Joachim don't get me wrong the excelence of the Paradise is not under question, I built beta (and same small contribution there) and am going to build R3 as well (is it not proff on how much I like it?)
Paradise is and will be on my system for a long long time and I am sure those 200 and over that are going to build it will be happy with it.
Me and Riccardo have the same listening impressions (For the ones thinking what a loads of bull after my listening impression post< you know who you are> this is much pie in the face and got to wait for GB number 2) and as you can see on Riccardo post 6880 he share my impression that Simplistic has a wider sound stage.
As I said changing sound stage width in the Paradise may actualy take same of the Paradise Flawor out of it.
To discover the magic wider sound stage ingredient and subtle use of it in the right quantity is pure Alkemy to me. Just curious neh?
Just recivied this PM
clearly same help wuld be apreciated by many
Maybe the Paradise build tread is needed sooner than expected....
PM qoute name deleted:>
Hi Kksabath,
did anybody give you an answer on your question???
"Will 2 off those 24 V 50 VA be ok for pardise V3 "
Because I'm not that deep in DIY I would order the same Transformers to be on the save side ...
Thanks
/XXXXXXXX
As I said I am not expert so please duble cek my reply
My reply:>Joachim uses trafos as folows in his post Quote:>
Originally Posted by Joachim Gerhard
I run a set of 4 Block transformers with 30VA and 2 x 12V. I have wired each transformer for 24V so two transformers make a plus-minus supply.
End quote
From this Joachim has 60VA avvaliable for each channel
I think that 30 VA 2X24 30VA shuld work
I have ordered 50 VA 2X24 to have a bit of margin
Riccardo uses one 120VA transformer see post 6879
2 transformers dual mono are better than one see Joachim post 6886
For VA calculations
VA= Vsecondary X Amps
so for the one I have ordered 50 VA divided by 48 V(24 + 24) = 1.041 A
For voltagge excluding the Diodes V drop
AC voltagge X 1.471 = DC voltagge 24 X1.471 = 35.304V DC
This is a bit hi but I am using the preregulator board with common mode chokes at imput and output so same of this vill be used by chokes.
Paradise can take more but heath sinks go realy hot.
bear in mind that I am not expert so why not ask the question on the post?
as you are new to this I am shure that YOU GET an answer
Feel free to PM for any help
Al the best
Al
end quote
Hope I got my fact straigt
clearly same help wuld be apreciated by many
Maybe the Paradise build tread is needed sooner than expected....
PM qoute name deleted:>
Hi Kksabath,
did anybody give you an answer on your question???
"Will 2 off those 24 V 50 VA be ok for pardise V3 "
Because I'm not that deep in DIY I would order the same Transformers to be on the save side ...
Thanks
/XXXXXXXX
As I said I am not expert so please duble cek my reply
My reply:>Joachim uses trafos as folows in his post Quote:>
Originally Posted by Joachim Gerhard
I run a set of 4 Block transformers with 30VA and 2 x 12V. I have wired each transformer for 24V so two transformers make a plus-minus supply.
End quote
From this Joachim has 60VA avvaliable for each channel
I think that 30 VA 2X24 30VA shuld work
I have ordered 50 VA 2X24 to have a bit of margin
Riccardo uses one 120VA transformer see post 6879
2 transformers dual mono are better than one see Joachim post 6886
For VA calculations
VA= Vsecondary X Amps
so for the one I have ordered 50 VA divided by 48 V(24 + 24) = 1.041 A
For voltagge excluding the Diodes V drop
AC voltagge X 1.471 = DC voltagge 24 X1.471 = 35.304V DC
This is a bit hi but I am using the preregulator board with common mode chokes at imput and output so same of this vill be used by chokes.
Paradise can take more but heath sinks go realy hot.
bear in mind that I am not expert so why not ask the question on the post?
as you are new to this I am shure that YOU GET an answer
Feel free to PM for any help
Al the best
Al
end quote
Hope I got my fact straigt
The short answer is 'yes', a (somewhat) longer answer can be found here http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/analogue-source/154210-mpp-647.html#post3110294 #6462
In my preregulator I am using a 2x24V, 80VA transformer. Out of lazyness I use the same preregulator for Paradise R1 and R2,noting that R2 has a slightly lower current consumption (110mA vs 140mA).
The power consumption in the chassis is the same, wheter it is dissipated in the amplifier or in the heatsink does not exactly matter. Yes, the heatsinks will get hotter, as long as you don't exceed the maximum temperature of the transistors you should be fine (it will decrease lifetime though). Best to run it cool.
