I think someone maybe JW sent me some files for the boards.
As I've not done this before (making boards), I was worried about
making ten sets of boards then getting stuck with a bunch of stuff
that I don't know what to do with.
There is always the ubiquitous shove it where the sun don't shine,
I'm too old for that.
I'm not having much luck potty training
my two year old. I spend lots of time running around cleaning
up her wee wee ponds. Carpet, bed, toy box, where ever and what
even. Explaining it too her worked about 1/2 the first day.
When I got my puppy at 7 weeks, she only peed once and was trained.
Go figure.
I posted and asked but no one seemed to have any.
Terry suggested I do the honey badger, I really wanted to do the
amp in the CFA topology that is why the K-C. I really didn't want
to do a bunch of different amps.
I'ts unclear to me when I have the KC board what other parts will
work with it? I've read about some folks spending money on heat
sinks etc and they won't work for what ever reason. Then, they've
got to buy more.
The KC board isn't on heat sinks, that requires I guess the
OPS boards, one for each side...
Don't mind me I'm whining here.
Maybe my biggest concern is that since I've not listened to
any of these amps...I don't want to spend a whole lot of time
on it only to end up with something that sounds sterile and give's
me a headache.
I am not saying that these amps from OS sound that way,
but that is a concern.
I've gone to shows, stores, listened, etc. I've not been fond of much
of what is out there, doesn't matter if tube or solid state.
At one of the shows' they highlighted much tube gear.
That show to me was a big disappointment. All the stuff
sounded the same with an abnormal, bloom/emphasis in
the mid range, didn't matter the source as CD, Vinyl etc.
I can say the exception was Pete Millet's stuff, it sounded
good, but it might have been the open dipole speakers
or all the electronic wizardry he had for a source I don't know.
My own system has the same problem also.
I can't point to what causes it but that bloom term
makes sense.
It's like a sphere of mids...a bubble of mids seems to be coming
at you with a de-emphisis of bass and thin highs.
Maybe I just need to turn it on and let it run more.
Or change out my pre amp and CD player.
Or find an FM station that sounds good.
In the mean time I'm open to ideas.
OS I'll look around for the leach amps...to be used as donor chassis i presume?
*********** If your stomach is weak don't read the following ***********
So while I"m typing this and thinking, little baby girl is listening to
her kiddy stuff on her baby potty. Good I"m thinking.
So she just runs up to me saying Yukky...yuk, yuk.
I turn and look to hopefully see a gift for me in
her potty. Alas, she got off the potty to due her
duty for Daddy...on the floor in front of the baby potty.
The Joy's of Fatherhood.
OS - you want to send me an amp to listen to for a bit?
Can you also send me a jar of that berry stuff y'all brew
over there too? I might could use a nip or two or three
right about now.
Sounding "sterile" is not the headache maker.
An unstable or "ringing" amp , or excessive odd harmonics (H3/5/7) .. maybe ?
(below) I want to give the option of MOSFET or BJT (Circled-below) , so if
one thinks BJT's give headaches , let em' do the IRFP's .
A or B will be either the big drivers for a EF3 BJT or small drivers for IRFP FET's. Predrivers will have 2 SMD pads to bridge , like JK's "wolverine".
The PASS 150.5 , 250.5 series of output stages was much a inspiration
for the track layout and local decoupling. The original slew OPS was pretty
close ..... just added a few further touches.
All the "fat" traces are double sided for 32.5 A Imax !!!
PS - does somebody have the IRFP schema ? So I don't have to search !
OS
Attachments
VFET Slewmaster http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...nt-end-going-high-tech-smd-6.html#post4267802 Post 56
Thanks , jeff !
I see Val just used a 12V zener without the plain diode in series with it.
A zener has a lot of leakage/noise before conduction , adding the forward
diode will just have the IRFP gates seeing the standard diode's reverse
leakage ... (better).
-added 33p B-C shunts on the driver stage.
We can use a faster TO-220 (1837/4793 toshiba), as well.
Much less Ic with 1K Re .....
-red led at main Vbe.
-and scaled the "range" resistor at the bias trimmer.
This will be GOOD !!!
OS
Sounding "sterile" is not the headache maker.
An unstable or "ringing" amp , or excessive odd harmonics (H3/5/7) .. maybe ?
