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Wow!!

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AKSA

AKSA

Member
Joined 2001
aksaonline.com
Hi Gaetan,

Many thanks, it's on track but not the one. Comments like these are very telling:

So let’s flesh out this high-performance valve amplifier concept. First of all, let’s define high performance, in the valve context. If we do design a valve amplifier, it will need to deliver a total harmonic distortion of around 0.1%; or preferably .01%. That means we will be using negative feedback; in fact we will probably use "nested feedback" and lots of it, with a push-pull output stage. That concept will probably turn off more than half of the valve amplifier aficionados, since they have swallowed the nonsense from some hifi magazines that all feedback is anathema.
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They indicate an overarching contempt for those who like tube amps, and further show just how he would design such an amp - along precisely the same lines he uses for SS amps, which is just not appropriate.

It is the very harmonic coloration of tubes which people enjoy, and which in the hands of a good designer can be manipulated to produce something truly musical and soulful. Using NFB to radically reduce this 'distortion' tends to reduce a tube amp to the level of a good SS amp, or at least one with very low single tone, measured THD. Leo's concept of 'straight wire with gain' is so far off the track as I understand it, specifically wrt tube amps, that to me it indicates an alarming ignorance of the facts.

Cheers,

Hugh
 
G

gaetan8888

Member
Joined 2007
Hello Hugh

I think I have it, it was in october 2005, he is quite corosive against valve amp. Maby he never listen to a good valve amp.

http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_105324/article.html

It is quite another for someone listening to CDs to prefer the sound of a valve amplifier over modern solid-state hifi designs which DON’T suffer at all from high-order harmonic distortion.
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Wooow, where does he read that "solid-state hifi designs DON’T suffer at all from high-order harmonic distortion" !!

Or I misunderstand his text or he his far from understanding thd measurements and distortions spectrum...

Bye

Gaetan
 
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F

Francec

Banned
Joined 2006
Leo? Ah, no, we cannot deny him his opinions, smelly though they be. As you know, like you I'm most interested in SS, but I was enraged when I read his withering editorial about tube amplifiers. No one has the right to pour derision upon the choices of others just because they have a different opinion; the facts speak otherwise, there are many who would never deviate from their thermionic choice and good luck to them. Intolerance in any form, particularly from an influential soapbox like the editor's chair of Silicon Chip, is not on, and aside from being morally wrong is actually indefensible factually. The man is plain wrong, THD does NOT fully define the sound of an amp, and good tube amps can sound sublime. Just silliness really.
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Philosophically, this is known a relativism, ie, where everyone's opinion is valid. Relativism is dangerous, absurd and indefensible.
Unless there are objective measures, everything is equal and that is clearly untrue. I'm with Leo and he has a right to be derisive of the unsustainable.

Human beings actively engage in self-deception and this thread is full of it. The following post illustrates this beautifully;
"It is the very harmonic coloration of tubes which people enjoy, and which in the hands of a good designer can be manipulated to produce something truly musical and soulful."

Science is defined by objectivity. Valves are objectively far below the accuracy of reproduction SS offers. At least be honest to say that you prefer distorted sound.

Frank
 
J

Jen-B

Member
Joined 2010
Francec said:
Valves are objectively far below the accuracy of reproduction SS offers.

Frank
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Frank, congratulations on your objectively untrue statement!!!

If you look through historical reference material, journal published designs, and the internet you will find that there have been many valve circuits designed that have low objective distortion. Likewise many SS circuits with higher distortion.

Look here for a recently published low distortion valve amp http://www.audioamateurinc.com/digital/ax210/. The real position seems to be that both good and bad circuits can be constructed from both valves and solid state.

Any argument about which is 'best' is likely to tell you nothing about the technology, but a great deal about the mentality of those in the argument!!!

Be happy, enjoy the music, enjoy the hobby.

J.
 
F

Francec

Banned
Joined 2006
Jen,
As a general rule, and as you fully appreciate, SS designs have, on the whole, lower distortion of all types than valve designs. I can't argue that what you have said is incorrect but, generally, it isn't reflective of the vast majority of designs.
What is true is that most people like valves because they are not as accurate as SS and introduce their colouration to the sound.

(Geez, arguing with a pedantic, relativist isn't easy.) :)

Frank
 
Ronmeister

Ronmeister

Member
Joined 2007
Thanks Hugh!

Hi Hugh,

Congratulations on your own forum, it's certainly well-deserved... It does present me with a quandary, where should I post any further AKSA driven projects?

My “reference” system at the moment consists of your Lifeforce Amplifier, combined with a Philips / AudioNote CD player. The loudspeakers are a Fostex-Peerless-2-way, with a pair of Full Range ESLs in the works.

After owning top of the line “commercial” amplifiers I was, and still am to this day, blown away by the sonic qualities of your Amplifier as well as of course the service provided by you whilst building it.

I see you’re already the involuntary host of technical debates… just the way you like it!

Enjoy
 
F

Francec

Banned
Joined 2006
Andrew,
Hi Franec (sic),
I prefer the logic and reasoning present by Jen, It presents the variable nature of the technologies and the listener/testers.
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Any argument about which is 'best' is likely to tell you nothing about the technology, but a great deal about the mentality of those in the argument!!!
Be happy, enjoy the music, enjoy the hobby.
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What is does tell me is that what I first said is true, except people don't like it when it is pointed out.
Valve amps are, in general, inferior to SS but when designed in a particular way, produce a sound that some people prefer. At least Hugh was honest in saying so.
On other hand, I haven't built active 3 way speakers only to introduce a form of distortion that I like. If a CD is badly produced or the music is poorly played or is discordant, I will hear it; conversely, a good CD is an absolute joy.

Frank
 
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