what they offer. I don't think thread or fishing line will work for me although I really don't know.
Bob
Bob
[comment][/comment]
Out of curiosity, does the knot cause problems with speed accuracy or is it to small too be of consequence ?
Karl
Out of curiosity, does the knot cause problems with speed accuracy or is it to small too be of consequence ?
Karl
Good morning all,
I have not considered a "rim driven" system since I would have to totally re-design my plinth. I chose the "belt drive" method because other very advanced turntable company's use it and it's not difficult to accomplish. However, what I don't understand is why I can't purchase small diameter rubber and other belts that I might want to try right off the shelf?
What happens when a company sends out a new turntable with "string/tape/cloth drive" and eventually the owner needs new string, tape or other drive mechanism? Can they go back to the company and request another belt or will they be expected to make their own? By the way, when I've gone to Ebay looking for belts they usually have a make or model but not the size of the belts. So unless I know the belt that fits an AR turntable is a certain size I don't know if that belt will meet my needs.
I've got an order in to "Turntable Basics" (very slow company) and have been waiting for the two belts I ordered for almost a month now. When/if I get the (43 and 47 inch O ring belts) I will see how each works on my DIY turntable. I want to try a bevy of belts to see which works best. Of course I have not gotten around to trying tape, string and some of the other more esoteric materials. Perhaps if I could purchase these of the shelf I might give them a shot. Thanks for listening all.
Bob
I have not considered a "rim driven" system since I would have to totally re-design my plinth. I chose the "belt drive" method because other very advanced turntable company's use it and it's not difficult to accomplish. However, what I don't understand is why I can't purchase small diameter rubber and other belts that I might want to try right off the shelf?
What happens when a company sends out a new turntable with "string/tape/cloth drive" and eventually the owner needs new string, tape or other drive mechanism? Can they go back to the company and request another belt or will they be expected to make their own? By the way, when I've gone to Ebay looking for belts they usually have a make or model but not the size of the belts. So unless I know the belt that fits an AR turntable is a certain size I don't know if that belt will meet my needs.
I've got an order in to "Turntable Basics" (very slow company) and have been waiting for the two belts I ordered for almost a month now. When/if I get the (43 and 47 inch O ring belts) I will see how each works on my DIY turntable. I want to try a bevy of belts to see which works best. Of course I have not gotten around to trying tape, string and some of the other more esoteric materials. Perhaps if I could purchase these of the shelf I might give them a shot. Thanks for listening all.
Bob
If you can find a suitable source of rubber or neoprene material for making belts, I recommend using "Superglue" (cyanoacrylate) adhesive to join them. If you cut the ends squarely and align carefully when gluing, the join will be almost undetectable and should last the life of the belt.
The following info is excerpted from a post I wrote about repairing stretched belts in CD player mechanisms, but applies equally for turntable belts:
Cutting squarely:
You need a jig to do this properly. I have an old Loctite O-ring kit(*) that contains a jig for cutting squarely and holding the ends when regluing. For cutting you ideally need something like a miniature version of a mitre box, where the bottom and sides of the box fit the belt exactly so that the blade doesn't distort the belt as it cuts. If you have good eye/hand coordination you can do it "freehand" on a flat surface, but you need to
practise a few times to get a square cut. You need a *very* sharp, thin blade. A single edged razor blade is best, failing that, a good quality craft knife or scalpel with a straight edged blade.
Accurately aligning the ends: A v-shaped groove is best for this, with a non-stick surface. The backing paper from a sticky label (the slippery, shiny part that you peel off to expose the adhesive) makes a good work surface. Again, if you're good with your hands you can get away with using a piece of this folded to form a 90 degree V, otherwise you'll need to glue it into a v-shaped groove in a piece of wood or something. Practise a few times "dry" before applying the glue and going for "broke". Make sure you haven't got a twist in the belt before applying the glue...
If you have tools and some teflon or nylon sheet, you can make a combined cutting and glueing jig. Take two pieces of sheet about 20 mm wide, about 100 mm long and about 3-5 mm thick. (Dimensions not critical.) Make one piece shorter than the other by approximately the thickness of the sheet. Clamp one piece on top of the other so that one set of ends align, then drill a couple of holes near the other (non aligned) end and fasten them together with machine screws and nuts. Then cut a 90 degree V groove 2 or 3 mm deep across the aligned ends.
To cut, lay the belt in the V groove, then slide a razor blade down between the two sheets and through the belt.
To glue, lay the belt ends facing each other in the long groove formed at the other end of the jig (where one piece of plastic was slightly shorter than the other). Apply a *small* amount of superglue to one end and carefully slide together. Don't press too hard or the joint will buckle or compress, making a crooked or bulged joint.
(*) I suppose the kit is still available - it contains lengths of round section neoprene, a bottle of superglue, a plastic jig, and some razor blades. It allows you to make replacements for O-rings where the original part is no longer available. Very useful if you work on old Japanese motorcycle engines...
The cutting jig is designed for round sections (it has various size holes through it), I simply cut a v-groove in it as described above to handle the square belts.