(below) I want to give the option of MOSFET or BJT (Circled-below) , so if
one thinks BJT's give headaches , let em' do the IRFP's .
A or B will be either the big drivers for a EF3 BJT or small drivers for IRFP FET's. Predrivers will have 2 SMD pads to bridge , like JK's "wolverine".
The PASS 150.5 , 250.5 series of output stages was much a inspiration
for the track layout and local decoupling. The original slew OPS was pretty
close ..... just added a few further touches.
All the "fat" traces are double sided for 32.5 A Imax !!!
PS - does somebody have the IRFP schema ? So I don't have to search !
OS
OS, I'm still confused-so I have a few questions.
1) Is the board you're showing above a complete amplifier board with or without the Krypton-C input stage?
2) Where can I purchase the boards or are Gerber/Sprint files available?
3) There are no component values on the board, so how do you know which component goes where?
4) Is there a BOM for the BJT version?
5) Can you use only a single pair of outputs with this board?
Thanks...
OS, I'm still confused-so I have a few questions.
1) Is the board you're showing above a complete amplifier board with or without the Krypton-C input stage?
2) Where can I purchase the boards or are Gerber/Sprint files available?
3) There are no component values on the board, so how do you know which component goes where?
4) Is there a BOM for the BJT version?
5) Can you use only a single pair of outputs with this board?
Thanks...
Looks like that is a new layout for the OPS. You will still need to use the IPS of your choice. OS usually posts the Sprint file once he is finished. Gerbers can be created from the Sprint files. You will probably need to create your own BOM from the schematic depending which "version" of OPS you choose. If you want to use just one pair of outputs, your would be better off using the original "Baby slew" OPS that is designed for two pairs. One of the reasons for this new design is to spread out the outputs. Now an issue with one or two pairs.
OS,
I didn't mean to put those with BJTs which is not what I meant.
Sterile and Headache are two "challenges" I have with
music reproduction gear, i.e. stereos and PAs, etc.
I Don't have enough experience with solid state gear to know
what a BJT or a MOSFET sounds like.
An ex acquaintance of mine used to make tube and solid state
amps, pre amps etc. He made one solid state amp that I really
liked. I've got no idea what it was or who ended up with it.
He liked to just make one thing and then do something else.
Sounding sterile is using the wrong caps, wrong resistors,
and wrong settings. I won't get into that debate, if you've
fooled around with this stuff long enough you know what
I'm talking about, if you can hear things.
The reason why I got interested in test gear was to try to identify
the quality of "feeling" or "soul" I was able to give music instrument
amplifiers.
The solid state world is so fricking vast and different
I'm still trying to learn, what most of you have forgotten.
I'm starting to understand small bit and pieces though.
In the mean time, trying to figure out how to build one of
the slew's or honey badger etc...I got lost just trying to
figure out what I needed and how to build the K-C.
So, I figured I'd get an old McIntosh MC250 50W per channel
first gen solid state amp working.
Go figure...I'm still trying to find parts
and many aren't $.10 transistors.
Then I want to try a K-C with the DC servo etc.
Right now it takes me a very long time to accomplishing
much due to circumstances beyond my control. Maybe
they are in control but I don't recognize, heck I don't know.
I'm just doing the best I can with what I have...
...and sometimes that means I feel like,
for lack of a better term, a special needs guy.
I keep trying and hopefully some of the
good MOJO will come my way.
OR
good Kharma.
It's tough for a beginner... every term, acronyn, initialism,
slang, short term, abbreviation, etc. I've got to go find it
and try to figure out what you mean.
It would be different if you worked in a shop, lab, repair and
design facility most of your life and have that specialized
education, training, experience, skills and knowledge,
whether formal or hard knocks.
In the mean time, I'm chasing parts
and trying to figure out what to do next.
Thanks for the bandwidth.
I didn't mean to put those with BJTs which is not what I meant.
Sterile and Headache are two "challenges" I have with
music reproduction gear, i.e. stereos and PAs, etc.
I Don't have enough experience with solid state gear to know
what a BJT or a MOSFET sounds like.
An ex acquaintance of mine used to make tube and solid state
amps, pre amps etc. He made one solid state amp that I really
liked. I've got no idea what it was or who ended up with it.
