Mpp - Page 58 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Source & Line > Analogue Source

Analogue Source Turntables, Tonearms, Cartridges, Phono Stages, Tuners, Tape Recorders, etc.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30th December 2009, 05:03 PM   #571
syn08 is offline syn08  Canada
Account disabled at member's request
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Quote:
Originally Posted by brianco View Post
syn08 appears to have pulled his last post to which the above was a response.
No, my post was deleted by a moderator. As usual, this is not the place to freely (and decently) express opinions.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:04 PM   #572
brianco is offline brianco  Ireland
diyAudio Member
 
brianco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Scottish Borders - Kelso; on the famous Tweed River!
There is a lot of that about!
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:15 PM   #573
diyAudio Member
 
Joachim Gerhard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Thanks Brianco to give us the view of a listener.
Today i worked a bit on the ECHO and a good friend came to listen
He has three good systems, one with the original Medea.
He was shocked how good the sound is in my home.
Again he could not hear noise at the listening seat at high volume.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:16 PM   #574
Account disabled at member's request
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by syn08 View Post
No, my post was deleted by a moderator. As usual, this is not the place to freely (and decently) express opinions.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/analo...ml#post1998583
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:39 PM   #575
iko is offline iko  Canada
diyAudio Moderator
 
iko's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Toronto
Let's see, Joachim claims to build a device intended to be part of a music reproduction chain, which ultimately is used by someone to listen to music with. He seems to try to achieve something that to him qualifies as good sound. At least that's how I understand his message so far.

Now from syn08's latest comments, he seems to judge the success of his circuits by the popularity of his website. He says he does not trust his or anyone's ability to pass judgment by listening alone. He only trusts measurements and web server statistics. If these are his goals, he has more than succeeded indeed. He builds circuits applying 4-th year undergrad EE theory and he builds them to his specs, which do not include listening feedback, because he is not a subjectivist. He likes labels like that right? He also likes to classify people as "you're friend of so and so." I for one applaud syn08 because he's doing a good job at what he wants to do. He is successful.

But Joachim is successful too, at something else though.

Brianco seems to indicate that syn08 makes theoretical advances in this field. IMHO he is very able to do textbook engineering, but do not mistake yourself in thinking that there is any theoretical advance there. There isn't. Not that I can see any, anyway.

I'd like to draw an imperfect parallel with photography and painting, because there is a similarity to building audio devices. There is a technical aspect, and there is an artistic aspect. In fact many people may not think of painting this way, but it is too. Good photographers and painters were/are also very accomplished technically. But just good techniques does not result in good art. It's still the old adage, "philosophum non facit barba" or a beard does not make one a philosopher.
Just my 2c

P.S. Sadly I'm probably still on syn08's ignore list. In case the opposite is true, syn08, I would like to mention that you still owe me an apology; still I forgave all your insults and don't have any hard feelings.

P.P.S Joachim, I am still reading with interest your journey and am looking forward to a final-ish version. Is that a realistic expectation?

Last edited by iko; 30th December 2009 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Addition
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:50 PM   #576
syn08 is offline syn08  Canada
Account disabled at member's request
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Quote:
Originally Posted by stinius View Post
Funny, isn't it? Well, at least Brianco took it seriously and elaborated a decent and thoughtful reply.

I'm back to my Edison drum
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 05:59 PM   #577
syn08 is offline syn08  Canada
Account disabled at member's request
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joachim Gerhard View Post
Again he could not hear noise at the listening seat at high volume.
Really Joachim, this is interesting, what speakers are you using and what means "high volume" to you? At 100W/channel and 97dB speakers I can hear 1nV/rtHz from 5 meters. I can hear 0.6nV/rtHz ear on grille and 0.4nV/rtHz is my audibility limit.

1nV/rtHz is 140nV in the audio band. Considering a total gain of 28V/0.5mV, the noise voltage at the speaker terminals is 7.8mV. How in hell is this not audible, even in low sensitivity speakers? Don't you really hear the hiss before the needle touches the vinyl?
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 06:01 PM   #578
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
syn, does that account for the gain-loss from the RIAA at frequencies where the ear is sensitive?
__________________
You might be screaming "No, no, no" and all they hear is "Who wants cake?" Let me tell you something: They all do. They all want cake.- Wilford Brimley
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 06:14 PM   #579
syn08 is offline syn08  Canada
Account disabled at member's request
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
syn, does that account for the gain-loss from the RIAA at frequencies where the ear is sensitive?
No, as usual I considered noise and gains at 1KHz.

I can dig some M. Fremer reviews, complaining about 1nV/rtHz noise
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2009, 06:34 PM   #580
brianco is offline brianco  Ireland
diyAudio Member
 
brianco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Scottish Borders - Kelso; on the famous Tweed River!
@ ikoflexer
I did NOT intend to stir up this topic.
syn08 may sometimes write with an apparent lack of regard for the feelings of some more tender souls...that may be unfortunate but I am sure is not his usual intent - we have all been around for too long to let it get to us! From a technical viewpoint he has a lot to add and I do believe that some of the criticism above is unfounded; he simply said that activity through his website indicates a satisfactory degree of interest in his designs.

The forum I am certain is not intended to be some gladiators ring in which the main contestants appear in a fight to the death whilst cheered and spurred on by their fans!!! It IS a forum for information exchange. And never forget that we do have many exceptionally talented members who contribute freely, thereby expanding our knowledge, educating our views whilst some even give us for gratis exceptionally good designs. I do not need to name names.

Another great value is that we can exchange ideas freely across the globe and also develop together designs and variations. But don't forget that there are times when someone has to be quite firm so as to avoid obvious mistakes or deviations. [ It is said that a camel is a horse designed by a committee without leadership]. We can also buy and sell and take advantage of group buys. I am amazed at how smoothly such exchange between quite large numbers of people with a common interest can run, especially so when there is a large percentage of contributors for whom English is not their native language. It would be a great pity if personally felt "insults" were to take too great a degree of importance. To hold a viewpoint is fine, but should there be serious acrimony then it should be handled between those involved by the privacy of PMs or email.

Now lets get on with the thread - it is one of the best on the forum.

Last edited by brianco; 30th December 2009 at 06:37 PM.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 04:57 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2