The following info is excerpted from a post I wrote about repairing stretched belts in CD player mechanisms, but applies equally for turntable belts:
Cutting squarely:
You need a jig to do this properly. I have an old Loctite O-ring kit(*) that contains a jig for cutting squarely and holding the ends when regluing. For cutting you ideally need something like a miniature version of a mitre box, where the bottom and sides of the box fit the belt exactly so that the blade doesn't distort the belt as it cuts. If you have good eye/hand coordination you can do it "freehand" on a flat surface, but you need to
practise a few times to get a square cut. You need a *very* sharp, thin blade. A single edged razor blade is best, failing that, a good quality craft knife or scalpel with a straight edged blade.
Accurately aligning the ends: A v-shaped groove is best for this, with a non-stick surface. The backing paper from a sticky label (the slippery, shiny part that you peel off to expose the adhesive) makes a good work surface. Again, if you're good with your hands you can get away with using a piece of this folded to form a 90 degree V, otherwise you'll need to glue it into a v-shaped groove in a piece of wood or something. Practise a few times "dry" before applying the glue and going for "broke". Make sure you haven't got a twist in the belt before applying the glue...
If you have tools and some teflon or nylon sheet, you can make a combined cutting and glueing jig. Take two pieces of sheet about 20 mm wide, about 100 mm long and about 3-5 mm thick. (Dimensions not critical.) Make one piece shorter than the other by approximately the thickness of the sheet. Clamp one piece on top of the other so that one set of ends align, then drill a couple of holes near the other (non aligned) end and fasten them together with machine screws and nuts. Then cut a 90 degree V groove 2 or 3 mm deep across the aligned ends.
To cut, lay the belt in the V groove, then slide a razor blade down between the two sheets and through the belt.
To glue, lay the belt ends facing each other in the long groove formed at the other end of the jig (where one piece of plastic was slightly shorter than the other). Apply a *small* amount of superglue to one end and carefully slide together. Don't press too hard or the joint will buckle or compress, making a crooked or bulged joint.
(*) I suppose the kit is still available - it contains lengths of round section neoprene, a bottle of superglue, a plastic jig, and some razor blades. It allows you to make replacements for O-rings where the original part is no longer available. Very useful if you work on old Japanese motorcycle engines...
The cutting jig is designed for round sections (it has various size holes through it), I simply cut a v-groove in it as described above to handle the square belts.
Originally Teres used unwaxed dental floss as a "belt". Later on they moved to mylar tape (sold in large amounts by places that sell stuff for school bands, cheerleader stuff etc etc. McCormack I think is the name...).
People have also used VHS and cassette tape. You can buy a tape splicing set on ebay with 100ft of leader tape for about $25 or so.
The key thing is that if you move to a tape based system, you will need the ability to do some alignment so that the platter and pulley line up correctly otherwise the tape will ride up either the pulley or platter.
I have used both on mine. No discernable wow or slip using heavy gauge silk thread.
Fran
People have also used VHS and cassette tape. You can buy a tape splicing set on ebay with 100ft of leader tape for about $25 or so.
The key thing is that if you move to a tape based system, you will need the ability to do some alignment so that the platter and pulley line up correctly otherwise the tape will ride up either the pulley or platter.
I have used both on mine. No discernable wow or slip using heavy gauge silk thread.
Fran
Good morning all,
I have just gotten two (2) O-Ring belts delivered to me and will be trying them out soon. These belts will permit me to play with the distance between the platter and motor unit. I may have to actually start the platter turning by giving it a gentle push. Initially, I thought there was a major problem with the motor until I began extensive reading of the many comments regarding various motor units use by Teres, etc. I've come to understand this is not a problem since some great turntable were designed to be "push started".
I understand now that turntable manufacturers are moving away from the "belt drive" to drives that directly contact the platter. I am sure there are virtues in both methods. However, my ears are not now fine tuned enough to hear a great difference. That day may come.
I am now waiting for my order of "adjustable footers" for my motor housing. I am using a motor purchased from DIY HiFi which will drive a heavy (15 LB) platter with a massive bearing. I now clearly understand the need that the motor unit and platter all be level and aligned properly otherwise the belt will ride up and down causing wow and other problems.
My DIY turntable is a project of love and dedication. Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions. Please, everyone, family and friends have a joyous and blessed Christmas and New Year.
Bob
I have just gotten two (2) O-Ring belts delivered to me and will be trying them out soon. These belts will permit me to play with the distance between the platter and motor unit. I may have to actually start the platter turning by giving it a gentle push. Initially, I thought there was a major problem with the motor until I began extensive reading of the many comments regarding various motor units use by Teres, etc. I've come to understand this is not a problem since some great turntable were designed to be "push started".
I understand now that turntable manufacturers are moving away from the "belt drive" to drives that directly contact the platter. I am sure there are virtues in both methods. However, my ears are not now fine tuned enough to hear a great difference. That day may come.
I am now waiting for my order of "adjustable footers" for my motor housing. I am using a motor purchased from DIY HiFi which will drive a heavy (15 LB) platter with a massive bearing. I now clearly understand the need that the motor unit and platter all be level and aligned properly otherwise the belt will ride up and down causing wow and other problems.
My DIY turntable is a project of love and dedication. Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions. Please, everyone, family and friends have a joyous and blessed Christmas and New Year.
Bob
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