He liked to just make one thing and then do something else.
Sounding sterile is using the wrong caps, wrong resistors,
and wrong settings. I won't get into that debate, if you've
fooled around with this stuff long enough you know what
I'm talking about, if you can hear things.
The reason why I got interested in test gear was to try to identify
the quality of "feeling" or "soul" I was able to give music instrument
amplifiers.
The solid state world is so fricking vast and different
I'm still trying to learn, what most of you have forgotten.
I'm starting to understand small bit and pieces though.
In the mean time, trying to figure out how to build one of
the slew's or honey badger etc...I got lost just trying to
figure out what I needed and how to build the K-C.
So, I figured I'd get an old McIntosh MC250 50W per channel
first gen solid state amp working.
Go figure...I'm still trying to find parts
and many aren't $.10 transistors.
Then I want to try a K-C with the DC servo etc.
Right now it takes me a very long time to accomplishing
much due to circumstances beyond my control. Maybe
they are in control but I don't recognize, heck I don't know.
I'm just doing the best I can with what I have...
...and sometimes that means I feel like,
for lack of a better term, a special needs guy.
I keep trying and hopefully some of the
good MOJO will come my way.
OR
good Kharma.
It's tough for a beginner... every term, acronyn, initialism,
slang, short term, abbreviation, etc. I've got to go find it
and try to figure out what you mean.
It would be different if you worked in a shop, lab, repair and
design facility most of your life and have that specialized
education, training, experience, skills and knowledge,
whether formal or hard knocks.
In the mean time, I'm chasing parts
and trying to figure out what to do next.
Thanks for the bandwidth.
Thanks still for the reply.
After looking over quite a few posts here, am I correct in assuming that "OPS" stands for output stage and "IPS" stands for input stage?
So you're suggesting that I use the "Baby Slew" board for the output stage and then I'll need a Krypton-C board for the input stage of the amplifier?
Still, I notice that you build a LOT of amplifiers.
So have you personally tried the Krypton-C input stage or any other of the input stages?
If so, how would you characterize/summarize their sound?
Personally, I'm looking for something that is a little more forward of neutral in the mids but without the harshness in the highs that I've heard from a lot Class D amps. That may not make any sense to you.
After looking over quite a few posts here, am I correct in assuming that "OPS" stands for output stage and "IPS" stands for input stage?
So you're suggesting that I use the "Baby Slew" board for the output stage and then I'll need a Krypton-C board for the input stage of the amplifier?
Still, I notice that you build a LOT of amplifiers.
So have you personally tried the Krypton-C input stage or any other of the input stages?
If so, how would you characterize/summarize their sound?
Personally, I'm looking for something that is a little more forward of neutral in the mids but without the harshness in the highs that I've heard from a lot Class D amps. That may not make any sense to you.
OS, I'm still confused-so I have a few questions.
1) Is the board you're showing above a complete amplifier board with or without the Krypton-C input stage?
2) Where can I purchase the boards or are Gerber/Sprint files available?
3) There are no component values on the board, so how do you know which component goes where?
4) Is there a BOM for the BJT version?
5) Can you use only a single pair of outputs with this board?
Thanks...
This new board -
1 - This is a complete OUTPUT STAGE. Fully compatible with all finalized
input stages.
2 - We will get to that , I have to finish it first.
3- with this one , I will lable , tell how to make a 3 or 5 pair BJT or
mosfet output stage.
4- Not only a BOM for both BJT/FET .... But i'm going to make a "BOOK" for
this one. It will be my 'crowning achievement" for the slewmasters !!
5- You can use 1 pair (what a waste), 2 pair (positions 2+4 or 1/5), 3 pair (1/3/5)
4 pair (1/2 and 4/5) , or all 5 pair. 2 pair would distribute the heat to each
end of the heatsink , the positions can be spread apart as needed with
a 250-300mm heatsink (3U to 5U). Much better thermals than the typical
DIY project.
I'm on 2 days with this one ... one more (almost finished) .... the perfect
output stage.
Edit - starting to look like a JK creation !
