sound of discrete opamps - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Source & Line > Analog Line Level

Analog Line Level Preamplifiers , Passive Pre-amps, Crossovers, etc.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 27th April 2011, 12:12 PM   #1
robmil is offline robmil  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London
Default sound of discrete opamps

Hi all

Has anybody here listened to various DIY discrete opamps?

I have made a clone JE990 and it is very good but wondered if there is anything A LOT better out there - soundwise?

I looked at the various Sam Groner opamps as well as the line-up modified 918 as well as the plenty on the net.

I suppose I am asking what shouldn't I bother with as a DIY experiment

Rob
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th April 2011, 01:59 PM   #2
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Eastern Pennsylvania
Here is just one thread from diyaudio on the topic of discrete op-amps. There are others such threads here as well, just search this site. Listening experiences will vary with application, system context, and circuit implementation details.

discrete opamp class A
__________________
Ken

Last edited by Ken Newton; 27th April 2011 at 02:02 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th April 2011, 02:28 PM   #3
DF96 is offline DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
In some cases you may actually be listening to the feedback resistors and/or grounding arrangements rather than the op-amp, whether discrete or chip.
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 10:01 AM   #4
fotios is offline fotios  Greece
diyAudio Member
 
fotios's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Δραμα - North Greece
From LOW up to MID frequencies, discrete implementations are unsurpassed. From MID up to HIGH frequencies, enough ICs are competitive to discrete.
The only objective test - as i have mentioned a lot of times - is the use of instruments: an oscilloscope at the output, and a square wave as stimulus.
__________________
Best Regards FOTIS ANAGNOSTOU
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 01:03 PM   #5
Bonsai is offline Bonsai  Taiwan
diyAudio Member
 
Bonsai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Taipei, Taiwan
Just stick to IC op-amps.

;-)
__________________
bonsai
Amplifier Design and Construction for MUSIC! http://hifisonix.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 01:09 PM   #6
AndrewT is online now AndrewT  Scotland
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Scottish Borders
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonsai View Post
Just stick to IC op-amps.

;-)
and remember to design around the few uA of output stage bias.
__________________
regards Andrew T.
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 01:25 PM   #7
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
i simply do not see a real advantage of discrete opamps vs chips.
possibly can improve figures, but i allways had doubts about how usefull is it anyways.
I could be very wrong, but for example 0.001% thd or 0.00001 % thd makes no difference for me.
Then i check on valve amps and find rather high thd, reason to love a valve amp is its unique distorsion.

sounds a bit.. like split personality.
sure better to have and not need than need but not have, i agree with that, but is it realy worth it?
i dunno..

as a DIY project, creating Your own discrete opamp on the otherhand sounds more than nice
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 01:45 PM   #8
AndrewT is online now AndrewT  Scotland
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Scottish Borders
I see two big differences between discrete opamps designed for audio duty and designed to sound good, vs IC opamps designed to be universal.

First is the number of components used in the respective topologies.
Second is the minuscule output stage bias.

I think the factors of 100 or so between the two make for a well designed discrete generally sounding better than IC.
__________________
regards Andrew T.
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 03:02 PM   #9
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Blog Entries: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by robmil View Post
I have made a clone JE990 and it is very good but wondered if there is anything A LOT better out there - soundwise?
It's unlikely.

There might be something that is minutely better, but a LOT better, no. There won't be anything that's a LOT better.

I say this without the benefit of listening. These days, for an amplifier to be a LOT better than another amplifier, one has to be a LOT worse than an amplifier can be.

You have to remember that amplifiers can only GET so good. There isn't room for improvement ad infinitum. Its an asymptote to perfection, not a straight line rising into the future for all time.

w
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st May 2011, 04:52 PM   #10
fotios is offline fotios  Greece
diyAudio Member
 
fotios's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Δραμα - North Greece
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakibaki View Post
There isn't room for improvement ad infinitum. Its an asymptote to perfection, not a straight line rising into the future for all time.
Very nice phrasing Wakibaki. Mathematics is the corner-stone of Physics.
ad infinitum = without interruption.
asymptote = not going to meet; never.
__________________
Best Regards FOTIS ANAGNOSTOU
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
low noise discrete opamps robmil Solid State 0 7th May 2010 07:24 AM
Are Discrete components better than Opamps ? jsa_ind Everything Else 51 20th December 2006 08:23 AM
discrete vs. IC opamps? has anyone tried the pass labs design? dorkus Pass Labs 22 28th June 2001 01:02 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 05:25 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2