Stepped-Attenuators = Thin Lower-Mids?

[waj4all]

I posed this question elsewhwre, but perhaps this is the right place for it. Some audiophiles seem to feel that stepped-attenuators (DACT etc) thin-out the lower-mids. A poster here relates that; in past he's tried stepped attenuators, ladder type, with metal film resistor. Compared to common cheap carbon pot (like ALPS and some TKD) the sound of stepped was somewhat clearer, better soundstage, but overall the carbon pot sounds better, more musical, more natural.
Others, elsewhere go further to claim that the atts' clarity border on 'edginess', made more obvious by the atts thinner mids, compared to carbon pots, and other forms of volume-control.
Has anyone else here experienced this? And is there any stepped attenuator which actually sounds 'full', in the lower-mids?

[tinitus]

the most 'correct' or 'clean' can easily lead to thin annoying sound

and with 'passive' att especially I would say its important to think 'synergy'

[waj4all]

Actually, the criticisms I encountered were in the context of the stepped-atts' application in active pre-amps, in the quest for an upgrade in sound-quality. The detractors do acknowledge an increase in transparency, but they also claim this is at the cost of thinner lower-mids, which no other means of volume-control displays. Thanx for responding!

[bear]

Part of the issue may relate to the specific switch(es) used in the stepped attenuator, AND the type, mfr, and WATTAGE of the resistors employed.

Some switches used for stepped attenuators work out to be essentially "point contact" switches, and imo that creates a problem sonically.

In general, speaking to this same issue, I do not like to use single contact relays, and greatly prefer multiple contacts in parallel whenever possible, and certainly in signal carrying application.

The resistor wattage, type and mfr issue has been spoken to in other threads, including some extensive testing... I prefer 1/2 watt MF for attenuators. Alternately paralleled 1/8, or 1/4 equalling 1/2 watt rating or better tests exceptionally well... fwiw.

Carbon pots have a distinctive sound, as do carbon comp resistors, and that is not neutral - so by comparison there may be some sort of audible difference that appears to some to be less "good".

I'd agree that for reasons that are entirely unclear, an awful lot of things *appear* to make the lower mids sound "thinner". What the heck is going on with this isn't entirely clear to me at all and in general. The odd thing about it is that back in the early 70's audio friends and I referred to the lower mids as the "mud frequencies". Getting *rid* of the mud was a big goal and not easy to do. By contrast it seems like today you can't *get* good lower mids like one once had. So wazzup wit dat?



_-_-bear

[waj4all]

Hi Bear, thanks for the input. I'm not technically-oriented, but I have (barely) been able to follow you so far, I think. Bottom-line; Is there a brand of stepped-atts (whether DACT, TKD, Goldpoint, etc) resistor-wattage/type notwithstanding, which actually sounds 'full' in the lower-mids? Thanks again!

[bear]

I can't tell you that, I make my own! (not for resale though... and not cheap either)

But what I said gives some base line criteria by which to make a preliminary judgement?

_-_-bear

PS. by way of an experiment you might make up some simple attenuators (2 resistors) using
different resistors (same values / attenuation) different type/mfrs. and a rig to plug them in and see what you hear?

PPS. I prefer the discrete stepped "L" over the usual "potentiomenter" tapped resistor string...

[waj4all]

As I said, I'm a non-techie, I'm really seeking the best volume-control, sonically (carbon-pot, stepped-att, LDR, etc) that I can purchase, complete, over the counter. However, out of curiousity, I wiil try your suggestion, it seems simple enough. Thanks!

[merlin el mago]

Try Shinkoh (tantalum) resistors

[waj4all]

I'll look it-up. Thanks

[kevinkr]

Ever consider the possibility that the carbon pot is adding pleasing sounding colorations to the sound? That the stepped attenuator particularly the LPAD configuration might be telling the truth and the pot might actually be masking something?

Also true that some resistors may more closely approach ideal resistors than others which is sometimes measurable in controlled experiments. (Linearity, voltage coefficients, shunt capacitance, thermal tails, excess noise, etc..)