OS
Attachments
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Hi Sinc and ammel,
It's not unusual for someone to see a thread that is interesting and that has a few thousand post and want to join in with hopes that someone will save them from reading back through the thread. If you want to read a smaller thread try looking through the [URL="http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/260268-slewmaster-builds.htmlslewmaster-builds[/URL] thread. It is much shorter and mainly deals with building the various IPS and OPS boards. The "baby Slew" board is dealt with there. It is basically the same as the 5p OPS but shortened and just has locations for two pair. It's good for about +-50V rails. The Krypton-C is the "latest" IPS and maybe "measures" the fastest, I'm not sure. I built it on boards I received from Jeff Wilhelm. He did the layout and gerbers for it. I'm sure he would kindly offer them for use to order boards if you like. As far as sound goes, it is my opinion that all of the IPS that OS has offered are so good that you can not "hear" a difference between them. You can however see some subtle differences on a scope and I believe that my mentor Thimios has been able to show some differences in harmonics on his equipment.
There was a group buy offered by jkuetamann for many of the boards and several of us bought them. He has since stopped offering boards for sale but has posted up the gerbers for all of the ones he designed so anyone can order them for themselves.
The build thread is still active and a good place to ask questions. This thread is and should be more for OS to post his new creations.
Hope this helps.
Blessings, Terry
It's not unusual for someone to see a thread that is interesting and that has a few thousand post and want to join in with hopes that someone will save them from reading back through the thread. If you want to read a smaller thread try looking through the [URL="http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/260268-slewmaster-builds.htmlslewmaster-builds[/URL] thread. It is much shorter and mainly deals with building the various IPS and OPS boards. The "baby Slew" board is dealt with there. It is basically the same as the 5p OPS but shortened and just has locations for two pair. It's good for about +-50V rails. The Krypton-C is the "latest" IPS and maybe "measures" the fastest, I'm not sure. I built it on boards I received from Jeff Wilhelm. He did the layout and gerbers for it. I'm sure he would kindly offer them for use to order boards if you like. As far as sound goes, it is my opinion that all of the IPS that OS has offered are so good that you can not "hear" a difference between them. You can however see some subtle differences on a scope and I believe that my mentor Thimios has been able to show some differences in harmonics on his equipment.
There was a group buy offered by jkuetamann for many of the boards and several of us bought them. He has since stopped offering boards for sale but has posted up the gerbers for all of the ones he designed so anyone can order them for themselves.
The build thread is still active and a good place to ask questions. This thread is and should be more for OS to post his new creations.
Hope this helps.
Blessings, Terry
Congratulation OS for finaly decided to go for FETs too in your ouput stages.
Now your amazing project, never seen before, is complete on my point of view:
A set of input/power stages to can build any combinations of prefered technologies and powers class AB amplifier in order to can build his own whatever our preferences.
The occasion to get a real idea of the characters and advantages/ inconvenients of both feedback schemes and BJT/FET differences, if Any.
Now your amazing project, never seen before, is complete on my point of view:
A set of input/power stages to can build any combinations of prefered technologies and powers class AB amplifier in order to can build his own whatever our preferences.
The occasion to get a real idea of the characters and advantages/ inconvenients of both feedback schemes and BJT/FET differences, if Any.
Now, a suggestion ? A symmetrical input board, CFA, with the best VAS you have, that could be set in VFA as well (thanks to symmetry).
I believe it can be doable ?
Advantages:
To can use-it in symetrical professional environements with the common mode rejection of noise it offers...
- To can compare the two topologies in listening, everything else equal.
- To can have benefit in CFA of the better PSRR at low frequencies that long tailed pair offers.
I believe it can be doable ?
Advantages:
To can use-it in symetrical professional environements with the common mode rejection of noise it offers...
- To can compare the two topologies in listening, everything else equal.
- To can have benefit in CFA of the better PSRR at low frequencies that long tailed pair offers.
Like a bridge amp ? Two of these boards on a tunnel heatsink bridged
at 60V rails /MT-200's would be >1000W.
Two Heatsink USA 300mm extrusions bolted together with a high-output
140mm PC fan a blowin' through them would give a 1Kw pro amp
for <200USD$.
Easily "doable" , but it would really "shine" driving one of those "ultimax"
dayton 18" 's. Just one slew @ 4R would drive it nicely (and destroy the china),
OS
Attachments
Two pair is certainly what I would go with. I'll wait until you get this board like you want it and hold off on the "Baby Slew" board since I'm in no hurry.
