I finally ordered the P1000E DIY Kanspea kit with FF105WK from Madisound as an entry into the full-range single-driver world, and decided to start this thread as a way of cataloging projects for this driver in case other potential builders might be interested.
(Was planning to select the FE103SOL based on the glowing user reports but it is sold out! Should have done it before the holidays! Arrrgh!)
Here is a list of potential projects I'd like to tackle, ordered so as to build woodworking skills cumulatively and to learn about the technical and sonic differences. If anyone could chime in on their suitability or adaptibility to the FF105WK, or suggest other enclosures not listed here, I'd greatly appreciate it.
* Factory-recommended BR enclosure
* Scott's Falcon Labyrinth TL
* Planet 10's mFonken and/or miniOnken?
* Scott's Vampyr-V
Interesting but plans not extensively documented or reported
* Floorstanders (pictures/plans not found)
* microTower/chubbyTower
Novelties and other ideas that might be fun at some point, but not priorities.
* M-10BS (video, pic -- still looking for plans)
* Stag-T10 (staggered double horn)
* Fostex robot-like thingy
Any other plans to consider?
Also any problems with the above?
Thanks!
(Was planning to select the FE103SOL based on the glowing user reports but it is sold out! Should have done it before the holidays! Arrrgh!)
Here is a list of potential projects I'd like to tackle, ordered so as to build woodworking skills cumulatively and to learn about the technical and sonic differences. If anyone could chime in on their suitability or adaptibility to the FF105WK, or suggest other enclosures not listed here, I'd greatly appreciate it.
* Factory-recommended BR enclosure
* Scott's Falcon Labyrinth TL
* Planet 10's mFonken and/or miniOnken?
* Scott's Vampyr-V
Interesting but plans not extensively documented or reported
* Floorstanders (pictures/plans not found)
* microTower/chubbyTower
Novelties and other ideas that might be fun at some point, but not priorities.
* M-10BS (video, pic -- still looking for plans)
* Stag-T10 (staggered double horn)
* Fostex robot-like thingy
Any other plans to consider?
Also any problems with the above?
Thanks!
BIB - bigger is better
https://speakerprojects.wordpress.com/cabinet-types/bib-loudspeakers/
I have the same Kanspea kit with the FF105 (I actually scored a pair of FE103 Sols a week ago, waiting for them to arrive). The 105 is a nice little driver. A bit laid back, but very enjoyable.
https://speakerprojects.wordpress.com/cabinet-types/bib-loudspeakers/
I have the same Kanspea kit with the FF105 (I actually scored a pair of FE103 Sols a week ago, waiting for them to arrive). The 105 is a nice little driver. A bit laid back, but very enjoyable.
A litre & a half larger than the largest enclosure i'd put them in.
We have a set of those, quite good.
We haven't actually built any of those yet, so can only extrapolate that they do what they should. The miniOnken is 0.3 litre larger than the standard millSize box so these should be close (except for the lower diffraction signature of the full-on miniOnkens). There are 5 variations total (at leat so far), 1 shrunken a bit.
We have a "facy" version of those, 1st built for the FE103En but they really shine with FF105. Being the biggest, have the best bass capability
That one escaped me, i'll have to draw it up. From the description an FF105wk version of a Pensil (L'Stylo 105). Our CNC guy has the protos of the L'Stylo 125 we built.
An end loaded ML-TL that exactly fits the format of the original EPI microTower. Likely quite good, but likely not as good as a design optimized for the FF105.
Essentially the same concept as the miniOnken.
I'd stay away from that one
Adaption of a Fostex recommended design, likely best called a Daline. Given the success (ie non-success) we have had with the Fostex designs i'd model the detail before building.
dave
Excellent! Thanks for the feedback, Dave. Would be interested to know if you find the l'stylo plans.
Ray21, I'm fascinated by BIBs and definitely plan to build one, but figured the 105 is not really suitable for a horn enclosure because it's Qts is above .40.
If you think the 105 would work well in a BIB horn then I'll add it to the list.
Ray21, I'm fascinated by BIBs and definitely plan to build one, but figured the 105 is not really suitable for a horn enclosure because it's Qts is above .40.
If you think the 105 would work well in a BIB horn then I'll add it to the list.
It isn't a case of finding the plans, they do not yet exist, but i will draw them (Scott gives all the info in his post)
dave
chrisb: I've admired the blue Vampyr many times. ;-) The size of the Vampyr might not be an issue. How far does it need to be from the back wall? Must it be placed in corners?