So in my humble opinion, 2x18V, 80VA, should be plenty. Double mono using two transformers and two preregulators is even better.
I have been comparing the Paradise also to a Pearl II from Pass Labs, dual mono supply, and I find the soundstage to be about the same, only more realistic and precise with the paradise. When the two channels are not exactly matched (from a added distortion point of view - yes thats difficult) then I think added distortion will show up at the loudspeaker location, "adding" acoustic events in space that were not there previously. That can distract from the real soundstage, in my opinion....
The power consumption in the chassis is the same, wheter it is dissipated in the amplifier or in the heatsink does not exactly matter. Yes, the heatsinks will get hotter, as long as you don't exceed the maximum temperature of the transistors you should be fine (it will decrease lifetime though). Best to run it cool.
So in my humble opinion, 2x18V, 80VA, should be plenty. Double mono using two transformers and two preregulators is even better.
I have been comparing the Paradise also to a Pearl II from Pass Labs, dual mono supply, and I find the soundstage to be about the same, only more realistic and precise with the paradise. When the two channels are not exactly matched (from a added distortion point of view - yes thats difficult) then I think added distortion will show up at the loudspeaker location, "adding" acoustic events in space that were not there previously. That can distract from the real soundstage, in my opinion....
Any transformer 18VAC(5VA(min)) x 2 up to 24VAC(8VA(min)) x 2 will do, to have some 'head room' use a transformer of 20VA (or so) and it will work beautiful. I do prefer toroid’s and most available will be bigger that the 20VA needed, this is no problem. As Jacco noted
When building double mono you need 2 transformers of 10VA(min) each.
Any transformer will make a slight contribution on the sound. On the other hand the Paradise has an extremely high quality PSU plus pre-regulator plus very good PSRR from the circuit itself ( cascoding and mirrors ). We are talking here about a suppression of -160dB in theory.
I think what is most important is going double mono and keeping the transformers far enough away from the circuit so that no stray field is coming into the sensitive parts of the Paradise.
I think what is most important is going double mono and keeping the transformers far enough away from the circuit so that no stray field is coming into the sensitive parts of the Paradise.
I have no experience with R-core, I'm sure they are fine. The reason for me to use toroids is 'low external magnetic field'.
Higher VAC's will give more heat
IMO 20VAC would be the best choice, giving head room and not to much heat.
The argument for R-Core, C-Core, Split Bobbin and such is that HF noise from the wall outlet is not coupled well to the secondary side of a transformer because of low capacitive coupling. Another argument is that on some of this exotic transformers the core material is better so does not produce much distortion. Some designers like Charles Hanson from Ayre go so far to not except any ferrite in the whole chain, even not in line filters.
I do not belong into this group and have no problems with ferrite common mode chokes.
Yes, Toroids have the lowest stray field if you mount them right. Do not put a circuit on top though but on the side. There are also toroids, for example from Schuro that have a shield winding that lowers HF coupling.
There is also a trick i learned from a physics PHD. When you build double mono you have two toroids side by side. Turn them against each other, one clockwise, one counter clockwise. There will be a situation where the stray fields cancel each other optimally.
That has to be done "in situ", the transformers have mounted where they end up in the finished case and also the phono board has to be in the right position. This is again prove for my philosophy that brain power is more important then any exotic part.
I do not belong into this group and have no problems with ferrite common mode chokes.
Yes, Toroids have the lowest stray field if you mount them right. Do not put a circuit on top though but on the side. There are also toroids, for example from Schuro that have a shield winding that lowers HF coupling.
There is also a trick i learned from a physics PHD. When you build double mono you have two toroids side by side. Turn them against each other, one clockwise, one counter clockwise. There will be a situation where the stray fields cancel each other optimally.
That has to be done "in situ", the transformers have mounted where they end up in the finished case and also the phono board has to be in the right position. This is again prove for my philosophy that brain power is more important then any exotic part.
I have no experience with R-core, I'm sure they are fine. The reason for me to use toroids is 'low external magnetic field'.
Higher VAC's will give more heat
Rcore Easy peasy to take off or ad a few turns as coils are split normaly they sound better than Thoroids but as FDW say paradise suply is realy good.
Have a look at the post by Salas that folow it could you please go a bit more in depth with explanation ?
Any way
Go same from Seletronic I have ordered 50VA but they posted 30VA
no problem there then apart that I am due refound.
PS they got Silmic2 a decent price.
