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Old 7th March 2003, 03:07 AM   #91
jcarr is offline jcarr  United States
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Location: Tokyo, Japan
Richard: What "Kaneda Pre #1" do you mean, and where have you seen it? Musen to Jikken started running the "Kaneda Project" series of articles from the August 1973 issue, pages 199~207. The inaugural project was a phono stage and line amp combination, and this is the real Preamp #1. Although Kaneda _may_ have penned an isolated article or two prior to this Musen to Jikken issue, I doubt if these are considered as part of his famous Numbered Series.

The Preamp #1 topology is a dual differential with resistive loading throughout, and the output stage is a single NPN follower with a resistor tying the emittor to the minus rail.

The input FETs are 2SK30 (GR rank), second-stage 2SA493 (GR rank), and the output stage 2SC1000 (BL rank). I believe these were all probably by Toshiba, but I don't know for certain.

I believe that the only device currently available today is the 2SK30.

regards, jonathan carr
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Old 7th March 2003, 06:19 AM   #92
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Default Re: Source of components for Kaneda Pre?

Quote:
Originally posted by RichJones
I am looking for a source of the semi-conductors for the Kaneda Pre #1.

Otherwise, equivalent modern day pieces (which may be better).

Also, how much current at the +-35v or so does it draw? (considering battery power).

Voltage gain and output impedance?
Hi Rich,

I can provide you a set of 2SK30, 2SA872 and 2SC1240 which are an alternate choice for the 1st Kaneda, the 2SK30 are matched but used. I object to using more modern semiconductors, I tried some, but results are worse. Power consumption is about 12 mAmps for each amplifying module: 10mAmp for the output stage, 1.2mAmp for the voltage amplifying stage and 0.5mAmp for the input stage. Open loop gain is said to be 70dB. With the emitter follower output running at 10mAmps the output impedance is always quite low, in the 20..30 Ohms region.

regards,
Hartmut
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Old 7th March 2003, 11:55 PM   #93
jcarr is offline jcarr  United States
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Having no idea of what design L'Audiophile chose to publish and promote as "Kaneda's Preamp #1", I felt that it would be instructive to show the real amplifier schematics for the original Kaneda Preamp #1, pretty much as they were first seen in Musen to Jikken nearly 30 years ago.

The attached file is close to the original drawings in most particulars, but deletes various non-essential features like a channel balance and variable bass-boost.

The accompanying positive and negative voltage regulators are of the series-type, with uPC55A (NEC?) opamps as the error amplifiers. Also note the use of asymmetric power supply rails.

This design almost certainly _cannot_ be built as shown, because
both the 2SA493 and 2SC1000 are long-extinct. It should therefore be regarded as being primarily of historical value, but also reflects a desire on my part to keep the records straight.

regards, jonathan carr
Attached Files
File Type: zip kaneda preamp #1 amp.gif.zip (23.5 KB, 866 views)
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Old 11th May 2005, 11:26 AM   #94
wmincy is offline wmincy  Malaysia
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Hey guys,

last week I complete the Kaneda phono stage preamp (as I have already build a tube line preamp). I put it in a shielding case with a seperated power supply.

Well, what can I say is it sounds great and sweat, it's incredible quiet . The noise and hums are originated mainly by tube preamp. Actually it's is still in warm up condition. I'm very satisfied about this!

I choosed 2sk30 as input, and the second stage I used 2sa970 (a well-known low-noise transistor), and for the output I replaced the obsolete one with 2sc3112. All transistors are matched with a tollerance of +- 1 hfe and shielded too.

The biasing and off-setting is a little bit complicated. Because there is no resistor at the output emittor so the bias and the off-set is somehow dependent one to the other. It takes quite long for adjustment, need much patient!

The next step for me is to upgrade the power supply: I should put a choke and more capacitors!! hehe .

Cheers

Mincy
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Old 18th May 2005, 02:09 PM   #95
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Default Adjusting the Kaneda Phono

Hello Mincy,

there are some tricks to do the adjustments:

first adjust the second stage or VAS (voltage amplifier stage) current so that the mathematical sum of voltages at the two output resistors of this stage is 1.2 Volts.

then adjust the first stage so that output offset before the output capacitor is about zero.

the trick is that the sum of voltages at the collector resistors of the second stage is (nearly) independant of the bias voltages. As you need 0.6 Volts to drive the output transistor for zero output DC bias, you need a total of 1.2 Volts, e.g. -3 Volts and +4.2 Volts would do the thing.

Don't mind a small asymmetry of 1 Volts or small bias lower than 1 Volt. The DC bias is very delicate: when you blow gently at the transistors, you will likely see a change in offset. There are no detectable sonic differences between perfect bias and symmetry and small imperfections.

best regards,
Hartmut from Munich
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Old 9th September 2006, 09:30 AM   #96
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HI
I would like to ask for help or some idea about the Caneda preamp.
I desiseded to give a try these famous preamp , so I made the pc boards and I purchase the parts what I could find or was avaleble in the stores were I used to purchase the parts .
For jet I purchase 2SK30A Y type unfortunatly I dont find the GR type .
Transistors 2SA872AE , I think these OK , and for the remaining transistor I purchased 2SC1312C ,unfortunatly only C type was avaleble no A type .
I want to build after the schematic from the Bonavolta website .
I would like to ask for help if I can use these parts , do I need to change some resistor value ect. I know there is a diferentsce beetwen the GR & Y type jet .
Thanks for any help and any comments .
Regards
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Old 9th September 2006, 12:28 PM   #97
wmincy is offline wmincy  Malaysia
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Hi Jeno,

nice choose!! try kaneda pre you won't regret it!! but don't stop here, do other pres to try different TASTE .

Those jfets and transistors fit well, the differences are unnoticeable, unless you use different components. Remember, as it is the most important, to match them: Id for jfet, HFE for transistor. Besides, earthing and shielding are very important, as phono signal is susceptible to disturb, so pay more attention.

After finished let us know your impression!!

Cheers

Mincy
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Old 11th September 2006, 07:35 PM   #98
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HI
Today I finnised the Kaneda preamp . Unfortunatly I have some ofset problem .On the output I have 1.8V dc volt .Then I adjusted to the minimum with the trimpot . I can increase up to 1.8V but decrease only 1.3-1.4v posible .
After these problem I tried to change the mosfets the 2SK30 to 2SK170 at one side .
Now on that side I get 0.9V on the output .
I would like to ask for help , I dont know how I bring done that ofsett close to 0V .
I was afraid to conect some sourse to test it if it works or not .
I tought to replace the 27K resistors but I'm not sure if that would resolve these problem.
I use 2x25V AC transformer , after the bridge I got around 37VDC .
Please if someone can help me , or have some idea please let me know .
Regards
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Old 13th September 2006, 08:12 AM   #99
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HI
Yestarday I manege to adjust the ofset close to 0V . After I replace the 100R trimpot with 470R.
I did the first listning test , the sound is warm , detaild I think is better than my SOZ . But I belive there is room for more improovment .
I would like to ask for some help , I dont know how to matche the SK30 JETs .That was the reason for the high ofset .
The transistors are fine , I matche the hFE close to 1%.
I would like to ask for help about how I can matche the jets or if some one know from were I can purchase matched pairs that wouldbe great to .
Any help or idea is welcolme .
Thanks
Regards
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Old 13th September 2006, 12:49 PM   #100
EUVL is offline EUVL  Europe
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For your info, you can find updated circuits from Kaneda (himself) in this book which contains very detailed building instructions, including drawings for mechanical parts :

http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/4...UTF8&s=gateway

The book can be ordered using its ASIN number :

ASIN: 441610300X


Patrick
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