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Old 5th March 2009, 02:57 AM   #1
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Default An other DIY Schröder Tonearm Project

Hi. I'm just starting this new thread while we (me and Kilowattski) are starting an other crazy endeavor. I just completed my own Teres turntable (see the details at My DIY Teres Turntable) with Mark Kelly controller (My own Version of Mark Kelly's Speed Controller), and then Kilowattski contacted me and asked if I was interested in trying to build a Schroeder Tonearm clone.

I was already involved with Greg Nuspel (the nice guy that help us with the controller pulley design and manufacturing), but then Greg move along to some other projects. I was left without a machinist, so the project was out of the question. But I collected bits and pieces for the tonearm, found a nice tonearm lifter from Germany, etc, so it was a shame to let it go. Kilowattski made my day when he asked if I was interested in the project again. I certainly was

Don't take it wrong. Me and Kilowattski, we don't pretend that we can we do as good a tonearm as the real Schroeder (or even to get close to a good tonearm to start with), but we thought it would be a fun project.

We did a lot of research (published US patent, publicly accessible information and photos) and thinking, use some of the nice ACAD concept that Greg originally produced, and Kilowattski did a great job at producing a first draft design (in virtual CAD reality at least).

This thread will show our progress (or lack of) as we go along building the arm. Comments are welcome.

First, disclaimer right from the start. Yes, we are trying to build a Schröder Clone, but with a few twists. it may have a micrometer VTA adjustment for example. We don't have access to the real thing, and we don't know the trade secret of Mr. Frank Schroeder, and we are not trying to discover them either. Purpose of this project is real DIYer work, try to get something that work and have fun in the process. We are not trying to start a production of cheap copies or to steal any body's work. So, it won't be a real Schröder tonearm, just our own version of a great design using magnetic bearing, thread pivot point, etc...

I contacted Mr. Schroeder himself by email and asked for his permission to use his design concept and show our work and findings (username berlinta, he posted on the very forum at some occasions). He kindly reply and gives us permission with some restrictions. He even offer some comments and suggestions that can help us get a better result. That was very generous, and we can only thank him for doing so.

His reply was: ''I have no objections to you and your friend building your own Schröder arm version and sharing it with other DIYers a long as you don't publish drawings that someone else could use as a basis for a commercial effort. Photograps are fine off course.''

So, we will go along within these restrictions. That means, don't ask for ACAD drawings or files on our design, on this thread or by private email. I can just refer you back to designer itself.
I'll post some pictures and comments on the project.

Updates will be posted soon, I hope. So stay tuned.
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Old 7th March 2009, 01:54 AM   #2
fmena is offline fmena  Canada
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Power to you Sylvain. I don't know where you get the energy for all these endeavors. I truly look forward to seeing your progress.

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Old 12th March 2009, 03:30 AM   #3
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Come on Ladies and Gents. Where is the interest? Sylvain (Algar_emi) and I will be tag-teaming this one. We will be making the last of the drawing changes tommorrow and the first machining starts Saturday. I promise to take as many pictures as I can. My goal is to machine a part a week. I am taking my time because I am not an experienced machinist. I am a beginner and like to measure everything two or three times before taking mill or lathe to material. It's gonna be alot of fun and Sylvain (Algar_emi) and I should a couple of Schroeder Clones out of it. I want to send a special thank you to Frank Schroeder for looking our drawings over and making suggestions.

PS: We are adding a little surprise to our Schroeder Clone. We will be adding micrometer based VTA on the fly. It should be very interesting to say the least.
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Old 12th March 2009, 05:59 AM   #4
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kilo,
I'm very interested in seeing how this progresses and I would love to participate. However, I believe most of us will likely be confined to the sidelines. I'm no machinist and even if I were, it would be nearly impossible to join in the fun without drawings.

To me this is like trying to build a circuit without a schematic......

Bill
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Old 12th March 2009, 11:05 AM   #5
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carry on fellas, we ain't saying much but we all watching!

I'm particularly interested in how you implement the VTA on the fly option.


Fran
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Old 13th March 2009, 05:00 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by MashBill
kilo,
I'm very interested in seeing how this progresses and I would love to participate. However, I believe most of us will likely be confined to the sidelines. I'm no machinist and even if I were, it would be nearly impossible to join in the fun without drawings.

To me this is like trying to build a circuit without a schematic......

Bill
Bill,

I would love to post the drawings, but Frank Schroeder has asked us not to. He has been very helpful and Sylvain and I will honor his wishes. I came up with the drawings by looking at pictures of the Schroeder Reference Arm and gestimating the dimensions via proportion, looking at his patent and trial and error. AutoCad made the job a little easier. I am no machinist. I just have access to a machine shop on the weekends and enough knowledge to make me dangerous. I am a beginner. Now if I had Vinyl Addicts skills, it would be done already. You should see the turntable he made. I loosely based my turntable on his design. I will post as many pictures of the Arm as work progresses.

Guy
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Old 13th March 2009, 05:09 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by woodturner-fran
carry on fellas, we ain't saying much but we all watching!

I'm particularly interested in how you implement the VTA on the fly option.


Fran
Fran,

On the Schroeder Arm, it was a very simple thing to do. No earth shattering design breakthroughs here. Frank as a very nice implementation of VTA adjustment already in the Schroeder Reference Arm but ours will work on the fly. We will use a simple Starrett 0 to 0.5 inch micrometer head.

PS: We are making the arm tube out of Carbon Fiber. If I had your turning skills it would be made of some kind of exotic wood.
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Old 13th March 2009, 11:25 AM   #8
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Well, I could make one for you if you are interested...... but ssssh don't tell anyone!


Thats if you are just looking for a straight or tapered wooden tube rebated on both ends where it would sit into a metal receiver?


Fran
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Old 29th March 2009, 07:02 PM   #9
fmena is offline fmena  Canada
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Default Any updates?

Hi guys ....how are things progressing?
FM
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Old 29th March 2009, 09:10 PM   #10
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Default Have you considered rolling your own?

You can buy all manner of types of wood in fine veneers at 1/28 of an inch thick, sanded smooth both sides. Fashion a form any way you like in any shape you like. A little masking tape and a little white wood glue (PVA). Fix one end or the veneer to the form and roll away finish off with a fine line of PVA and a layer of tape let dry 30 minutes. Trim the excess veneer and remove the wooden tube from the form. Now you have a thin wall wooden tube straight walled or tapered. You could fill the tube with expanding poly foam if you like. Experiment all you want the tubes cost almost nothing and take minutes to make. You could use a bunch of paper straws as a base core for a tube which would be light and strong and keep things totally organic. Hope this gives you some options. You might also consider using a bread stick as an arm tube no kidding organic wheat foam core hard crust skin. There are also the super light white hard open cell foams used in craft work that can also make a foam core to veneer over. You could also build the whole thing out of rice paper or similar. Have fun.
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