I listen across a 12 foot wide room, usually with a listening distance of about 8.5 feet. I doubt the Vampyrs are too small for that, but maybe there needs to be more distance for sound emanating from the mouths to converge?
Also, how necessary is the supra baffle? Is it something that can be added afterward?
Dave: thanks for offering to draw plans for L'Stylo. I found a picture of the one for ff125wk, and it looks really nice.
If you draw the ff105wk version, I promise to make it, but that might not be for another 2-3 months or so, as I'll likely need to practice on simpler builds first. I'm also finishing a 300B SET amp that needs modifications.
xrk971: Wow, that's an interesting little monitor. It looks like a trippy 1970s mainframe terminal made of marshmallow. I would have no idea how to fabricate something like that out of foam, and it's making me hungry. And now Kraftwerk is stuck in my head.
Looking around a little more. Would the ff105wk work in the FH3?
I listen across a 12 foot wide room, usually with a listening distance of about 8.5 feet. I doubt the Vampyrs are too small for that, but maybe there needs to be more distance for sound emanating from the mouths to converge?
Also, how necessary is the supra baffle? Is it something that can be added afterward?
Dave: thanks for offering to draw plans for L'Stylo. I found a picture of the one for ff125wk, and it looks really nice.
If you draw the ff105wk version, I promise to make it, but that might not be for another 2-3 months or so, as I'll likely need to practice on simpler builds first. I'm also finishing a 300B SET amp that needs modifications.
xrk971: Wow, that's an interesting little monitor. It looks like a trippy 1970s mainframe terminal made of marshmallow. I would have no idea how to fabricate something like that out of foam, and it's making me hungry. And now Kraftwerk is stuck in my head.
Looking around a little more. Would the ff105wk work in the FH3?
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That staggered horn is interesting. That FR plot is an excellent result:
I don't know if you're willing to consider running the 105 with a helper woofer. It is more of a brute force solution, but effective at getting the low end to balance the highs.
I gave it a shot:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/283083-horn-fast-timber.html
...in the link, I'm using another 4" driver, but the 105 also drove the the horn well / the horn boosts the 105's output <2kHz in almost exactly the same way.
Out of curiosity, how old are you? Have you listened to the driver yet? Has your wife? I'm interested to know how people with different levels of HF hearing loss react to the 7kHz peak these drivers have.
I'm a 40 yo male, and recent tests show about 10dB loss at 8kHz. My GF is a bit younger. I find the FF105WK fine on some material. My GF finds them grating on everything... and this makes perfect sense if she hears 7kHz at +5dB, compared to me.
I don't know if you're willing to consider running the 105 with a helper woofer. It is more of a brute force solution, but effective at getting the low end to balance the highs.
I gave it a shot:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/283083-horn-fast-timber.html
...in the link, I'm using another 4" driver, but the 105 also drove the the horn well / the horn boosts the 105's output <2kHz in almost exactly the same way.
Out of curiosity, how old are you? Have you listened to the driver yet? Has your wife? I'm interested to know how people with different levels of HF hearing loss react to the 7kHz peak these drivers have.
I'm a 40 yo male, and recent tests show about 10dB loss at 8kHz. My GF is a bit younger. I find the FF105WK fine on some material. My GF finds them grating on everything... and this makes perfect sense if she hears 7kHz at +5dB, compared to me.
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You could push it right up near the wall, no corner needed.
Should be fine.
Not at all. Yes.
Almost done.
Yes.
dave
Hi,
Solen in Canada sells them (4 in stock) and with the current $USD to $CDN exchange rate it's a nice deal at $65 USD + shipping (light drivers)
FE103-SOL8 - Solen Electronique - World leading producer of high-end crossover components
Maybe for a next project.
Rgds,
Eric
Thanks again for the efficient responses, Dave. I'm excited to embark on these building adventures.
e_fortier: Thanks for the tip! That is a good price for the -SOL. The budget is a little sensitive now but I might just have to spring for them.
Hollowboy: Thanks for the suggestions on the staggered horn and your FAST build. Will definitely look into those further.
I'll be 40 in August. My hearing hasn't been tested in many years, though I do notice hearing loss and a touch of tinnitus, probably stemming from many years of living in NYC and motorcycling without sufficient ear protection for the first couple of seasons.
e_fortier: Thanks for the tip! That is a good price for the -SOL. The budget is a little sensitive now but I might just have to spring for them.
Hollowboy: Thanks for the suggestions on the staggered horn and your FAST build. Will definitely look into those further.
