So, you're not a fan for NZ wines - or intensely flavoured wines of any variety, it appears,
. Sorry, NZ wines are that way because of soil and climate, it's the way they come out naturally. Of course, every chap up the road in that part of he world is happily churning out SB, because it is the "flavour of the month" - NZer's are very good at making hay while the sun shines ... - so, some of the stuff won't be too brilliant for the money. For NZ, only look at SB and Pinot Noir - anything else, like Chardonnay or Cabernet, pretty mediocre, at the moment ...Talking of local character, there's a winery on the NSW coast, further north - and every wine has a strong floral character, whether it's white, red, whatever; you're always drinking flowers - a bit much, for me at least ...
SY weren't you the guy who used to say 'don't feed the trolls'. What happened
Jan
I don't think Esperado is a troll. He's actually picked up a soldering iron and drawn schematics.
It's actually a combination of a cultured yeast and an artificial enzyme package. Easy to recognize, very industrial.
Sorry Frank, as you see we can all be fooled. Try it sometime, ask the winemaker if he uses the indigenous wild yeasts, let me guess he will either tell you that you can't do that or the product would not be controllably consistent.
BTW "flavory wines" are usually a fake product no matter where they are from.
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Ahh, those Austrian white wines I had decades ago, over there, at a winery of a friend of the family circle, which had intensely grapey character were also a fake? Gee, every interesting wine is a fake - what a shame ...
So, that trail of extremely boring, and expensive Burgundy wines I went on years ago was the real deal - wine is meant to be tedious ... well, you learn something new every day ...
So, that trail of extremely boring, and expensive Burgundy wines I went on years ago was the real deal - wine is meant to be tedious ... well, you learn something new every day ...
Thank-you, Jan, nice one, i appreciate :-(SY weren't you the guy who used to say 'don't feed the trolls'. What happened
This said, to have been so often disappointed on the long run by some of my own mixs, fooled by a studio's listening chain or the acoustic of the mixing room, (oh, some of those studios were famous), i cannot understand what my eyes or any label on some gear or component is doing in this listening story. Blind or not.
How SY can have the slightest idea of my way to listen, my culture about the musical instruments, mics, mixing desks, all what gives a color to the sound that i can appreciate, compare, remember ?
All those instruments witch were my family during decades ? (You now, faces you immediately recognize in a crowd, or not if they are disguised ?).
You know, the ease to follow and recognize an instrument in the background that i had listened in solo so many times during the recording session and the mix ?
One thing i'm sure, because we don't have the same life story, we don't listen to the same things and the same way.
And, about my own samples, blind or not, that i know better than he the way i wanted them to be heard.
BTW: I don't even understand his citation in signature: i feel exactly the opposite.
Troll ? Are-we not here to exchange points of views ?
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The reality of things is always a bit more complex than a simple, throwaway line - Feral versus domesticated yeasts | Winophilia
Ahh, those Austrian white wines I had decades ago, over there, at a winery of a friend of the family circle, which had intensely grapey character were also a fake? Gee, every interesting wine is a fake - what a shame ...
So, that trail of extremely boring, and expensive Burgundy wines I went on years ago was the real deal - wine is meant to be tedious ... well, you learn something new every day ...
It's a matter of personal taste why belabor it? Unless we sit at the same table with the same experience it is a waste of time discussing it. I hope you were drinking Austrian wine outside the anti-freeze scandal.
Hang in there, Esperado. I trust my own ears as well.
I think that the belief that nobody can trust their ears does little good, and is just part of a 'fad' much like Freudian Psychology was in the '50's and '60's. It went away gradually, and I think this will also. It just doesn't show reality as we live it, but 'listening tests' can always be made to 'prove' it when necessary.
I think that the belief that nobody can trust their ears does little good, and is just part of a 'fad' much like Freudian Psychology was in the '50's and '60's. It went away gradually, and I think this will also. It just doesn't show reality as we live it, but 'listening tests' can always be made to 'prove' it when necessary.
So many scandals in the "old world" winemaking areas - people get lazy, they're only in it for the money - once enthusiasm falls out of the equation, whatever keeps the customer satisfied ...
I do agree that the "same table" experience is essential, once a certain point in the discussion is reached - apples and apples, etc.
Did you read it? The comments from a couple of the French winemakers go with my experience. Remember you are entitled to YOUR opinion. Note the comments from d"Arnenberg.
Please realize that what I consider fake tastes are perfectly enjoyable tastes to many people even me at times. Consider vanillin vs real vanilla there are times when you just don't get bent about it.
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Which is why the best technique is to deliberately push the equipment to produce easily heard flaws - the latter are certainly "wrong" to the ears, stand out easily; once the character of that flaw has been exposed, by making it obvious, then your hearing can tune into lower levels of its presence, you can pick the misbehaviour every time ...
Yes, the key word is "complexity". That huge line of Burgundy wines I sampled, over there, suffered from precisely two things: a lack of complexity, and, every wine tasted like the next - it was a waste of an hour.
Drinking wine should be an enjoyable experience, otherwise why waste money on it? Often enough, I have a wine that bowls me with over in the consuming of it, because of the depth of that experience - makes all the drinking of the average fare worth while, because that special moment comes upon one unexpectedly ...
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Oh, may-be i understand the reason of all this controversy.
I need to listen several time several musical samples on the both gears i want to compare.
I need to concentrate on different details, one after the other. Because i'm not always able to get instant all the landscape details, if they are subtle and thin.
I need to know which is witch to correlate (or not) my feelings, little by little until i have a clear impression that i can describe with no doubt.
All that, because i'm human, unsure, slow, suspicious about my own feelings, in order to have a solid and verified conclusion about each of their own character. Labeled A & B, or any famous names, behind a black curtain or not, it makes no difference to me.
But i need to 'peek', as well as you need to differentiate your two glasses of wine and never change their respective position.
And, believe-me or not, it can help me to see the device, because i can put a visage on it, less abstract than an illuminated number on a black curtain.
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