Insert evil laughter.... I will want one if for nothing else then to scare the neighbors driving horn loaded subs.
E
Hi Terry,
Thank you for the detailed reply!
I may be a little late to the party so to speak, but I'm not asking anyone to save me from doing a little(okay maybe a lot?) reading.
I'm just trying to learn the basics about all of OS's input and output stages.
I wasn't aware there was another thread about building all these amplifiers. I'll post future questions over in that thread.
Thanks again,
Ammel
Ahhh,
That will be sweet. Thinking I will do the 3 pair. 1/3/5 locations.
That should be just fine.
In the mean time I have to find JWs files again. Somewhere here
I think JW posted the cap values..which I put into excel and returned.
I don't know if he got them as I never heard back. You just can't take
that web page and order...you have to do all the data entry all over again.
You can do it with excel spreadsheet and specify how it's delimited.
I think...I didn't order anything.
Thanks Terry, it's beginning to make sense as this is kind of the
development thread and the other is the actual build thread.
It's good when folk "Splain" it for us. Always state the obvious
in my book.
Maybe OS can post that on the first pages which would help
lesson the confusion.
Just leave it to me to muddy up the waters. : )
Our chemical world is a wonderful thing...
...unless you are exposed to them.
I don't recall receiving any spreadsheets on caps but here is the list for the Kypton-C and Slewmaster output board again.
C101 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C102 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C103 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C104 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C105 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C106 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C107 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C108 505-MKS21/100/10 1yF Metallized Polyester
C109 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C110 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C111 647-UPS2A470MPD 47uF electrolytic
C112 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C113 647-UPS2A470MPD 47uF electrolytic
C114 505-MKS4.68/100/10P
C115-C124 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C125 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C126 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C127 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C128 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C129 505-MKS4.1/100/10P .1uF PET
C1 505-MKS4C044705BKSSD 4.7uF PET
C2 505-FKP2150/100/5 150pF Polypropylene
C3 647-UFW2A101MPD 100uF 100V Audio grade electrolytic
C4 647-UFW2A101MPD 100uF 100V Audio grade electrolytic
C5 505-MKP20.1/100/5 .1uF Polypropylene
C6 505-MKP20.1/100/5 .1uF Polypropylene
C7 647-UKA1H102MHD 1000uF 50V Audio grade electrolytic
C8 647-UKA1H102MHD 1000uF 50V Audio grade electrolytic
C9 505-MKS2.47/100/10 .47uF Polyester
C10 505-MKS2.47/100/10 .47uF Polyester
C11 80-C320C104K1R 1.uF MLCC X7R
C12 80-C320C104K1R 1.uF MLCC X7R
C13 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C14 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C101 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C102 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C103 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C104 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C105 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C106 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C107 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C108 505-MKS21/100/10 1yF Metallized Polyester
C109 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C110 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C111 647-UPS2A470MPD 47uF electrolytic
C112 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C113 647-UPS2A470MPD 47uF electrolytic
C114 505-MKS4.68/100/10P
C115-C124 647-UBT2A220MPD 22uF high temp electrolityc
C125 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C126 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C127 647-UPW2A471MHD 470uF High temp electrolytic
C128 80-C320C104K1R .1uF MLCC X7R
C129 505-MKS4.1/100/10P .1uF PET
C1 505-MKS4C044705BKSSD 4.7uF PET
C2 505-FKP2150/100/5 150pF Polypropylene
C3 647-UFW2A101MPD 100uF 100V Audio grade electrolytic
C4 647-UFW2A101MPD 100uF 100V Audio grade electrolytic
C5 505-MKP20.1/100/5 .1uF Polypropylene
C6 505-MKP20.1/100/5 .1uF Polypropylene
C7 647-UKA1H102MHD 1000uF 50V Audio grade electrolytic
C8 647-UKA1H102MHD 1000uF 50V Audio grade electrolytic
C9 505-MKS2.47/100/10 .47uF Polyester
C10 505-MKS2.47/100/10 .47uF Polyester
C11 80-C320C104K1R 1.uF MLCC X7R
C12 80-C320C104K1R 1.uF MLCC X7R
C13 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
C14 598-CD15ED330JO3F 33pF Silver Mica
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