I'll be 40 in August. My hearing hasn't been tested in many years, though I do notice hearing loss and a touch of tinnitus, probably stemming from many years of living in NYC and motorcycling without sufficient ear protection for the first couple of seasons.
Thank you so much, Dave. That design looks eminently feasible, so I'll put it near the front of the list. I'll probably make the factory recommended BR enclosure first, as a reference for appreciating the more refined designs of members here, and then do the Falcon, and then the L'Stylo. Then I'll carry the woodworking skills into (what appear to be) more complicated builds like the *onken family and Vampyr.
Hollowboy: I forgot to respond to your question about helper woofers. I'll wait to hear how these speakers sound in my main system, but at some point I'll be interested in making a pair of small subs to integrate them with. Sometimes I listen to large symphony (Mahler, Dvorjak, Beethoven) or complex, electronically inflected music (Atlas Sound, Beck, Besnard Lakes), so the idea would be for the subs to extend the stereo image and the frequency down into, say, the 30Hz range, but with all of the detail, translucency, tone, and spaciousness that's required to give complete voice to those lower register instruments. I'm not into bone-shaking bass, but I like it where it counts.
If nothing else, it would be a neat way to learn crossover design, since the subs would probably have active amps with adjustable frequency response, and there'd probably be no sense in making the ff105wk do the low-frequency work it's not designed for, freeing it up to sing the mids and highs.
Hollowboy: I forgot to respond to your question about helper woofers. I'll wait to hear how these speakers sound in my main system, but at some point I'll be interested in making a pair of small subs to integrate them with. Sometimes I listen to large symphony (Mahler, Dvorjak, Beethoven) or complex, electronically inflected music (Atlas Sound, Beck, Besnard Lakes), so the idea would be for the subs to extend the stereo image and the frequency down into, say, the 30Hz range, but with all of the detail, translucency, tone, and spaciousness that's required to give complete voice to those lower register instruments. I'm not into bone-shaking bass, but I like it where it counts.
If nothing else, it would be a neat way to learn crossover design, since the subs would probably have active amps with adjustable frequency response, and there'd probably be no sense in making the ff105wk do the low-frequency work it's not designed for, freeing it up to sing the mids and highs.
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The core box is rectilinear panels that I added a radiused edge baffle to. You might be looking at Jeshi's EVM box if you are thinking marshmallow. Mine can be made with conventional ply.
If you made it out of ply, it would be a rectangular box with two internal dividers that serve as self bracing. My foam core uses lots of bracing which is not required if making out of half in ply for example.
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The Kanspeas arrived today and are starting to break in. At first the drivers sounded thin and nasal but, on the desktop, gave a somewhat unsettling 3D image. It's kind of intense and I was impressed. Now they're on top of my main speakers playing my phone through the little 5W amp that came with them.
Untitled by jeffdrouin on Flickr
A little over an hour on these drivers and they already sound more natural and open. They're very fast and detailed. Bass extension is definitely improving. Simpler music with more pure tones, as opposed to, say, heavily distorted guitar, sound better. Been listening to a Stereolab channel on Pandora, so bands like Yo La Tengo and Broadcast are coming on and they sound really nice given the bad quality of the source. Synthesizers, organs, acoustic guitar and especially female vocal sound best, as well as higher pitched metallic percussion like chimes (wow!). Tomorrow I'll play some CDs through the headphone jack on my SS amp.
I definitely get the single driver, no crossover thing now. The coherence and presence is wonderful. I can't wait to get these drivers into a good enclosure.
Since I'm already listening to a Fostex BR cabinet, I'm going to make the Falcon first, then L'Stylo, then some kind of *onken. And then, if my skills are up for it, the Vampyr-V.
Untitled by jeffdrouin on Flickr
A little over an hour on these drivers and they already sound more natural and open. They're very fast and detailed. Bass extension is definitely improving. Simpler music with more pure tones, as opposed to, say, heavily distorted guitar, sound better. Been listening to a Stereolab channel on Pandora, so bands like Yo La Tengo and Broadcast are coming on and they sound really nice given the bad quality of the source. Synthesizers, organs, acoustic guitar and especially female vocal sound best, as well as higher pitched metallic percussion like chimes (wow!). Tomorrow I'll play some CDs through the headphone jack on my SS amp.
I definitely get the single driver, no crossover thing now. The coherence and presence is wonderful. I can't wait to get these drivers into a good enclosure.
Since I'm already listening to a Fostex BR cabinet, I'm going to make the Falcon first, then L'Stylo, then some kind of *onken. And then, if my skills are up for it, the Vampyr-V.
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